Opinion of the Irish government during WWII

[RosettaStoned]

Cowards.

Wasn't Russia sending supply trains to Germany up until the very moment Hitler invaded?

Whats your point?

[12th Doctor]

Cowards.

Wasn't Russia sending supply trains to Germany up until the very moment Hitler invaded?

Whats your point?

That the Russians wouldn't have fought either, indeed, were perfectly willing to support Hitler, until Hitler attacked them.

[RosettaStoned]

Cowards.

Wasn't Russia sending supply trains to Germany up until the very moment Hitler invaded?

Whats your point?

That the Russians wouldn't have fought either, indeed, were perfectly willing to support Hitler, until Hitler attacked them.

Actually we won the war.

[12th Doctor]

Cowards.

Wasn't Russia sending supply trains to Germany up until the very moment Hitler invaded?

Whats your point?

That the Russians wouldn't have fought either, indeed, were perfectly willing to support Hitler, until Hitler attacked them.

Actually we won the war.

Well... not only does that have nothing to do with the point, but had the United State not been feeding your asses, then if would have been hard for you to fight.  Moreover, if the British not have obliterated the Luftwaffe, and knocked the Nazi invasion schedule off several weeks, then the Germans would have steamrolled you guys over pretty quick.

[12th Doctor]

But, I'll bet they didn't teach you that in Soviet school

[RosettaStoned]

Cowards.

Wasn't Russia sending supply trains to Germany up until the very moment Hitler invaded?

Whats your point?

That the Russians wouldn't have fought either, indeed, were perfectly willing to support Hitler, until Hitler attacked them.

Actually we won the war.

Well... not only does that have nothing to do with the point, but had the United State not been feeding your asses, then if would have been hard for you to fight.  Moreover, if the British not have obliterated the Luftwaffe, and knocked the Nazi invasion schedule off several weeks, then the Germans would have steamrolled you guys over pretty quick.

Lets say the fascists took Moscow. They would have had guerilla warfare to deal with far worse than Vietnam was for you guys.

[RosettaStoned]

But, I'll bet they didn't teach you that in Soviet school

Nice try.

[12th Doctor]

Cowards.

Wasn't Russia sending supply trains to Germany up until the very moment Hitler invaded?

Whats your point?

That the Russians wouldn't have fought either, indeed, were perfectly willing to support Hitler, until Hitler attacked them.

Actually we won the war.

Well... not only does that have nothing to do with the point, but had the United State not been feeding your asses, then if would have been hard for you to fight.  Moreover, if the British not have obliterated the Luftwaffe, and knocked the Nazi invasion schedule off several weeks, then the Germans would have steamrolled you guys over pretty quick.

Lets say the fascists took Moscow. They would have had guerilla warfare to deal with far worse than Vietnam was for you guys.

While this still has absolutely nothing to do with the point (total non-sequitur on your part)... what, exactly would that matter?  You still would not have defeated the Nazis.

The other recent historical myth that confounds me is this notion that the Soviet Union could have utterly defeated Germany on their own.  Never could have happened.  Even if the Soviet Union had not surrendered, if the Nazis had destroyed the Red Army, driven on the Urals, etc, then it would have been very difficult for the Soviets to drive the Germans back out of the country.

And I question your basic assumption, as well.  Soviet resistance behind the line in real life was relatively insignificant compared to what was going on at the front.

[12th Doctor]

And you still have failed to address the point that the Russians were no less cowardly, and in fact, were worse than the Irish.

Russia was allied with Germany.  They had a deal with the Germans to duel up Eastern Europe.  How is it you have so much "Russian Pride" but can criticize Ireland, or Western "cowards"?

[RosettaStoned]

And you still have failed to address the point that the Russians were no less cowardly, and in fact, were worse than the Irish.

Russia was allied with Germany.  They had a deal with the Germans to duel up Eastern Europe.  How is it you have so much "Russian Pride" but can criticize Ireland, or Western "cowards"?

Oh right, we're the cowards. All we did was defend our homeland. While your country was safe thousands of miles away from danger.

[Lunar]

The use of that phrase on this forum was pretty much non-existant until it's introduction by Straha.

HP and miserable, worthless cowards. Furthermore their Prime Minister (or whatever word they use for that) actually sent some message of condolene after Hitler's death!

Ireland in WWII = epic fail.

Hmmm.. I believe our navy at the time consisted our precisely five dinghies, two rowing boats (but with only one oar between them) and a rubber duck... which would have been an interesting match for Die Kriegsmarine.

And how about Norway?

Norway declared war on Germany?

The only two countries that actually declared war on Germany in the entire war were England and France, IIRC, and at the time of the declaration, neither had any intention of following through on it.

Yo, I know.  Wasn't a serious question.  I don't see how Norway showed up Ireland though.

[pbrower2a]

Cowards.

Wasn't Russia sending supply trains to Germany up until the very moment Hitler invaded?

Whats your point?

That was the choice of Stalin, and not of the peoples of the USSR.

I think that Stalin was waiting for Britain or Germany to collapse so that he could pick up the pieces -- like India if the collapse was by Britain, or eastern Europe if the collapse were by Nazi Germany.

[12th Doctor]

And you still have failed to address the point that the Russians were no less cowardly, and in fact, were worse than the Irish.

Russia was allied with Germany.  They had a deal with the Germans to duel up Eastern Europe.  How is it you have so much "Russian Pride" but can criticize Ireland, or Western "cowards"?

Oh right, we're the cowards. All we did was defend our homeland. While your country was safe thousands of miles away from danger.

I didn't say that the Russians were cowards, did I?  I said that, if you are going to call this Irish cowards for their neutrality then surely you must hold the Russians to the same standard.

You are the one throwing stones here.  You also happen to be the one in the glass house.  You figure it out.

[dead0man]

I must say he is very good at not getting your point.  Or at least he is doing a hell of a job avoiding it.

[12th Doctor]

Who do I blame for the rise of Nazism and the severity of the Second World War?  

All of humanity.  

There were plenty of people all over the world who could have stopped Hitler, or at least stopped the situation from become as bad as it was.

There is something in the human experience that leads to scapegoating, and fear mongering.  There is something in the human experience that makes people think "not my problem".  There is something in the human experience that leads people to sellout other people, and their values for a little bit of temporary peace and security and I dare say comfort.

Then, you have the other side of humanity.  Thank God the there were a handful of influential people who were still ruled by that side.

[RosettaStoned]

Who do I blame for the rise of Nazism and the severity of the Second World War?  

All of humanity.  

There were plenty of people all over the world who could have stopped Hitler, or at least stopped the situation from become as bad as it was.

There is something in the human experience that leads to scapegoating, and fear mongering.  There is something in the human experience that makes people think "not my problem".  There is something in the human experience that leads people to sellout other people, and their values for a little bit of temporary peace and security and I dare say comfort.

Then, you have the other side of humanity.  Thank God the there were a handful of influential people who were still ruled by that side.

Thats fair.

[12th Doctor]

Who do I blame for the rise of Nazism and the severity of the Second World War?  

All of humanity.  

There were plenty of people all over the world who could have stopped Hitler, or at least stopped the situation from become as bad as it was.

There is something in the human experience that leads to scapegoating, and fear mongering.  There is something in the human experience that makes people think "not my problem".  There is something in the human experience that leads people to sellout other people, and their values for a little bit of temporary peace and security and I dare say comfort.

Then, you have the other side of humanity.  Thank God the there were a handful of influential people who were still ruled by that side.

Thats fair.

The might be the fastest change of heart in the history of cardiac shifting.

But, I'll accept it and move on.

[I spent the winter writing songs about getting better]

The Russians, along with Sweden and Switzerland, never did any mourning for Hitler.

[12th Doctor]

The Russians, along with Sweden and Switzerland, never did any mourning for Hitler.

Seriously, if you think you are going to provoke me, you aren't because you just look like a total idiot.

[I spent the winter writing songs about getting better]

It's a historical fact. Irish PM gave a message of condolences over Hitler's death.

BTW:

Moreover, if the British not have obliterated the Luftwaffe, and knocked the Nazi invasion schedule off several weeks, then the Germans would have steamrolled you guys over pretty quick.

Ooooh, but I thought those British were just evil imperialist thugs who all deserve to get blown up to the last person because they continue to occupy a small part of our glorious nation that my ancestors were forced out of centuries ago and that I've never been to but supposedly have some valid grudge, blah blah blah...OK, impression over.

[12th Doctor]

It's a historical fact. Irish PM gave a message of condolences over Hitler's death.

BTW:

Moreover, if the British not have obliterated the Luftwaffe, and knocked the Nazi invasion schedule off several weeks, then the Germans would have steamrolled you guys over pretty quick.

Ooooh, but I thought those British were just evil imperialist thugs who all deserve to get blown up to the last person because they continue to occupy a small part of our glorious nation that my ancestors were forced out of centuries ago and that I've never been to but supposedly have some valid grudge, blah blah blah...OK, impression over.

1) He did so against the advice of almost everyone else in the Irish government.

2) Perhaps you should look at my posts in which I called the IRA a terrorist organization.  But, wait, you did see them, because you commented on them.  So you are just a stupid, petty, little, poser, ignorant, asshole, mother f**ker.  It would be beneath the dignity of anyone to have to take you seriously, and no one does, so I could personally care less what you have to say.

[GMantis]

Well... not only does that have nothing to do with the point, but had the United State not been feeding your asses, then if would have been hard for you to fight.  Moreover, if the British not have obliterated the Luftwaffe, and knocked the Nazi invasion schedule off several weeks, then the Germans would have steamrolled you guys over pretty quick.

Actually, during the crucial period in which the Soviet Union stopped the German invasion - up to the battle of Stalingrad, allied supplies were much less than in the later period. After all, this was the "happy times" for the German submarines and convoys for the Soviet union were stopped altogether a few times in 1942. So the Soviet Union survived mostly on their own. The supplies undoubtedly speeded up the subsequent Soviet advances, but they've probably could have won without them, though it would have taken far longer and with far greater casualties.
The British severely damaged the Luftwaffe, but certainly didn't obliterate it, considering how it managed to destroy most the Soviet airforce on the ground on the first day of the invasion.
And the delay in the spring of 1941 was not so much because of the British, but because the Serbs, whom you hate so much, refused to bow to Hitler.
In any case, even if the Germans had reached Moscow, they wouldn't have taken it easily. The city was very strongly fortified and would have been an ideal trap for the German army, until the reserves from Siberia arrived. And with Hitler's unwillingness to retreat, you can easily imagine what would have happened.
The Russian idea that they could have won on their own is probably untrue (unless the invasion is not surprising). Of course, the even more doubtfull idea that the US could have won on their own (or even that they did win on their own) is rather popular in the US, so Russia isn't the only country with myths about WWII.

And I question your basic assumption, as well.  Soviet resistance behind the line in real life was relatively insignificant compared to what was going on at the front.

Soviet resistance tied up probably more German divisions than were tied (until 1943, at least) in France.

But, I'll bet they didn't teach you that in Soviet school

Soviet schools, though unfortunately burdened with foolish ideologies, still managed to achieve more in 10 years than US schools manage in 12. So your jab sounds rather foolish.

[Filuwaúrdjan]

Russia isn't the only country with myths about WWII.

Every country involved in it has myths about it...

[I spent the winter writing songs about getting better]

It's a historical fact. Irish PM gave a message of condolences over Hitler's death.

BTW:

Moreover, if the British not have obliterated the Luftwaffe, and knocked the Nazi invasion schedule off several weeks, then the Germans would have steamrolled you guys over pretty quick.

Ooooh, but I thought those British were just evil imperialist thugs who all deserve to get blown up to the last person because they continue to occupy a small part of our glorious nation that my ancestors were forced out of centuries ago and that I've never been to but supposedly have some valid grudge, blah blah blah...OK, impression over.

1) He did so against the advice of almost everyone else in the Irish government.

2) Perhaps you should look at my posts in which I called the IRA a terrorist organization.  But, wait, you did see them, because you commented on them.  So you are just a stupid, petty, little, poser, ignorant, asshole, mother f**ker.  It would be beneath the dignity of anyone to have to take you seriously, and no one does, so I could personally care less what you have to say.

I was not referring to you in that post, or even anyone in particular. Rather just the many whiny Irish-Americans I've heard.

[12th Doctor]

It's a historical fact. Irish PM gave a message of condolences over Hitler's death.

BTW:

Moreover, if the British not have obliterated the Luftwaffe, and knocked the Nazi invasion schedule off several weeks, then the Germans would have steamrolled you guys over pretty quick.

Ooooh, but I thought those British were just evil imperialist thugs who all deserve to get blown up to the last person because they continue to occupy a small part of our glorious nation that my ancestors were forced out of centuries ago and that I've never been to but supposedly have some valid grudge, blah blah blah...OK, impression over.

1) He did so against the advice of almost everyone else in the Irish government.

2) Perhaps you should look at my posts in which I called the IRA a terrorist organization.  But, wait, you did see them, because you commented on them.  So you are just a stupid, petty, little, poser, ignorant, asshole, mother f**ker.  It would be beneath the dignity of anyone to have to take you seriously, and no one does, so I could personally care less what you have to say.

I was not referring to you in that post, or even anyone in particular. Rather just the many whiny Irish-Americans I've heard.

First off, you came out of nowhere with one of my posts, totally unrelated to what was being said, so I am pretty sure that your aim was to try to piss me off, regardless of who you were "parodying".

Second, I don't talk like that.  No one else on the forum talks like that.  So there is no reason to mock us like that.

Third, you are trivializing alot of real human suffering that went on by doing that.  Do you have any idea how bad English rule was in Ireland?  Do you have idea how bad the potato famine was?  It's almost as bad as trivializing the Holocaust.  Regardless of the over-the-top feelings of some people, mocking it is completely uncalled for.

You are a real piece of sh**t, you know that?  You will post your ass off about how great this group of people, or that group of people is, no matter what horrible things they have done, because their "ideals" match up with your own.  But just because a country is Catholic, you don't like those people.  You mock them.  You trivialize their suffering.  And on and on.

You have a real problem.  It's pathological.  I have been informed that it is not limited to the forum.  Seek help.