Is Judaism more like Christianity or Islam?
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  Is Judaism more like Christianity or Islam?
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Author Topic: Is Judaism more like Christianity or Islam?  (Read 4157 times)
Scam of God
Einzige
Junior Chimp
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« on: January 01, 2009, 08:15:13 AM »
« edited: January 01, 2009, 08:43:10 AM by Einzige »

Which of the two 'spin-off' religions retains more of the essential character of the Jewish religion? I've always thought that Islam held more in common, insofar as both religions place a much higher emphasis on asceticism and personal purity (rather than personal piety) than the more liturgical Christianity, but I don't really know enough about Judaism and Islam to say.

I've always been of the opinion that Judaism : Islam :: Christianity : Mormonism; that is to say, I've always thought that Islam is basically Judaism extrapolated for an Arabic audience, much as Mormonism was an attempt to 'Americanize' Christianity. In that sense, they'd be essentially the same faith. Is that at all accurate?
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Yamor
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« Reply #1 on: January 01, 2009, 06:25:39 PM »

The first major Jewish assimilation was actually long before the war, in Germany. Not that I disagree with your main point, though.
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phk
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« Reply #2 on: January 02, 2009, 02:14:33 AM »

Islam is just Orthodox Judaism repackaged and redone for Arabs.
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12th Doctor
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« Reply #3 on: January 02, 2009, 02:29:13 AM »

The extant to which Islam actually agrees with certain Christians is often vastly down played.

Muslims have more respect for Mary than Protestants, and have no problem with the notion of virgin birth.
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True Democrat
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« Reply #4 on: January 02, 2009, 12:37:55 PM »
« Edited: January 03, 2009, 08:44:03 PM by True Democrat »

EDIT:  Islam

Both religion are orthopraxic, while Christianity is orthdoxic.
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memphis
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« Reply #5 on: January 02, 2009, 01:45:37 PM »

Islam. Christianity fundamentally redifined monotheism with the concept of Jesus's divinity.
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Countess Anya of the North Parish
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« Reply #6 on: January 05, 2009, 12:20:55 AM »

Which of the two 'spin-off' religions retains more of the essential character of the Jewish religion? I've always thought that Islam held more in common, insofar as both religions place a much higher emphasis on asceticism and personal purity (rather than personal piety) than the more liturgical Christianity, but I don't really know enough about Judaism and Islam to say.

I've always been of the opinion that Judaism : Islam :: Christianity : Mormonism; that is to say, I've always thought that Islam is basically Judaism extrapolated for an Arabic audience, much as Mormonism was an attempt to 'Americanize' Christianity. In that sense, they'd be essentially the same faith. Is that at all accurate?

I have always thought that way to. Now granted if you leave the religous books out of it then Islam and Judaism seem exactly the same. But with the books I think Christianity is really trying to be like Judaism.
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BRTD
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« Reply #7 on: January 05, 2009, 12:50:51 AM »

More interesting question: is Mormonism closer to Christianity than Christianity is to Judaism?

My answer is no, and the origins of both Christianity and Mormonism in relation to their root religions are similar (though despite this Christianity is the true religion while Mormonism is an abomination of lies.)
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Scam of God
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Junior Chimp
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« Reply #8 on: January 05, 2009, 09:09:39 AM »

(though despite this Christianity is the true religion while Mormonism is an abomination of lies.)

No, Christianity is pretty much a lie that the weak-willed tell themselves to get to sleep at night.

EDIT: Actually, Christianity is probably slightly more ridiculous than Islam. The very ethical foundation of Christianity is pathetic; at least Islam encourages a warrior mentality.
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jmfcst
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« Reply #9 on: January 05, 2009, 10:19:59 AM »

Islam. Christianity fundamentally redifined monotheism with the concept of Jesus's divinity.

Huh  the New Testament is monotheistic
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jmfcst
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« Reply #10 on: January 05, 2009, 11:35:54 AM »

Islam. Christianity fundamentally redifined monotheism with the concept of Jesus's divinity.

Huh  the New Testament is monotheistic

Christians are the only ones that believe that. Other religions regard the Trinity as a rejection of monotheism. Just letting you know.

I am well aware of the confusion and it is NOT caused by the New Testament, rather it is caused by people's extrapolation (the Trinity Doctrine)

Judaism believed God is omnipresent and that the Holy Spirit is God's Spirit...so there is no discrepancy in the New Testament stating that the one and only God was manifested in the flesh while at the same time being omnipresent.

The only thing that confuses Jews and Muslims into thinking Christianity is not monotheistic is the confusion caused by some people's interpretation of the Trinity Doctrine.  If the New Testament is allowed to speak for itself, without extrapolation, then there would be no confusion.

The New Testament states that the ENTIRE GODHEAD dwelt in the body of Jesus Christ, therefore what was in Jesus Christ was not part of the godhead, rather it was the whole enchilada.

Col 2:9 "For in him dwelleth all the fulness of the Godhead bodily."

And there is no discrepancy in God himself coming down to redeem Israel, for it is written: "He himself will redeem Israel from all their sins."  Psa 130:8
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jmfcst
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« Reply #11 on: January 05, 2009, 08:09:54 PM »

But now that Jesus is dead do you pray to the Father exclusively? Or do you also pray to Jesus and consider him as God? And what is the Holy Spirit now? Do you simply consider them all emissaries to God, or each as God in itself?

They are all one and the same being (God), and the only way to gain access to God is through faith in Jesus Christ.
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Хahar 🤔
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« Reply #12 on: January 05, 2009, 08:13:08 PM »

Islam has, instead, retained much of the earlier ideas of Judaism, i.e. subjugation of women and total rejection of depictions of God, without advancing very far in most circles.

Can you really say this with a straight face?
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Хahar 🤔
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« Reply #13 on: January 06, 2009, 03:28:13 PM »

Islam has, instead, retained much of the earlier ideas of Judaism, i.e. subjugation of women and total rejection of depictions of God, without advancing very far in most circles.

Can you really say this with a straight face?

What part would you disagree with? There may not be absolute subjugation in most circles today, but the woman is certainly inferior in many Islamic circles. And there is extreme anger at attempts to depict Allah or Muhammed (i.e. Denmark). Judaism is quite similar in historical context, but has advanced very far from these beliefs.

Anti-iconoclasm amounts to backwardness?

You are confusing correlation and causation.
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Хahar 🤔
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« Reply #14 on: January 06, 2009, 07:56:45 PM »

I won't argue with that. The Mitzvot aren't followed to the same extent that the Qur'an is.
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« Reply #15 on: January 06, 2009, 08:27:46 PM »

I won't argue with that. The Mitzvot aren't followed to the same extent that the Qur'an is.

Tell that to a Charedi Jew.
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anvi
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« Reply #16 on: January 07, 2009, 12:18:08 AM »

Islam, like other religious traditions, is very complex.  At least complex enough to make the phrase "strict adherence to the Qur'an" somewhat meaningless.  In Sunni Islam, there are four major schools of jurisprudence that have different interpretations of the Qur'an and Hadith and then legalist "disputants" in addition to those.  Shia has its own variety of interpretations of the Qur'an.  And Sufi Muslims of either stripe have far more symbolic and mystical interpetations than the jurors of either major tradition.  In this way, the juridical heritage of Islam much more closely resembles that of the Jewish tradition with its complex rabinnical interpretive history and modern divisions.  I think the other major feature that Judaism and Islam share is a far more stringent version of monotheism than Christianity with its triune theology. 
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anvi
anvikshiki
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« Reply #17 on: January 07, 2009, 12:35:02 AM »

For whom?  I know many, many people from Muslim families that hail from Karachi and Delhi and Jakara and Istanbul and South Africa who are pretty "progressive" and reform-minded.  It's important, it seems to me, not to paint two billion people with too broad strokes and it's important not to confuse what clerics might insist on from what practicing laypeople do and believe.  I mean, I get your point, but I'm just saying that these sorts of things are pretty hard to quantify in traditions that are so global and adhered to by people of very different kinds in very different circumstances.
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