Does this scare you and remind you of Mao?
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  Does this scare you and remind you of Mao?
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Question: Does this scare you and remind you of Mao?
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Yes
 
#2
No
 
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Total Voters: 39

Author Topic: Does this scare you and remind you of Mao?  (Read 15550 times)
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snowguy716
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« Reply #25 on: December 23, 2008, 08:43:02 PM »

I was at a frickin' Bed, Bath and Beyond and they had a damn Obama commemorative plate! At a store that sells Bed and Bath stuff!! When Clinton won in '92, there wasn't all this. When Bush won in '00, there wasn't all of this.

Why does he have to be any different? I mean...I find it strange that the candidate who did the least amount of work to get to the White House wins this sweeping victory and is seen as a messiah. I really can't understand it. I think it has to do with one thing and one thing only. He gives a mesmerizing speech. Well so do I! Does that mean if I ever become the well-known, foreign policy Senator from Ohio that suddenly they will say "Hey...that Naso guy is electrifying and gives a booming, stirring speech. He could be President of the United States in four years."?

And it was the Obama supporters that felt entitled, eh?

I'm sure you were saying the same thing about Bush in 2000 when he stepped all over McCain's face... you know.. the one that did the least work got the job.
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Wiz in Wis
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« Reply #26 on: December 23, 2008, 10:51:30 PM »

Guys... perspective please.

Not only is he the first African American president... which on its own should generate most of this, but he is following one of the most unpopular presidents in history. He represents a generational transition, a tone transition, and a party transition. People being enamoured with him should shock no one. If you are worried, it is just a reflection of how dour and cynical recent politics (since Kennedy) has become.
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Reaganfan
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« Reply #27 on: December 24, 2008, 04:42:12 AM »

I was at a frickin' Bed, Bath and Beyond and they had a damn Obama commemorative plate! At a store that sells Bed and Bath stuff!! When Clinton won in '92, there wasn't all this. When Bush won in '00, there wasn't all of this.

Why does he have to be any different? I mean...I find it strange that the candidate who did the least amount of work to get to the White House wins this sweeping victory and is seen as a messiah. I really can't understand it. I think it has to do with one thing and one thing only. He gives a mesmerizing speech. Well so do I! Does that mean if I ever become the well-known, foreign policy Senator from Ohio that suddenly they will say "Hey...that Naso guy is electrifying and gives a booming, stirring speech. He could be President of the United States in four years."?

And it was the Obama supporters that felt entitled, eh?

I'm sure you were saying the same thing about Bush in 2000 when he stepped all over McCain's face... you know.. the one that did the least work got the job.

I actually liked McCain in 2000...but okay...
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Junior Chimp
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« Reply #28 on: December 24, 2008, 04:46:28 AM »

Why does he have to be any different? I mean...I find it strange that the candidate who did the least amount of work to get to the White House wins this sweeping victory and is seen as a messiah. I really can't understand it. I think it has to do with one thing and one thing only. He gives a mesmerizing speech. Well so do I! Does that mean if I ever become the well-known, foreign policy Senator from Ohio that suddenly they will say "Hey...that Naso guy is electrifying and gives a booming, stirring speech. He could be President of the United States in four years."?

Yeah lol, goddamn those B-actors running for Governor of California. One of them might end up becoming President without having done real work first, based just on charisma.
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Reaganfan
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« Reply #29 on: December 24, 2008, 05:05:35 AM »

Why does he have to be any different? I mean...I find it strange that the candidate who did the least amount of work to get to the White House wins this sweeping victory and is seen as a messiah. I really can't understand it. I think it has to do with one thing and one thing only. He gives a mesmerizing speech. Well so do I! Does that mean if I ever become the well-known, foreign policy Senator from Ohio that suddenly they will say "Hey...that Naso guy is electrifying and gives a booming, stirring speech. He could be President of the United States in four years."?

Yeah lol, goddamn those B-actors running for Governor of California. One of them might end up becoming President without having done real work first, based just on charisma.

He was a two-term Governor.
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Junior Chimp
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« Reply #30 on: December 24, 2008, 05:15:51 AM »

Why does he have to be any different? I mean...I find it strange that the candidate who did the least amount of work to get to the White House wins this sweeping victory and is seen as a messiah. I really can't understand it. I think it has to do with one thing and one thing only. He gives a mesmerizing speech. Well so do I! Does that mean if I ever become the well-known, foreign policy Senator from Ohio that suddenly they will say "Hey...that Naso guy is electrifying and gives a booming, stirring speech. He could be President of the United States in four years."?

Yeah lol, goddamn those B-actors running for Governor of California. One of them might end up becoming President without having done real work first, based just on charisma.

He was a two-term Governor.

And he did the exact same thing in that post he did as President: delegate authority to inferiors and ignore day-to-day operations.
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Tetro Kornbluth
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« Reply #31 on: December 24, 2008, 11:43:10 AM »

This only furthers my belief that the next four years will involve America going significantly off the boil again and ended in some disaster. I already have the Republicans winning in 2012.

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Junior Chimp
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« Reply #32 on: December 24, 2008, 11:44:48 AM »

This only furthers my belief that the next four years will involve America going significantly off the boil again and ended in some disaster. I already have the Republicans winning in 2012.

Patently ridiculous, and a lame-ass attempt at being 'against the grain'. Did the 1980's end in disaster for the Republicans, who had a much stronger cult of personality going at the time?
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Tetro Kornbluth
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« Reply #33 on: December 24, 2008, 12:14:26 PM »

This only furthers my belief that the next four years will involve America going significantly off the boil again and ended in some disaster. I already have the Republicans winning in 2012.

Patently ridiculous, and a lame-ass attempt at being 'against the grain'. Did the 1980's end in disaster for the Republicans, who had a much stronger cult of personality going at the time?

No: Logically you are correct. But I call this intitution (which has served me well in the past, moreso I admit in the results of football matches but I get this feeling. Trust me, no-one hates "OMG AIM SO DIFFERENT!1111" opinions more than me.)
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Junior Chimp
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« Reply #34 on: December 24, 2008, 12:16:55 PM »

This only furthers my belief that the next four years will involve America going significantly off the boil again and ended in some disaster. I already have the Republicans winning in 2012.

Patently ridiculous, and a lame-ass attempt at being 'against the grain'. Did the 1980's end in disaster for the Republicans, who had a much stronger cult of personality going at the time?

No: Logically you are correct. But I call this intitution.

The only possible (valid) rationale you can have is the idea that Obama will 'disappoint' his hardcore supporters; but, as well you ought to know, even if he fails to live up to any of his campaign promises, they'll happily swallow them and rationalize them away, just as Reagan's did when virtually none of his tax proposals got through his first few years.
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Tetro Kornbluth
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« Reply #35 on: December 24, 2008, 12:20:26 PM »

This only furthers my belief that the next four years will involve America going significantly off the boil again and ended in some disaster. I already have the Republicans winning in 2012.

Patently ridiculous, and a lame-ass attempt at being 'against the grain'. Did the 1980's end in disaster for the Republicans, who had a much stronger cult of personality going at the time?

No: Logically you are correct. But I call this intitution.

The only possible (valid) rationale you can have is the idea that Obama will 'disappoint' his hardcore supporters; but, as well you ought to know, even if he fails to live up to any of his campaign promises, they'll happily swallow them and rationalize them away, just as Reagan's did when virtually none of his tax proposals got through his first few years.

Here you ignore the rather large differences in mentality between "typical dedicated liberal" and "typical dedicated conservative". Also if I can defend my irrational position with a rational point, there is still the declining economy and the Middle East. Okay those were issues in Reagan's time too, but they actually declined after a period of time (in terms of popular, public perception - which is the only thing that matters in terms of presidential popular politics.), we seem to starting a major recession and a Middle East is still a situation is search of an event. So who knows what the situation will be in 2012?
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Junior Chimp
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« Reply #36 on: December 24, 2008, 12:28:11 PM »

This only furthers my belief that the next four years will involve America going significantly off the boil again and ended in some disaster. I already have the Republicans winning in 2012.

Patently ridiculous, and a lame-ass attempt at being 'against the grain'. Did the 1980's end in disaster for the Republicans, who had a much stronger cult of personality going at the time?

No: Logically you are correct. But I call this intitution.

The only possible (valid) rationale you can have is the idea that Obama will 'disappoint' his hardcore supporters; but, as well you ought to know, even if he fails to live up to any of his campaign promises, they'll happily swallow them and rationalize them away, just as Reagan's did when virtually none of his tax proposals got through his first few years.

Here you ignore the rather large differences in mentality between "typical dedicated liberal" and "typical dedicated conservative".

Actually, I think that the differences is quite the inverse of what you imply: liberals, having been for so long virtually powerless in the halls of power, will be quite willing to give someone they perceive as one of their own a pass on virtually anything that isn't intentionally abusive of them. Conservatives, on the other hand, have gotten very used to having the reins of power, and are almost single-minded on their insistence for ideological purity. We suffered through Clinton's triangulations; we can suffer through Obama's moderations.

Moreover, the memory of Dubya will be alive and well in four years.

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Not really. Check Reagan's approval polls from 1982, which, if I can recall from memory, were pretty regularly below 50%, but above 40% - that was actually the height of that particular economic catastrophe, and people knew it, but the general public didn't blame Reagan for it. They were willing to give him time.

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And that's the only thing that matters.
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Tetro Kornbluth
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« Reply #37 on: December 24, 2008, 12:31:38 PM »

Again I don't necessarily disagree with what you say, Just I have a hunch otherwise. I do disagree with this:

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Will the expectations meet the reality? What if "events" mean that Obama has to act, surely he can't have a Clinton-like presidency where nothing really happens for 8 years (not true, but for the American public it was the case.)
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Junior Chimp
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« Reply #38 on: December 24, 2008, 12:36:12 PM »

Will the expectations meet the reality? What if "events" mean that Obama has to act, surely he can't have a Clinton-like presidency where nothing really happens for 8 years (not true, but for the American public it was the case.)

Then he'll have an opportunity to institute liberal reforms to issues where they are pertinent, as I believe he will, and I also believe the public will be generally amicable towards them.
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Tetro Kornbluth
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« Reply #39 on: December 24, 2008, 12:38:54 PM »

Will the expectations meet the reality? What if "events" mean that Obama has to act, surely he can't have a Clinton-like presidency where nothing really happens for 8 years (not true, but for the American public it was the case.)

Then he'll have an opportunity to institute liberal reforms to issues where they are pertinent, as I believe he will, and I also believe the public will be generally amicable towards them.

There is nothing more difficult than instituting a new order of things*.

(* - not that I genuinely believe Obama's mantra about Change being anything really tangiable, however if the situation means he has to act and do things, will he make relatively conservative decisions or much more reformist ones. I believe he will do the former, but what if they don't work?)
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« Reply #40 on: December 24, 2008, 01:05:32 PM »

Didn't Gully's "intuition" say that Hillary would win the nomination and then the Republicans win the presidency because of anti-Hillary hatred?
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Tetro Kornbluth
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« Reply #41 on: December 24, 2008, 01:08:38 PM »

Didn't Gully's "intuition" say that Hillary would win the nomination and then the Republicans win the presidency because of anti-Hillary hatred?

That was a guess (I did think that at one point, back after New Hampshire though I changed my tune quite quickly, I can't remember whether I posted it or not). This is a feeling.

Of course I'm quite happy to be proven wrong here.
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Associate Justice PiT
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« Reply #42 on: December 24, 2008, 02:24:35 PM »

     It scares me in that it reminds me of some sort of rash. Fortunately I don't see those where I live, so it's not a problem.
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« Reply #43 on: December 24, 2008, 02:36:02 PM »

     It scares me in that it reminds me of some sort of rash. Fortunately I don't see those where I live, so it's not a problem.

I thought this sort of thing would be very popular in San Francisco.
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« Reply #44 on: December 24, 2008, 02:55:45 PM »

     It scares me in that it reminds me of some sort of rash. Fortunately I don't see those where I live, so it's not a problem.

I thought this sort of thing would be very popular in San Francisco.

     I've seen one Obama poster in an apartment window & a few Obama/Biden bumper stickers, but nothing else as far as things for President go. On the other hand, I saw at least a dozen posters each for the two top candidates for Board of Supervisors.
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« Reply #45 on: December 24, 2008, 03:32:12 PM »

meh, no more than this:

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« Reply #46 on: December 24, 2008, 04:02:35 PM »


that wasn't put out by the Bush campaign
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Jake
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« Reply #47 on: December 24, 2008, 04:42:24 PM »

Guys... perspective please.

Not only is he the first African American president... which on its own should generate most of this, but he is following one of the most unpopular presidents in history. He represents a generational transition, a tone transition, and a party transition. People being enamoured with him should shock no one. If you are worried, it is just a reflection of how dour and cynical recent politics (since Kennedy) has become.

The idea that someone should not have faith in politicians is not "dour and cynical", it's realistic.
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J. J.
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« Reply #48 on: December 24, 2008, 04:49:12 PM »

It reminds me of Mao, and I would note that Mao didn't have to contest elections.

There is a problem that a few folks have raised, and and we have seen developing.  What if Obama disappoints?  It started with the gay community and I should note that some of the more serious attacks on Obama have come from the highest ranking openly gay politician, Barney Frank.



He's bound to disappoint some people.

I will make a bold prediction that he'll disappoint a lot fewer people than Bush did after his 2004 reelection.

That I am not sure of.  Obama benefited from not being pinned down on the issues; as president, he will have to be.  The question is, how many and will there be defections to him.

So far, there are some rough patches, and he has yet to be sworn in.
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Alcon
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« Reply #49 on: December 24, 2008, 04:59:54 PM »

So far, there are some rough patches, and he has yet to be sworn in.

Your first paragraph was spot-on, but are we going to have to deal with your 2008 Election form of analysis for four years?  Look at Obama's approvals in public polling.  Why would you ignore that, in lieu of "there are some rough patches, and he has yet to be sworn in"?
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