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Author Topic: Probable terror attacks in Mumbai  (Read 7184 times)
Breaking hearts and minds
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« Reply #50 on: November 29, 2008, 07:23:54 am »
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This is really weird to me.

This isn't the MO of a AlQaeda-esque groups we're used to.

They're really acting like the terrorists that were more prevalent during the 70s.

Change of tactic, perhaps. Madrid was also different from the norm- remote detonation.

That's because there's no single coherent organization named "al-Qaeda". There are hundred different al-Qaeda's in the world... some chose to adopt that name, others merely consider themselvers allied with or inspired by al-Qaeda.
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« Reply #51 on: November 29, 2008, 07:34:56 am »
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Quite. I use "Al-Qaeda" in speech-marks because it's a disparate organisation and I need to refer to it on a collective level.

Al-Qaeda is a franchise, basically.
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« Reply #52 on: November 29, 2008, 09:17:52 am »
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This is really weird to me.

This isn't the MO of a AlQaeda-esque groups we're used to.

They're really acting like the terrorists that were more prevalent during the 70s.

Change of tactic, perhaps. Madrid was also different from the norm- remote detonation.

That's because there's no single coherent organization named "al-Qaeda". There are hundred different al-Qaeda's in the world... some chose to adopt that name, others merely consider themselvers allied with or inspired by al-Qaeda.

Of course, but many of them do take on similar tactics - they tend to prefer swift attacks. This is really different.
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« Reply #53 on: November 29, 2008, 01:07:49 pm »
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All these islamic terrorist groups, whether they use the name Al-Qaeda are not have now 2 things in common :
1. They want to take over the world and make it Islamic.
2. They are directly or indirectly getting either arms and ammunition or financial support or training or plans from the Pakistani ISI.

The siege is now supposedly over. So lets now get over it, forget it, talk about something else, and we can resume when some other country gets attacked. Theres no need to help India because there is no oil to loot( like Somalia ). There is no need to go against Pakistan cause it is an "ally" in fighting terrorism. Let us now make some intellectual posts, and forget rooting out the evil and its root cause. Afterall without terrorism, the world will perhaps be a much more dull place to live in.So begging with this sarcastic post of mine, let make a few more sarcastic posts, and some intellectual ones, and let Pakistan and Al-Qaeda do what want to do, and get over it. Oh and let us not forget to condemn the cowardly act of terrorism and express our most sincere condolences to all those whose family members have been killed.
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« Reply #54 on: November 29, 2008, 01:49:11 pm »
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I support rooting out the root cause of this evil. It's just I don't think it's Islam itself.
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« Reply #55 on: November 29, 2008, 01:52:17 pm »
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I support rooting out the root cause of this evil. It's just I don't think it's Islam itself.

For anything to actually change the moderates in the faith have to actually make their existence known and change their faith from within. They'll never listen to Christian or secular westerners.
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Sibboleth
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« Reply #56 on: November 30, 2008, 02:20:10 am »
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Shivraj Patil (federal Home affairs Minister) has apparently resigned.
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« Reply #57 on: November 30, 2008, 02:35:34 am »
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I fear for all Muslims in India. I say at least a few thousand die.

Good news for the BJP here.


Well, at the moment I fear for the hostages.

But yes, Hindu and Islamic nationalism kind of feed off each other in a symbiotic, tit-for-tat escalation in the country.

How can India, an essentially disorderly hodgepodge of daily chaos filled with throngs of people, and, what, the owner of the second-largest Muslim population on Earth, defend itself against terrorism?  I wonder.  and of course, being right next to a competing all-Islamic state makes Hindus in India keenly aware of their differences with Muslims and causes them to ostracize them

But yes this makes things worse for everybody.

The root of this lies with Jinnah, who more or less destroyed India for political gain (yes, I know this is a gross oversimplification). Though there's no indication a united India would be any better, it couldn't really have turned out much worse.

No surprise that the Religion of Peace strikes again.
shut the fukc up.

Hey, I'm just quoting what they've said. Get over it, child.
Yeah but it makes you sound like an idiot, that is attacking all of Islam because of these nutjobs. It doesn't bother me that much but it does make you seem very bigoted.

Until the supposed moderates show up to change the face of Islam I will hold nothing but strong criticism for Islam and Islamic governments. Sorry.

Sorry. We don't have a Pope who is infallible.
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« Reply #58 on: November 30, 2008, 06:57:43 am »
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By root cause of evil I dint meant Islam religion. Even though it is not very far from that perhaps. I actually meant Pakistani ISI. And Jinnah is not to be blamed 100%. He can be blamed 80 %. Rest 20 % of blame goes to Nehru and Gandhi. Both Nehru and Jinnah wanted to be PM. Then Jinnah used the muslim card when he found out that Gandhi thinks more of Nehry then him. And Gandhi who would start a fasting strike for every little pretext then decided to remain quite as thousands and thousands of people from both side got massacred as the country got divided. Ofcourse we can not change that past. What we can do is stop the Pakistani ISI to prevent the terrorist strikes world over. But who is going to bell the cat ?
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« Reply #59 on: November 30, 2008, 06:37:16 pm »
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Source: http://thestatesman.org/page.news.php?clid=1&theme=&usrsess=1&id=233485
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‘Attackers had local help’

Statesman News Service
MUMBAI, Nov. 30: Ajmal Mohammad Amin Kasab, age 21, is recovering from bullet injuries suffered during his shootout on Wednesday night with Mumbai police at Girgaum Chowpatty and is proving to be a fount of information to Crime Branch interrogators investigating the unprecedented terror strikes in the country’s financial capital.
Quite sensitive information is coming out from the captured terrorist’s mouth, sources said today.
Kasab, who is being kept in an undisclosed place, has reportedly revealed that the ten terrorists who landed at the Gateway of India were extended logistic and other “active support” at three targets: the Taj Mahal Hotel, the Oberoi-Trident and Nariman House. He is understood to have given the names of five local contacts who acted as accomplices in the terror attacks.
The investigation has been handed over to the Crime Branch headed by joint CP Mr Rakesh Maria after ATS chief Mr Hemant Karkare’s death in the terrorist strikes on Wednesday.
These “locals” might have helped them with fake I-cards and other facilities. Investigators, who surmise from documents recovered that at least some of the terrorists had visited Mumbai in the recent past, posing as “students” from Mauritius, are yet to confirm whether these local accomplices helped facilitate these visits.
Satellite phone conversations with Muzzamil alias Yusuf, in charge of Lashkar-e-Tayyaba's India operations, have been confirmed. The terrorists were trained in boat and ship movements at Pakistan’s Mangla Dam reservoir.
Kasab has said they had a specific mission to target Israelis at Nariman House, the Jewish community centre in Mumbai’s Colaba. Investigators are ascertaining whether some of the terrorists had stayed at the Centre as “students from Malaysia” in the recent past. It is confirmed that they knew Nariman House like the “palm of their hand”.
Investigators are now also obtaining information from various Indian banks like ICICI, Axis, HDFC and SBI whose credit cards were found with the terrorists.
Kasab has retraced the terrorists’ voyage from Karachi, and how they stole Kuber from off Porbandar to arrive clandestinely at Mumbai’s very doorstep.
Meanwhile, sources in the Crime Branch said they have received a message from the Gujarat ATS regarding the arrest of one suspect in Porbandar.
A Crime Branch team is leaving to obtain custody of the apprehended suspect.
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« Reply #60 on: November 30, 2008, 06:56:47 pm »
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Wow that is damn good planning.
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« Reply #61 on: December 02, 2008, 09:06:37 pm »
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http://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/Pak_TV_channel_says_2611_hatched_by_Hindu_Zionists/rssarticleshow/3785654.cms

Mumbai's 26/11 was actually a plan hatched by "Hindu Zionists" and "Western Zionists", including the Mossad, said a self-styled
Pakistan security expert on a Pakistan news television show, uploaded on www.hotklix.com.

" Inki shaklein Hinduonwali hain, jis zabaan mein guftagoo kar rahein hain, woh zabaan koi Pakistani istemaal nahin karta hai (They look like Hindus. No Pakistani speaks the language they chatted in)," said Zaid Hamid while referring to the terrorists on the show Mujhe Ikhtilaf Hai (I differ) on Pakistan's News One channel. The sensationalist channel was launched in November last year.

Hamid said that it was a "badly planned" operation that had gone horribly wrong. "9/11 jo Americans ne kiya tha usko bahut khoobsurat camouflage kiya tha. Unhone media mein perception management bahut acchha kiya . Indians ne wahi game repeat karne ki koshish ki, lekin akal to hai nahin . In ahmakon ne complete disaster kiya isko handle karne mein . (The Americans executed the 9/11 attack perfectly. They managed the media very well. The Indians tried to repeat the formula but goofed up. The idiots made a complete mess of it).

He said that the attackers wore saffron Hindu Zionist bands, which no Muslim would tie. Hamid also said that within the first 5 minutes of the attack, the three ATS policemen investigating the network of terror within India's security agencies and radical right were killed.

That ensured that those investigations reach a dead end. Anchor Qudsia Qadri added that with their killings, the investigations into the Samjhauta Express carnage would be halted. The killings also immediately shifted attention from India's domestic terrorists to Pakistan, said Hamid.

Marvi Memon, glamorous Pakistan Muslim League member, on the same programme, was appalled at the Pakistan government's expansion of the "India-appeasement package" by initially agreeing to send ISI chief to India. "I just don't get it," she exclaimed in exasperation.

She wondered how can you send the ISI chief to a " mulk jiske sath jang chal raha hai ...at a different level...," mentioning Kashmir and accusing India of blocking Pakistan's waters. Memon said, "They (Indians) are quite obsessed with anti-Pakistan speak and that unites them," she said. Memon also spoke about India's separatist movements and believed that India was only reaping the bitter harvest of the poisonous seeds it had sowed.

Blogger daily.pk writes in pakalert.wordpress.com, "India has been relapsing into religious extremism and numerous separatist movement have mushroomed due to official patronage ...I see the Mumbai bombings as the desperate move of separatists who want to blame everything on Muslims."

It's not only random voices railing against fingers pointing to Pakistan. Blogger and journalist Farrukh Khan Pitafi is miffed. "For years I have been advocating peace between India and Pakistan," he wrote. But he, too, says that India was out of its mind in naming Pakistan as the source of violence without identification of the perpetrators.

He wrote: "During such a long coverage of the mishap not a single outlet pointed out that Hemant Karkare... was the same man whose dismissal was Narendra Modi's biggest demand. Or that he was the man on the verge of uncovering the home-grown terror franchise of the Hindu extremists. No channel mentioned Colonel Purohit once during the live telecast, no not even CNN, BBC or CBS. It is sad."


HAHAHAHA Pakistan is getting pretty damn ridiculous. What the fukc is a "Hindu Zionist"? How the hell does that work out. Is it all the fault of India's miniscule Jewish population? ing idiots. Oh and I want to know how a "Hindu Zionist band" looks like. LOL
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« Reply #62 on: December 02, 2008, 09:08:40 pm »
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"Hindu Zionist band"

Doesn't that belong in the 'Post a silly sentence' thread? Tongue
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« Reply #63 on: December 02, 2008, 09:18:01 pm »
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Haha. LOL
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« Reply #64 on: December 02, 2008, 09:20:58 pm »
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"Hindu Zionist band"

Doesn't that belong in the 'Post a silly sentence' thread? Tongue
Haha should have . My bad.
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« Reply #65 on: December 02, 2008, 09:21:56 pm »
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Oh and I want to know how a "Hindu Zionist band" looks like. LOL

Sitar Klezmer.
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« Reply #66 on: December 02, 2008, 09:46:39 pm »
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Oh and I want to know how a "Hindu Zionist band" looks like. LOL

Sitar Klezmer.

LOL!!!
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« Reply #67 on: December 03, 2008, 06:11:29 pm »
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Ex-U.S. Official Cites Pakistani Training for India Attackers
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WASHINGTON — A former Defense Department official said Wednesday that American intelligence agencies had determined that former officers from Pakistan’s Army and its powerful Inter-Services Intelligence agency helped train the Mumbai attackers.

But the official, who spoke on condition of anonymity, said that no specific links had been uncovered yet between the terrorists and the Pakistani government.

His disclosure came as Secretary of State Condoleezza Rice held meetings with Indian leaders in New Delhi and Adm. Mike Mullen, the chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff, met with their Pakistani counterparts in Islamabad, in a two-pronged effort to pressure Pakistan to cooperate fully in the effort to track down those responsible for the bloody attacks in Mumbai last week.

Also on Wednesday, a “fully functional” bomb was found and defused at a major Mumbai train station that had reopened days earlier, the Mumbai authorities announced. The discovery raised terrifying questions about why the authorities had failed to find it all this time.

Meanwhile, tens of thousands of people marched through Mumbai, both mourning the at least 173 dead and protesting the failures of Indian politicians and security services to protect citizens.

Ms. Rice strove to balance demands on both countries. She said that Pakistan had a “special responsibility” to cooperate with India and help prevent attacks in the future, here and elsewhere. At the same time, she warned India against hasty reaction that would yield what she called “unintended consequences.”

“The response of the Pakistani government should be one of cooperation and of action,” she said at an evening news conference in New Delhi with her Indian counterpart, Pranab Mukherjee. “Any response needs to be judged by its effectiveness in prevention and also by not creating other unintended consequences or difficulties.”

Mr. Mukherjee said his government was convinced that the attackers and their “controllers” came from Pakistan. He said he had conveyed to Ms. Rice “the feeling of anger and deep outrage in India” and said that his government was prepared to act “with all the means at our disposal” to protect Indian territory and citizens.

Both American and Indian authorities have concluded that there was little doubt that the Mumbai attacks were directed by militants inside Pakistan, and Indian officials have said they have identified three or four masterminds of the attack, including a leader of Lashkar-e-Taiba, Yusuf Muzzamil.

But Ms. Rice said it was premature to comment on whether any particular organization was responsible for the attacks on India’s financial and entertainment capital. She described the assault last week as distinct from others that had struck India since it targeted high-profile targets, including those frequented by foreigners, and appeared to be designed to “send a message.”

Ms. Rice said Pakistan had assured her that it would cooperate with India in its search for those responsible for the slaughter in Mumbai. She said President Asif Ali Zardari “has told me he will follow leads wherever they go” but she made clear that Washington expected him to do so wholeheartedly.

“This is a time for everybody to cooperate and to do so transparently, and this is especially a time for Pakistan to do so,” she said.

Lashkar-e-Taiba is officially banned in Pakistan, but it has been linked to the country’s powerful intelligence service and is believed to have moved its militant networks to Pakistan’s tribal areas.

For the moment, Mr. Zardari is playing down any links to Pakistan, including the Indian identification of the surviving attacker as a Pakistani. “We have not been given any tangible proof to say that he is definitely a Pakistani. I very much doubt that he’s a Pakistani,” Mr. Zardari told CNN’s “Larry King Live,” saying that his government would take action if India produced evidence to support the claim.

He also indicated that he would turn down an Indian demand, made on Monday night, to hand over about 20 fugitives, some of them linked to organized crime, said by India to be living in Pakistan. Rather, Mr. Zardari said, they would be tried in Pakistani courts if there were evidence to support a trial.

In Islamabad, Admiral Mullen met with President Zardari; the Pakistani national security adviser, Mahmud Ali Durrani; and several top military officials, including the Army chief of staff, Gen. Ashfaq Pervaiz Kayani, and the new intelligence chief, Lt. Gen. Ahmed Shuja Pasha.

Admiral Mullen pressed the Pakistani leaders to crack down on Lashkar-e-Taiba’s network of training camps, including those in Pakistan-controlled Kashmir, and the organization’s guerrilla recruiting efforts, an American military official said.

In New Delhi, response to a question, Ms. Rice said that the sophistication and choice of targets in Mumbai distinguished it from previous attacks. Earlier in the day, also in response to a question, Ms. Rice was asked about any possible involvement by Al Qaeda. “Whether there is a direct Al Qaeda hand or not, this is clearly the kind of terror in which Al Qaeda participates,” she said.

The bomb was found in a bag the Chhatrapati Shivaji Terminus, the old Victoria station, one of the sites singled out for attack last week. It held about 20 pounds of explosives and was rigged with a timer, the Indian authorities said, but it was not clear whether it had not been activated or had malfunctioned.

The bag, apparently left behind by the attackers a week ago, had been collected along with a large pile of luggage that passengers had abandoned as they fled. That is where the police found it on Wednesday.

The station has been open for days, with thousands of passengers streaming through, and the discovery raised new questions about the capability of Indian security services.

There were conflicting accounts about how the bomb were found. Some reports said that the police had been tipped off by the surviving attacker, but others said a sniffer dog found it during a routine sweep of the abandoned luggage ahead of an officials visit. It was rendered neutral on the spot, the authorities said, and then subsequently removed for analysis. Train service was not disrupted for the maneuvers.

Ms. Rice’s diplomatic agenda takes place as Washington is seeking high-level cooperation in different spheres with both India and Pakistan, nuclear-armed neighbors. Washington wants Pakistan to help defeat Al Qaeda and Taliban insurgents along the border with Afghanistan.

But Pakistani security officials have threatened to withdraw troops from the lawless border region to redeploy them if India and Pakistan slide toward their fourth war since independence from Britain in 1947, Reuters reported.

In October, Washington opened a new chapter of cooperation with India when Congress gave final approval to a breakthrough agreement permitting civilian nuclear trade between the two countries for the first time in three decades.

Under the terms of the deal, the United States will now be able to sell nuclear fuel, technology and reactors to India for peaceful energy although New Delhi tested bombs in 1974 and 1998 and never signed the Nuclear Nonproliferation Treaty. In exchange, India agreed to open up 14 civilian nuclear facilities to international inspection, but would continue to shield eight military reactors from outside scrutiny.

Eric Schmitt reported from Washington and Somini Sengupta from Mumbai, India. Reporting was contributed by Alan Cowell from London, and Jeremy Kahn and Robert F. Worth from Mumbai.


Source: http://www.nytimes.com/2008/12/04/world/asia/04india.html?_r=1&hp
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