Attention whore announcement; Update decision made, Can you guess what it is?

[Torie]

Update: Before you read below, what is your guess as to my final decision as to my vote choice for POTUS? 

I am now an undecided voter in the Presidential race. Tonight's debate might be key. I should be in the Luntz focus group.

I am concerned that McCain is too ill informed and too intellectually lazy to handle well the complex financial issues facing this nation.  His proposal to pay face for toxic mortgages (instead of paying slightly more than fair market value and require the holders to mark to market if they don't sell (ie the carrot and the stick), as part of a plan to rewrite the mortgages, thereby giving a huge subsidy to the perp holders, is just simply insane, and he doesn't seem to realize what he did. Also, having learned more about his health insurance plan, it is not too well thought through. Degrading the risk pools vis a vis removing the tax incentive for employer plans, is not replaced with anything coherent as to how to deal with folks with pre-existing medical conditions. There may well be a fix, but the point is that McCain just doesn't ask enough questions, or do his homework.

In short, Obama is a risky scheme, but McCain may well be riskier. Treasury bonds are far better than both.

[Lunar]

Well, to be fair, I'm not sure how much of a presidential candidate's "economic plan" is going to come into existence.  This sort of plan is written more by campaign strategists than economic experts, while the plans that come into existence will be written by the latter.

[Torie]

Well, to be fair, I'm not sure how much of a presidential candidate's "economic plan" is going to come into existence.  This sort of plan is written more by campaign strategists than economic experts, while the plans that come into existence will be written by the latter.

Ya, but McCain appears to know not what he does, or care much that he doesn't. That is not the kind of president I want making complex decisions. Relying like a lamb on the experts, well, puts too much power and reliance on the experts, who in any event have a range of opinions. We already tried that approach with Dubya. You remember him don't you - the guy with the funny accent who can't enunciate his way out of a paper bag?

[minionofmidas]

Well, to be fair, I'm not sure how much of a presidential candidate's "economic plan" is going to come into existence.  This sort of plan is written more by campaign strategists than economic experts, while the plans that come into existence will be written by the latter.

Ya, but McCain appears to know not what he does, or care much that he doesn't. That is not the kind of president I want making complex decisions. Relying like a lamb on the experts, well, puts too much power and reliance on the experts, who in any event have a range of opinions. We already tried that approach with Dubya. You remember him don't you - the guy with the funny accent who can't enunciate his way out of a paper bag?

Nope. Can't recall him.




I think it's called "denial".

[JSojourner]

I am now an undecided voter in the Presidential race. Tonight's debate might be key. I should be in the Luntz focus group.

I am concerned that McCain is too ill informed and too intellectually lazy to handle well the complex financial issues facing this nation.  His proposal to pay face for toxic mortgages (instead of paying slightly more than fair market value and require the holders to mark to market if they don't sell (ie the carrot and the stick), as part of a plan to rewrite the mortgages, thereby giving a huge subsidy to the perp holders, is just simply insane, and he doesn't seem to realize what he did. Almost, having learned more about his health insurance plan, it is not too well thought through. Degrading the risk pools vis a vis removing the inventive for employer plans, is not replaced with anything coherent as to how to deal with folks with pre-existing medical conditions. Their may well be a fix, but the point is that McCain just doesn't ask enough questions, or do his homework.

In short, Obama is a risky scheme, but McCain may well be riskier. Treasury bonds are far better than both.

However you end up voting, I know you'll be one of the best-informed people at the polls.  I seriously think you should run for office, Torie.

Let us know what you decide.  And remember, if neither candidate fits...there's always Cynthia McKinney. 

[Lunar]

Well, to be fair, I'm not sure how much of a presidential candidate's "economic plan" is going to come into existence.  This sort of plan is written more by campaign strategists than economic experts, while the plans that come into existence will be written by the latter.

Ya, but McCain appears to know not what he does, or care much that he doesn't. That is not the kind of president I want making complex decisions. Relying like a lamb on the experts, well, puts too much power and reliance on the experts, who in any event have a range of opinions. We already tried that approach with Dubya. You remember him don't you - the guy with the funny accent who can't enunciate his way out of a paper bag?

Well, it's not exactly a news flash that McCain might be intellectually lazy about all things besides leadership and foreign policy.  That's been kind of obvious ever since he started announcing that he doesn't know much about economics but he's willing to learn, and his disdain for the religious right.

Obama's primarily interested in foreign policy too, as far as what his passion is, but I suspect he is deeply interested in the economic problems too, at least now that there's a crisis.

[Fmr. Pres. Duke]

I am now an undecided voter in the Presidential race. Tonight's debate might be key. I should be in the Luntz focus group.

I am concerned that McCain is too ill informed and too intellectually lazy to handle well the complex financial issues facing this nation.  His proposal to pay face for toxic mortgages (instead of paying slightly more than fair market value and require the holders to mark to market if they don't sell (ie the carrot and the stick), as part of a plan to rewrite the mortgages, thereby giving a huge subsidy to the perp holders, is just simply insane, and he doesn't seem to realize what he did. Also, having learned more about his health insurance plan, it is not too well thought through. Degrading the risk pools vis a vis removing the inventive for employer plans, is not replaced with anything coherent as to how to deal with folks with pre-existing medical conditions. There may well be a fix, but the point is that McCain just doesn't ask enough questions, or do his homework.

In short, Obama is a risky scheme, but McCain may well be riskier. Treasury bonds are far better than both.

I feel the same way you do in many respects, but Obama's tax plans are the one thing I cannot bring myself to support. That alone could hurt the economy more than what McCain has proposed. The problem with John is that he really doesn't have a coherent economic plan. It just keeps changing. Obama has a plan, but it makes me sick. He wants to expand government far too much for my tastes. His wish to redistribute the wealth bothers me.

[Хahar 🤔]

His wish to redistribute the wealth bothers me.

Because rich people should always have all the money, right?

[Sam Spade]

What Obama wants is what the country wants.  Maybe.  Actually, scratch that.  I don't think the country wants anything that's being offered.

[cannonia]

His wish to redistribute the wealth bothers me.

Because rich people should always have all the money, right?

Because it makes the country as a whole poorer.  It's a way of making people dependent while they stay impoverished, and there are a host of unintended consequences.

If people have to support themselves, they will do it, and they will do it better than the government could.

But on the basic issue of fairness or justice, government should not take things from one person and give it to others.

[??????????]

What Obama wants is what the country wants. 

80% of the country thinks UFOs visit here regularly.

[bgwah]

Maybe u should just change ur name 2 "Whorie"

lololololol jk

[Torie]

Well, I marked my absentee ballot for The One, signed it, sealed it stamped it, and will mail it in tomorrow. It is the first vote I have any made for a "rat" in my long life.   Now, I need a shower.

In the end, beyond the issue of McCain's rather go with the gut style of decision making, without deep thought and knowledge, in contradistinction to Obama, what tipped the scales, is that I suspect McCain will be inconstant and rather thoughtless in the way he throws money around at problems (he certainly has in his campaign proposals to date; if you want a list, I will provide it). Plus, the heavily Dem Congress will tend to force him that way, if he is to get anything done. It is better that the Dems have total control, and we see what they do with their power. The best way to refute and expose their unrealistic agenda is to let them try it, or back away from it.  Beyond that, the I don't think the four conservatives on SCOTUS, nor the in so many ways execrable Kennedy, will retire, so Obama's choices for Stevens and Ginsburg won't make much difference, and will be a good test of whether he goes for a positive law redistributionist, reading new entitlement rights in the Constitution, ala the  Law prof Cass Sustein. If he does, well that will be a lesson indeed.

Speaking of lessons, the best lesson in life is to try something, and hit the wall. I think we are now at the point that we need to learn that lesson. Maybe it will cause the new generation to "grow up" more rapidly. In any event, one might hope that  it will cause a cleaner and more coherent difference between the parties to be drawn, on something other than the tiresome and distracting social issues - what Justin Dart (a name from the long past whom you would not know, unless both an "old" and decades long political junkie), characterized as  "the sh**tty little issues."

We live in interesting times, and now I have done my de minimus part to make them every more interesting. I admit that Obama can't do much to real hurt me in life at this point, no matter what. In that sense, perhaps I am more "liberated" to take risks, but some might call that a selfish indulgence since many are not in that position, and the idea of risking making it all worse so it gets better might take some down less well positioned. I accept that comment; it might be true. In any event, may any higher power that exists have mercy upon me for wha I have done.

The end.

Best to you all, my friends, and almost all of you are. I so admire your knowledge and enthusiasm, humor, and in most cases civility, no matter how much we disagree. It is rather unique on the "internets."

Torie

[Хahar 🤔]

No! You should've voted McKinney!

[The Mikado]

Without looking, I'm guessing either Obama or a Barr protest vote.

Hey, I was right!

[Ban my account ffs!]

I KNEW it... Torie's a pinko.

[Torie]

I KNEW it... Torie's a pinko.

Torie's a pinko [socialist].

I think the word du jour is socialist, displacing pinko. You need to keep up.

[Ronnie]

I knew this was coming.  I never get what I want.

Well, I don't really have much to say other than...well...you voted for Obama.  You made that decision, and I respect it.

[Fmr. Pres. Duke]

I thought you filled out your ballot for McCain yesterday?

[Torie]

I knew this was coming.  I never get what I want.

Well, I don't really have much to say other than...well...you voted for Obama.  You made that decision, and I respect it.

Hey, I voted hard right wing for the rest of the ballot. I even printed out the Lincoln club endorsements on obscure races, down to the water district. If you want the rest of the list, let me know. Granted I don't know if you are eligible to vote.

[Ronnie]

I knew this was coming.  I never get what I want.

Well, I don't really have much to say other than...well...you voted for Obama.  You made that decision, and I respect it.

Hey, I voted hard right wing for the rest of the ballot. I even printed out the Lincoln club endorsements on obscure races, down to the water district. If you want the rest of the list, let me know. Granted I don't know if you are eligible to vote.

LOL, I told you several times that I voted for McCain, so yes I'm eligible to vote.  Do you want me to take a picture of my sample ballot and upload it on Photobucket or something?

[Torie]

Oh you voted already. Who did you vote for for city council? Granted, when I asked Joe Brown whether or not there were any extant issues in front of Albertson's, he said no. LOL.

[Ronnie]

Oh you voted already. Who did you vote for for city council? Granted, when I asked Joe Brown whether or not there were any extant issues in front of Albertson's, he said no. LOL.

I voted for the incumbents: Glaab and Capata.

[Torie]

Oh you voted already. Who did you vote for for city council? Granted, when I asked Joe Brown whether or not there were any extant issues in front of Albertson's, he said no. LOL.

I voted for the incumbents: Glaab and Capata.

I did too, plus old man Brown. Capata I did not know from Adam, but I like the CPA thing.

[Ronnie]

Oh you voted already. Who did you vote for for city council? Granted, when I asked Joe Brown whether or not there were any extant issues in front of Albertson's, he said no. LOL.

I voted for the incumbents: Glaab and Capata.

I did too, plus old man Brown. Capata I did not know from Adam, but I like the CPA thing.

Glaab is awesome, I think he has done a really good job.  Capata was kind of a "meh" vote.