Pennsylvania 2010 - The Official Thread

[Southern Senator North Carolina Yankee]

What I don't get is why would Toomey except such a deal? His chances in either race are the same in the general and he has a better shot in the primary of taking down Specter then he does taking on Corbett and the West as whole, while the rest of the state is split.

Like I said, there is a lot in this "deal" that doesn't make sense but don't just look at it in terms of his chances in either race (though his chances in a General for Governor are probably better than his chances in a Senate race). There have been other things that I've heard from other people (people closer to Toomey on a personal level).

Luckily, these same people are saying that we ought to bet on Pat running for the Senate now.    That's awesome for the obvious reasons but it also means that I can support the other Pat as my first choice for Governor now. 

Toomey - Meehan for Pennsylvania in 2010!

Well if Toomey runs for Senate, Meehan's path clears slightly but he still has Jim Gerlach siphoning off votes from the SE. Because of all the confusion I don;t know who to support right now. Corbett or Meehan would fine for me for Govenor and Toomey for the Senate.

[Keystone Phil]

What I don't get is why would Toomey except such a deal? His chances in either race are the same in the general and he has a better shot in the primary of taking down Specter then he does taking on Corbett and the West as whole, while the rest of the state is split.

Like I said, there is a lot in this "deal" that doesn't make sense but don't just look at it in terms of his chances in either race (though his chances in a General for Governor are probably better than his chances in a Senate race). There have been other things that I've heard from other people (people closer to Toomey on a personal level).

Luckily, these same people are saying that we ought to bet on Pat running for the Senate now.    That's awesome for the obvious reasons but it also means that I can support the other Pat as my first choice for Governor now. 

Toomey - Meehan for Pennsylvania in 2010!

Well if Toomey runs for Senate, Meehan's path clears slightly but he still has Jim Gerlach siphoning off votes from the SE. Because of all the confusion I don;t know who to support right now. Corbett or Meehan would fine for me for Govenor and Toomey for the Senate.

Listen, I'll be 100% behind Meehan (I hate not being behind his candidacy now. I just have to support Toomey if he's running) but no one will doubt that he's clearly facing an uphill battle against Corbett. If Gerlach insists on staying in, it's even worse.

[Keystone Phil]

http://grassrootspa.com/?p=23509

Another sign that Toomey is running...

[Lunar]

I think it's a sign that SOMEONE is going to run and Meakem was never gung-ho himself.  He knows he can't split the anti-Specter vote.

So far, the anti-Specter people have surprisingly been organizing fairly effectively and have seemed to avoid the trap of cannabalizing themselves by having multiple candidates running, although it's still early on.  Also, the method of approaching potential Specter challenges, via conservative fundraisers and neroots, is solid


Toomey is probably the most credible general election anti-Specter candidate I can think of, although I'm not really on the pulse of PA politics

[Keystone Phil]

Toomey is probably the most credible general election anti-Specter candidate I can think of, although I'm not really on the pulse of PA politics

Most credible General election candidate? That would easily be Gerlach but he won't committ to challenging Specter.

[Keystone Phil]

I'll say that this talk about Specter switching, while not all that serious right now, certainly shouldn't be dismissed. It's his only way of sticking around for another term. He won't win the primary and obviously won't win as an Independent. If he switches, he'd likely win the General and he'd give the Democrats their 60th seat. Just imagine the hell that would break loose.

And it's possible because, as we all know,  Arlen is all about Arlen...

[TeePee4Prez]

I'll say that this talk about Specter switching, while not all that serious right now, certainly shouldn't be dismissed. It's his only way of sticking around for another term. He won't win the primary and obviously won't win as an Independent. If he switches, he'd likely win the General and he'd give the Democrats their 60th seat. Just imagine the hell that would break loose.

And it's possible because, as we all know,  Arlen is all about Arlen...

Specter still votes conservative on some issues.  Would he pull a Linc Chafee?  Time would tell.  Hey, if he pulls a Jim Jeffords- great!

[Keystone Phil]

I'll say that this talk about Specter switching, while not all that serious right now, certainly shouldn't be dismissed. It's his only way of sticking around for another term. He won't win the primary and obviously won't win as an Independent. If he switches, he'd likely win the General and he'd give the Democrats their 60th seat. Just imagine the hell that would break loose.

And it's possible because, as we all know,  Arlen is all about Arlen...

Specter still votes conservative on some issues.  Would he pull a Linc Chafee?  Time would tell.  Hey, if he pulls a Jim Jeffords- great!

Just because he votes conservative on some issues doesn't mean a thing to this guy. He'll do anything. Anything.

[Marokai Backbeat]

I'll say that this talk about Specter switching, while not all that serious right now, certainly shouldn't be dismissed. It's his only way of sticking around for another term. He won't win the primary and obviously won't win as an Independent. If he switches, he'd likely win the General and he'd give the Democrats their 60th seat. Just imagine the hell that would break loose.

And it's possible because, as we all know,  Arlen is all about Arlen...

Specter still votes conservative on some issues.  Would he pull a Linc Chafee?  Time would tell.  Hey, if he pulls a Jim Jeffords- great!

Specter may be conservative on crime and punishment, the war, taxes, trade, drilling, and gun control. But don't forget his liberal record on affirmative action and tort reform. These issues clearly make him a bleeding heart.

[Keystone Phil]

I'll say that this talk about Specter switching, while not all that serious right now, certainly shouldn't be dismissed. It's his only way of sticking around for another term. He won't win the primary and obviously won't win as an Independent. If he switches, he'd likely win the General and he'd give the Democrats their 60th seat. Just imagine the hell that would break loose.

And it's possible because, as we all know,  Arlen is all about Arlen...

Specter still votes conservative on some issues.  Would he pull a Linc Chafee?  Time would tell.  Hey, if he pulls a Jim Jeffords- great!

Specter may be conservative on crime and punishment, the war, taxes, trade, drilling, and gun control. But don't forget his liberal record on affirmative action and tort reform. These issues clearly make him a bleeding heart.

Don't troll here.

Flyers (who has a brain) will admit that Specter is a liberal on much more than that.

[Marokai Backbeat]

I'll say that this talk about Specter switching, while not all that serious right now, certainly shouldn't be dismissed. It's his only way of sticking around for another term. He won't win the primary and obviously won't win as an Independent. If he switches, he'd likely win the General and he'd give the Democrats their 60th seat. Just imagine the hell that would break loose.

And it's possible because, as we all know,  Arlen is all about Arlen...

Specter still votes conservative on some issues.  Would he pull a Linc Chafee?  Time would tell.  Hey, if he pulls a Jim Jeffords- great!

Specter may be conservative on crime and punishment, the war, taxes, trade, drilling, and gun control. But don't forget his liberal record on affirmative action and tort reform. These issues clearly make him a bleeding heart.

Don't troll here.

Flyers (who has a brain) will admit that Specter is a liberal on much more than that.

It's not trolling when you cite a source. It is trolling when you don't. You accuse me of dismissing issues and then post something like that. Try not going ad populum here too.

[TeePee4Prez]

I'll say that this talk about Specter switching, while not all that serious right now, certainly shouldn't be dismissed. It's his only way of sticking around for another term. He won't win the primary and obviously won't win as an Independent. If he switches, he'd likely win the General and he'd give the Democrats their 60th seat. Just imagine the hell that would break loose.

And it's possible because, as we all know,  Arlen is all about Arlen...

Specter still votes conservative on some issues.  Would he pull a Linc Chafee?  Time would tell.  Hey, if he pulls a Jim Jeffords- great!

Specter may be conservative on crime and punishment, the war, taxes, trade, drilling, and gun control. But don't forget his liberal record on affirmative action and tort reform. These issues clearly make him a bleeding heart.

Don't troll here.

Flyers (who has a brain) will admit that Specter is a liberal on much more than that.

I'd add reproudctive rights/choice (somewhat) and labor issues.  Even trade he voted nay on CAFTA.  Thing with him is you don't know where he's going and he'd give Democrats the chills on certain issues.  It seems in politics if someone bucks the party line an awful lot such as Nelson, Lieberman, Lugar, Hagel, McCain (until 2007), Snowe, Collins, and our subject Arlen, etc., they're more liked by the other party than their own because of the media attention paid to them.  The general public and even some people in here don't understand the totality of a candidate's voting record.  For instance, I would vote for Joe Lieberman over Ron Paul in a heartbeat because I know MOST of his views align with mine as opposed to Paul.  On the war and a few social issues, I'm 100% with Paul, but on other views I'm scared to death of him.

[Marokai Backbeat]

I'll say that this talk about Specter switching, while not all that serious right now, certainly shouldn't be dismissed. It's his only way of sticking around for another term. He won't win the primary and obviously won't win as an Independent. If he switches, he'd likely win the General and he'd give the Democrats their 60th seat. Just imagine the hell that would break loose.

And it's possible because, as we all know,  Arlen is all about Arlen...

Specter still votes conservative on some issues.  Would he pull a Linc Chafee?  Time would tell.  Hey, if he pulls a Jim Jeffords- great!

Specter may be conservative on crime and punishment, the war, taxes, trade, drilling, and gun control. But don't forget his liberal record on affirmative action and tort reform. These issues clearly make him a bleeding heart.

Don't troll here.

Flyers (who has a brain) will admit that Specter is a liberal on much more than that.

I'd add reproudctive rights/choice (somewhat) and labor issues.  Even trade he voted nay on CAFTA. 

Sure, while he voted aye on six other trade agreements.

[Keystone Phil]

I'll say that this talk about Specter switching, while not all that serious right now, certainly shouldn't be dismissed. It's his only way of sticking around for another term. He won't win the primary and obviously won't win as an Independent. If he switches, he'd likely win the General and he'd give the Democrats their 60th seat. Just imagine the hell that would break loose.

And it's possible because, as we all know,  Arlen is all about Arlen...

Specter still votes conservative on some issues.  Would he pull a Linc Chafee?  Time would tell.  Hey, if he pulls a Jim Jeffords- great!

Specter may be conservative on crime and punishment, the war, taxes, trade, drilling, and gun control. But don't forget his liberal record on affirmative action and tort reform. These issues clearly make him a bleeding heart.

Don't troll here.

Flyers (who has a brain) will admit that Specter is a liberal on much more than that.

I'd add reproudctive rights/choice (somewhat) and labor issues.  Even trade he voted nay on CAFTA. 

He's solidly Pro Choice (except for Partial Birth abortion but many Pro Choicers are against it). Maybe he's not 100% but pretty damn close.

He's also socially liberal on other issues but certain members don't consider those "real issues."

 

[Marokai Backbeat]

He favors civil unions... like you do.

[TeePee4Prez]

I'll say that this talk about Specter switching, while not all that serious right now, certainly shouldn't be dismissed. It's his only way of sticking around for another term. He won't win the primary and obviously won't win as an Independent. If he switches, he'd likely win the General and he'd give the Democrats their 60th seat. Just imagine the hell that would break loose.

And it's possible because, as we all know,  Arlen is all about Arlen...

Specter still votes conservative on some issues.  Would he pull a Linc Chafee?  Time would tell.  Hey, if he pulls a Jim Jeffords- great!

Specter may be conservative on crime and punishment, the war, taxes, trade, drilling, and gun control. But don't forget his liberal record on affirmative action and tort reform. These issues clearly make him a bleeding heart.

Don't troll here.

Flyers (who has a brain) will admit that Specter is a liberal on much more than that.

I'd add reproudctive rights/choice (somewhat) and labor issues.  Even trade he voted nay on CAFTA. 

He's solidly Pro Choice (except for Partial Birth abortion but many Pro Choicers are against it). Maybe he's not 100% but pretty damn close.

He's also socially liberal on other issues but certain members don't consider those "real issues."

 

I should rephrase as largely pro-choice, but IIRC there was an issue Specter was more conservative than me on and it wasn't partial birth.

Ok, there were probably a few more issues, but his ratings lean conservative.  If you feel the gamble's worth it with a more conservative candidate- give it a shot.  Was I happy with Casey Jr. saying he'd support Sam Alito's confirmation?  HELL NO, but I thought he was better than Rick Santorum.  So far though, I haven't had too many complaints with Casey except for his stem cell votes which.. yeah are close to non-negotiable for me for personal/medical reasons.   

[TeePee4Prez]

I'll say that this talk about Specter switching, while not all that serious right now, certainly shouldn't be dismissed. It's his only way of sticking around for another term. He won't win the primary and obviously won't win as an Independent. If he switches, he'd likely win the General and he'd give the Democrats their 60th seat. Just imagine the hell that would break loose.

And it's possible because, as we all know,  Arlen is all about Arlen...

Specter still votes conservative on some issues.  Would he pull a Linc Chafee?  Time would tell.  Hey, if he pulls a Jim Jeffords- great!

Specter may be conservative on crime and punishment, the war, taxes, trade, drilling, and gun control. But don't forget his liberal record on affirmative action and tort reform. These issues clearly make him a bleeding heart.

Don't troll here.

Flyers (who has a brain) will admit that Specter is a liberal on much more than that.

I'd add reproudctive rights/choice (somewhat) and labor issues.  Even trade he voted nay on CAFTA. 

Sure, while he voted aye on six other trade agreements.

Dude, I was just pointing out one thing.  Not like I love Arlen Specter, but his record is nearly dead center on both issues.  Just the facts, man!

[Marokai Backbeat]

I'll say that this talk about Specter switching, while not all that serious right now, certainly shouldn't be dismissed. It's his only way of sticking around for another term. He won't win the primary and obviously won't win as an Independent. If he switches, he'd likely win the General and he'd give the Democrats their 60th seat. Just imagine the hell that would break loose.

And it's possible because, as we all know,  Arlen is all about Arlen...

Specter still votes conservative on some issues.  Would he pull a Linc Chafee?  Time would tell.  Hey, if he pulls a Jim Jeffords- great!

Specter may be conservative on crime and punishment, the war, taxes, trade, drilling, and gun control. But don't forget his liberal record on affirmative action and tort reform. These issues clearly make him a bleeding heart.

Don't troll here.

Flyers (who has a brain) will admit that Specter is a liberal on much more than that.

I'd add reproudctive rights/choice (somewhat) and labor issues.  Even trade he voted nay on CAFTA. 

Sure, while he voted aye on six other trade agreements.

Dude, I was just pointing out one thing.  Not like I love Arlen Specter, but his record is nearly dead center on both issues.  Just the facts, man!

So I'm having trouble understanding. If he votes in favor of six trade agreements, and votes against one, he's a centrist?

[TeePee4Prez]

I'll say that this talk about Specter switching, while not all that serious right now, certainly shouldn't be dismissed. It's his only way of sticking around for another term. He won't win the primary and obviously won't win as an Independent. If he switches, he'd likely win the General and he'd give the Democrats their 60th seat. Just imagine the hell that would break loose.

And it's possible because, as we all know,  Arlen is all about Arlen...

Specter still votes conservative on some issues.  Would he pull a Linc Chafee?  Time would tell.  Hey, if he pulls a Jim Jeffords- great!

Specter may be conservative on crime and punishment, the war, taxes, trade, drilling, and gun control. But don't forget his liberal record on affirmative action and tort reform. These issues clearly make him a bleeding heart.

Don't troll here.

Flyers (who has a brain) will admit that Specter is a liberal on much more than that.

I'd add reproudctive rights/choice (somewhat) and labor issues.  Even trade he voted nay on CAFTA. 

Sure, while he voted aye on six other trade agreements.

Dude, I was just pointing out one thing.  Not like I love Arlen Specter, but his record is nearly dead center on both issues.  Just the facts, man!

So I'm having trouble understanding. If he votes in favor of six trade agreements, and votes against one, he's a centrist?

Ok, center-right maybe a hair more than Snowe or Collins.  He's a dying breed of sane Republicans. 

[Keystone Phil]

He favors civil unions... like you do.

Uh...ok? Do you realize why you're terrible at debating yet?

Ok, center-right maybe a hair more than Snowe or Collins.  He's a dying breed of sane Republicans. 

The point that this other one is trying to make is that Specter isn't a liberal. Whatever. I don't agree. At the same time, though, he claims that Specter is conservative on a "wide variety" of issues/not even a moderate. That's just silly but predictable at this point. He likes to be a pain in the ass. Just let him do his thing and he'll eventually disappear.

[Marokai Backbeat]

He favors civil unions... like you do.

Uh...ok? Do you realize why you're terrible at debating yet?

I forgot I have to explain everything to you. The point is that he has a liberal social position that you also yourself hold. I understand you strongly dislike Arlen Specter but don't lump in liberal positions that you yourself agree with as more evidence of why he is dangerously "liberal."

[Keystone Phil]

He favors civil unions... like you do.

Uh...ok? Do you realize why you're terrible at debating yet?

I forgot I have to explain everything to you. The point is that he has a liberal social position that you also yourself hold. I understand you strongly dislike Arlen Specter but don't lump in liberal positions that you yourself agree with as more evidence of why he is dangerously "liberal."

Haha, look at the children play!

Yeah, I understand you were saying it's a liberal social position. The difference is that that is one example for me and several for Specter.

Also, stop being disingenuous. I never, ever, ever once used this issue as a reason why he's "dangerously liberal." Not once. In fact, I gave him credit for not supporting gay marriage. Feel free to stop lying whenever you'd like.

[Keystone Phil]

Another person who would have definitely beaten Specter - http://www.timesleader.com/news/Barletta_ready_to_inspire_GOP_03-04-2009.html

He wasn't going to run anyway but all of these people saying that they won't run is a great run up to a Toomey announcement.

Speaking of which, expect an announcement on March 28th. Toomey will be the Keynote Speaker at the Pennsylvania Leadership Conference (no, not that type, Josh) in Harrisburg. It's going to be wild. I will probably be in attendance. 

[Keystone Phil]

Just to make it especially clear now...

This is where I'll go to basically talk to myself.    Keep an eye on this thread, though, since I'm going to be posting some inside, but not secret, information about the race.

[Southern Senator North Carolina Yankee]

Just to make it especially clear now...

This is where I'll go to basically talk to myself.    Keep an eye on this thread, though, since I'm going to be posting some inside, but not secret, information about the race.

If I had more time this week you wouldn't be talking to yourself but I have been to busy with real world matters. Pat Toomey reminds of me of an Elvis song. Every time we hear speculation he is running he distances himself from the race "he's got me going up, he's got me going down". I up this time we are up and correctly so.