Australian Election 2004 Results Thread

[??????????]

Come on, are you seriously going to tell me Jefferson Davis was NOT an anti-semite?

Judah P. Benjamen (A southern Jew) was one of top cabinet members of the Davis Administration. Plus, the south had a higher population of Jews then the north did in 1860. Mostly because bigoted ant-semites ran the Jews out of cities such as New York, Boston and other large northern cities.

And of course the all important :

[NYGOP]

Come on, are you seriously going to tell me Jefferson Davis was NOT an anti-semite?

The thousands of Jews who fought for the confederacy didn't seem to think so, or if they did they didn't mind. There is no record of discrimination against Jews in the old South. The same can't be said for in New England. By General Lee's orders, the Jews were permitted to observe thier holy days and abstain from fighting on Yom Kippur and Rosh Hashanah.

I am a Jew and see nothing wrong, or anti-semetic, with States Rights's virginia/west virginia avatar in his signature.

I do see something wrong with you calling Jews fascists. As well as with your comments saying "Jews and the rest of us".

[TheCommentator]

Complete BS if you look at most confederate supporting groups today.

[??????????]

Complete BS if you look at most confederate supporting groups today.

The KKK is not a confederate supporting group.

[TheCommentator]

Complete BS if you look at most confederate supporting groups today.

The KKK is not a confederate supporting group.

Then why was it founded from former confederates?

[KEmperor]

Hugh, Baggy Green, it looks like the Anti-Semites and the Confederacy supporters have hijacked your thread.  I apologize for them, especially the troll we appear to have acquired (AL098).

[TheCommentator]

Come on, are you seriously going to tell me Jefferson Davis was NOT an anti-semite?

I do see something wrong with you calling Jews fascists. As well as with your comments saying "Jews and the rest of us".

I take back that remark, it was more directed towards the idea of wanting to invade countries left and right that have done nothing to you.

[??????????]

Complete BS if you look at most confederate supporting groups today.

The KKK is not a confederate supporting group.

Then why was it founded from former confederates?

Their have been three official KKKs. The first one (which you are referring to) was a veterans organization established to provide monetary aid to confederate veterans and their families. They were banned after reconstruction and came back again in 1916. They were 'refounded' on stone mountain, georgia and their goal was to suppress the black vote throughout the south. Their organization was up to almost 20 million members during the 1920s. One of the top leaders of the Klan was accused and convicted of rape. The organization quickly lost credibility and disbanded. It was reformed again in the late 40s as a response to segregation.

[patrick1]

Come on, are you seriously going to tell me Jefferson Davis was NOT an anti-semite?

I do see something wrong with you calling Jews fascists. As well as with your comments saying "Jews and the rest of us".

I take back that remark, it was more directed towards the idea of wanting to invade countries left and right that have done nothing to you.

Done nothing but invade your country.  Israel has fought defensive wars.    They struck first in the six days war because Egypt was massing their troops on the border and about to invade.

[TheCommentator]

Complete BS if you look at most confederate supporting groups today.

The KKK is not a confederate supporting group.

Then why was it founded from former confederates?

Their have been three official KKKs. The first one (which you are referring to) was a veterans organization established to provide monetary aid to confederate veterans and their families. They were banned after reconstruction and came back again in 1916. They were 'refounded' on stone mountain, georgia and their goal was to suppress the black vote throughout the south. Their organization was up to almost 20 million members during the 1920s. One of the top leaders of the Klan was accused and convicted of rape. The organization quickly lost credibility and disbanded. It was reformed again in the late 40s as a response to segregation.

Yes and all of them were/are directed at bigotry against blacks, Catholics and JEWS.

[??????????]

Complete BS if you look at most confederate supporting groups today.

The KKK is not a confederate supporting group.

Then why was it founded from former confederates?

Their have been three official KKKs. The first one (which you are referring to) was a veterans organization established to provide monetary aid to confederate veterans and their families. They were banned after reconstruction and came back again in 1916. They were 'refounded' on stone mountain, georgia and their goal was to suppress the black vote throughout the south. Their organization was up to almost 20 million members during the 1920s. One of the top leaders of the Klan was accused and convicted of rape. The organization quickly lost credibility and disbanded. It was reformed again in the late 40s as a response to segregation.

Yes and all of them were/are directed at bigotry against blacks, Catholics and JEWS.

Obviously you can't/didn't read what I posted. The first KKK was not established for hateful reasons. Get a clue. Pick up a history book. Stop wasting my time and start a thread if you want to discuss this as this has nothing to do with Australia.

[TheCommentator]

Come on, are you seriously going to tell me Jefferson Davis was NOT an anti-semite?

I do see something wrong with you calling Jews fascists. As well as with your comments saying "Jews and the rest of us".

I take back that remark, it was more directed towards the idea of wanting to invade countries left and right that have done nothing to you.

Done nothing but invade your country.  Israel has fought defensive wars.    They struck first in the six days war because Egypt was massing their troops on the border and about to invade.

They are not invading now, that was a long time ago. Iran never invaded Israel.

[TheCommentator]

The first KKK was not established for hateful reasons.

LOL. Somehow I do not believe that. In any case, we agree this has nothing to do with Australia. So this convesation will end.

[NYGOP]

Complete BS if you look at most confederate supporting groups today.

The KKK is not a confederate supporting group.

Then why was it founded from former confederates?

Their have been three official KKKs. The first one (which you are referring to) was a veterans organization established to provide monetary aid to confederate veterans and their families. They were banned after reconstruction and came back again in 1916. They were 'refounded' on stone mountain, georgia and their goal was to suppress the black vote throughout the south. Their organization was up to almost 20 million members during the 1920s. One of the top leaders of the Klan was accused and convicted of rape. The organization quickly lost credibility and disbanded. It was reformed again in the late 40s as a response to segregation.

Yes and all of them were/are directed at bigotry against blacks, Catholics and JEWS.

Actually no. Only the latter two were founded on rascist ideologies. None of them were good however.

I teach HISTORY for a living, I'm not saying this stuff to be argumentative. I dislike the Confederacy and hate slavery as much as the next guy, but don't try to pass things off that are simply untrue.

[NYGOP]

Iran never invaded Israel.

When did Israel invade Iran exactly? Israel simply took out thier nuclear capability. If they hadn't done that you might be dead right now. It was a brilliant and justified action.

[patrick1]

Come on, are you seriously going to tell me Jefferson Davis was NOT an anti-semite?

I do see something wrong with you calling Jews fascists. As well as with your comments saying "Jews and the rest of us".

I take back that remark, it was more directed towards the idea of wanting to invade countries left and right that have done nothing to you.

Done nothing but invade your country.  Israel has fought defensive wars.    They struck first in the six days war because Egypt was massing their troops on the border and about to invade.

They are not invading now, that was a long time ago. Iran never invaded Israel.

Technically no that have not.  Realistically yes they have and are continuing to.  Iran has sponsored terrorists that have killed hundreds of Israeli citizens.  You are wrong.

[M]

First off, I personally have Confederate Jewish ancestors, thank you very much. Including one great-great something that was a blockade runner out of Charleston.

The fascism quote is incredible and warrants no serious comment. How is StatesRights anti-semitic because of questions about the constitutionality of West Virginia? I don't have a clue what you are talking about.

I am a hawk, yes. Right-wing? Not particularly, on domestic issues I'm a left-leaning moderate.

There have basically been several KKKs. NB Forrest's original was not primarily a hate organization, but a serious protest of Reconstruction policies. It grew darker over time. The 1920s and 1960s KKK have nothing to do with Jefferson Davis. I have also never seen any evidence that Davis was any sort of anti-semite.

Israel actually took out IraQi, not IraNian, nuclear capabilities in 1981, in a daring flight ordered b PM Begin and Def Min Sharon, and executed brilliantly by Col. Ilan Ramon, later the first Israeli astronaut, killed in the Columbia tragedy.

Iran currently has complete control of the international terror network, including Hezbollah and Al-Qaeda. The big problem is the bomb,  but it will probably not be justified beforehand, I foresee a major primarily aerial campaign carried out by the US and some allies in the near future. If it does not happen (though I think it will, especially under Bush), the Israelis will take it upon themselves. It will be a LOT harder than Osirak, but it can and will be done.

[AuH2O]

There were more Jews (1) in the Confederate cabinet than in the Northern cabinet.

[Platypus]

Bringing it back to AUS-my local member (Michael Danby-ALP) is the only Jew in parliament. He was up against David Southwick for the Liberals, who is also Jewish.

[Baggy Green]

Hughento, what happened to your beloved Democrats? They had a rather bad meltdown, eh?

[Platypus]

yep, they had a near 8% swing against them in my seat

[Vasall des Midas]

yep, they had a near 8% swing against them in my seat

You got a clue where these votes went?

[Platypus]

about 4% to the Liberals; 2% to Labor and 2% to the Greens

[willhsmit]

Can anyone comment on whether postal votes in Australia are systematically different from the average vote (i.e., further right or left)?

I notice that the four closest seats are currently held by Labour, so it would seem like if there is no systematic tilt, then random chance would probably change at least one of them by the end of counting, and if the systematic tilt favors the Coalition, several of them might go over. On the other hand, if postal votes are more reliably Labour, no change probably.

[Platypus]

well, they don't have a definite pattern, but if you look at polling Latham was aherad before the election, whilst on the last few days that support eroded a bit. I'd be confident of Labor winning 3 of the 5 too close to calls, and would expect them to win all but Bonner at this stage.