Roe v Wade
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Author Topic: Roe v Wade  (Read 2542 times)
k-onmmunist
Winston Disraeli
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« on: March 01, 2010, 06:37:00 AM »
Go.
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Obnoxiously Slutty Girly Girl
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« Reply #1 on: March 01, 2010, 07:47:32 AM »
Unsound. (Sane)
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President Mitt
Giovanni
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« Reply #2 on: March 01, 2010, 08:05:46 AM »
Sound (Libertarian)
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Franzl
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« Reply #3 on: March 01, 2010, 08:08:06 AM »
Unsound (pro-choice)
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k-onmmunist
Winston Disraeli
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« Reply #4 on: March 01, 2010, 08:08:30 AM »
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Obnoxiously Slutty Girly Girl
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« Reply #5 on: March 01, 2010, 08:08:45 AM »

Ridiculous. Huh
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Mechaman
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« Reply #6 on: March 01, 2010, 08:09:01 AM »
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Antonio the Sixth
Antonio V
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« Reply #7 on: March 01, 2010, 01:16:06 PM »

Why ? Huh
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Beet
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« Reply #8 on: March 01, 2010, 01:56:06 PM »
Sound.
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k-onmmunist
Winston Disraeli
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« Reply #9 on: March 01, 2010, 02:23:54 PM »

Abortion bans were ruled unconstitutional on grounds that basically don't exist. I don't know how anyone who reads the 14th Amendment could have got that idea.
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Franzl
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« Reply #10 on: March 01, 2010, 02:40:43 PM »

I think applying the 14th amendment to abortion is quite a big stretch.....and not really what the Constitution was intended to mean.

It may be the "right" decision policy wise, but I personally don't accept the legal reasoning.
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Beet
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« Reply #11 on: March 01, 2010, 02:45:51 PM »
I continue to maintain the operative case is Griswold v Connecticut, which established the privacy penumbra, not Roe v Wade. If you accept Griswold as precedent it's virtually impossible not to accept Roe. And Griswold is quite deeply embedded. The only reason why it goes no attention is because it's not directly associated with a hot button political issue.
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Antonio the Sixth
Antonio V
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« Reply #12 on: March 01, 2010, 04:16:46 PM »
Quote from: SoFA Franzl on March 01, 2010, 02:40:43 PM

I think applying the 14th amendment to abortion is quite a big stretch.....and not really what the Constitution was intended to mean.

It may be the "right" decision policy wise, but I personally don't accept the legal reasoning.

The 14th Amendment deals with racial equality, right ? If we extend equality to sex, it can make sense IMO. Isn't forbidding abortion a discrimination toward women in some way ?
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k-onmmunist
Winston Disraeli
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« Reply #13 on: March 01, 2010, 04:23:45 PM »
I find it very hard to read anything in there that could even qualify as that. The Equal Rights Amendment might have dealt with this, but it was never passed.
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Franzl
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« Reply #14 on: March 01, 2010, 04:35:10 PM »
Quote from: Antonio V on March 01, 2010, 04:16:46 PM
Quote from: SoFA Franzl on March 01, 2010, 02:40:43 PM

I think applying the 14th amendment to abortion is quite a big stretch.....and not really what the Constitution was intended to mean.

It may be the "right" decision policy wise, but I personally don't accept the legal reasoning.

The 14th Amendment deals with racial equality, right ? If we extend equality to sex, it can make sense IMO. Isn't forbidding abortion a discrimination toward women in some way ?

I would say no, personally. Men aren't biologically capable of becoming pregnant. That inequality comes from nature.

You can just as easily say abortions are illegal for all people.....how would that violate equal protection?
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Antonio the Sixth
Antonio V
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« Reply #15 on: March 01, 2010, 04:39:22 PM »
Quote from: SoFA Franzl on March 01, 2010, 04:35:10 PM
Quote from: Antonio V on March 01, 2010, 04:16:46 PM
Quote from: SoFA Franzl on March 01, 2010, 02:40:43 PM

I think applying the 14th amendment to abortion is quite a big stretch.....and not really what the Constitution was intended to mean.

It may be the "right" decision policy wise, but I personally don't accept the legal reasoning.

The 14th Amendment deals with racial equality, right ? If we extend equality to sex, it can make sense IMO. Isn't forbidding abortion a discrimination toward women in some way ?

I would say no, personally. Men aren't biologically capable of becoming pregnant. That inequality comes from nature.

You can just as easily say abortions are illegal for all people.....how would that violate equal protection?

It's debatable. Who says that the only unequalities we should fight against are unnatural ones ? For example, the inequality between a handicapped man and one who isn't is natural, but we still try to correct it by building appropriate infrastructures and  punishing employment discriminations.
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Franzl
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« Reply #16 on: March 01, 2010, 04:43:29 PM »
That's true....but I still see a difference there. By helping people with disabilities, we're ensuring equal access and opportunity (in theory at least).

If we ban abortion....no person is able to get one (in theory again). It's not discriminatory against any particular group of persons. By giving women the right to abort, you're not giving them equality in the sense that they're getting a right that other people (men) have.

I understand your point of view, just to be clear.
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Antonio the Sixth
Antonio V
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« Reply #17 on: March 01, 2010, 05:08:02 PM »
Well, I understand yours too. It's all a question of points of view.

But since the result is a neat gain in freedom, I'm not gonna complain for that. Wink
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Filuwaúrdjan
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« Reply #18 on: March 01, 2010, 07:13:56 PM »
Legally dubious and politically foolish. The first point doesn't matter so much as U.S abortion law is (IIRC) now based on another decision. The second stands. Of course, the eventual outcome (in all ways) was and is very, very American.

Of course, I wouldn't much like it even if it was legally sound and politically clever. But you all knew that anyway Tongue
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Bo
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« Reply #19 on: March 01, 2010, 11:07:54 PM »
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MASHED POTATOES. VOTE!
Kalwejt
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« Reply #20 on: March 02, 2010, 06:24:40 AM »

Yes, everyone who don't agree with you even on one issue cannot be libertarians. Long live ideological purity!
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Obnoxiously Slutty Girly Girl
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« Reply #21 on: March 02, 2010, 08:15:33 AM »
Quote from: Northeast Representative Uncle Saddam (JCP-RI) on March 02, 2010, 06:24:40 AM

Yes, everyone who don't agree with you even on one issue cannot be libertarians. Long live ideological purity!

Yeah, thanks for re-iterating to Giovanni how ridiculous he sounded.
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Franzl
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« Reply #22 on: March 02, 2010, 10:34:18 AM »
Quote from: Lt. Gov and Rep. Libertas on March 02, 2010, 08:15:33 AM
Quote from: Northeast Representative Uncle Saddam (JCP-RI) on March 02, 2010, 06:24:40 AM

Yes, everyone who don't agree with you even on one issue cannot be libertarians. Long live ideological purity!

Yeah, thanks for re-iterating to Giovanni how ridiculous he sounded.

lol
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shua
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« Reply #23 on: March 07, 2010, 01:20:21 AM »
unsound, unscientific and indecipherable.
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