UK General Discussion: 2017 and onwards, Mayhem

[cp]

I would imagine that's a comforting narrative to a Tory broadcaster, but May's job is 'impossible' because of her own decisions and botching an easy snap election, while I don't think it's fair to call Corbyn's job easy when he's under constant attack from parts of his parliamentary party, the majority of which opposed his election to the leadership.

Corbyn appears to be doing badly because he has poor media management.
May is doing badly because the actual policies she is implementing are either fundamentally unworkable or disastrous.

Agreed. It's worth pointing out that 'media management' for Corbyn is an order of magnitude more difficult than it is for most other politicians. Even Ed Milliband could get a few weeks of peace here and there. 

[EPG]

I would imagine that's a comforting narrative to a Tory broadcaster, but May's job is 'impossible' because of her own decisions and botching an easy snap election, while I don't think it's fair to call Corbyn's job easy when he's under constant attack from parts of his parliamentary party, the majority of which opposed his election to the leadership.

Corbyn appears to be doing badly because he has poor media management.
May is doing badly because the actual policies she is implementing are either fundamentally unworkable or disastrous.

He's under attack from his party because he says things like "Zionists live here probably their whole lives but don't understand English irony. They need lessons which we can help them with". Say this about any group other than Jews and he would be facing a leadership challenge. Some people think these true stories are invented to discredit their pope/king, but they are just slow learners who have failed to keep up with what he is actually like.

[Silent Hunter]

Yes, Corbyn has been handing this enemies the ammunition to attack him.

[🦀🎂🦀🎂]

You know what annoys me about this debate? It's typical British arrogance to believe we can do anything about this debate. The Israeli Palestinian debate is complicated and has broken the minds of all sorts of well meaning people trying to solve the problem; and us getting involved will neither help (in fact, both sides get off on international attention and would probably be best ignored). We are breaking the party apart for no reason.

[Filuwaúrdjan]

Quite so. And it's all even more embarrassing when you remember the historical British role in the region, but that's typical as well. Turns out the Left suffers from post Imperial delusion just as much as the Right, it's just that it manifests a little differently.

[Silent Hunter]

The Corbynistas will just claim that the Establishment blocked him, a la A Very British Coup.

[DaWN]

https://twitter.com/joanryanEnfield/status/1037827090723340289?s=19


https://twitter.com/tnewtondunn/status/1037846358902927360?s=19

A sad but wholly predictable state of affairs. Hopefully someone will say 'enough is enough' soon but I doubt it unfortunately.

[Zaybay]

https://twitter.com/theousherwood/status/1038003878917234688?s=19

^^ how did the culture of coverups and intimidation become so normal in the labour party?

This story is a huge stretch. Most of these  threats were posted by random posters online. How would Labour know about all of them, or even really care about them? The Republican and Democratic Party dont take a random twitter poster's anger seriously and put them on a list, and I dont think the Conservatives do either.

[Zaybay]

^
The church thing is pretty cool, it does seem like religion as a whole, except in the US, is taking up less and less of public and private life.

But about the party members, most are small ones in councils, or members of a local charter. This is like equating 2 state legislators in WY as being worthy of a national scandal. I would understand if people like a shadow secretary, or member of parliament was caught doing this, but it doesnt look like thats true, so I refer to my previous reasoning.

[Antonio the Sixth]

I find it hard as a leftist to celebrate the decline of religion in the West when it's obviously a symptom of the growing hegemony of neoliberal individualism and social atomization (the parallel with the decline of labor unions seems pretty striking, even if obviously there are differences). And the consequence is likely the continued appeal of populist demagogues, since a socially isolated individual lacks any other means to channel their anger.

[parochial boy]

I don't think that was Tony's point - more that the disappearance of social support structures leads to social atomisation and a sense of alienation and that, legacy of Thatcher, is something that in Britain is particularly acute.

I mean I'm not sad to see religion disappear, it's close to irrelevant in modern Europe, but there is a point about the decline of those rooted communities as a whole. it's obviously not just religion, you can ser it in the parts of France that have been secular for centuries, but where the support network offered by, among other things the Communist party, have disappeared and led to a sense of alienation that most strongly manifests itself in a strong Front National (sorry rassemblement national) vote

[Silent Hunter]

^^ most of the posters are labour party members

If they're not, then they should still be reported.

[Zaybay]

I personally would like Northern Ireland to reunite with the rest. Its just odd seeing Ireland split like that, and its clear that the union is becoming a hamper to Northern Ireland, and vice versa.

[Slow Learner]

Joan Ryan, Gavin Shuker, and Chris Leslie are like three of the most useless people in the Labour party.

[Filuwaúrdjan]

...everyone in the Labour Party needs to drink less and get more sleep.

[Silent Hunter]

One thing people are amazed with online is that women actually want to sleep with Boris Johnson...

[True Federalist (진정한 연방 주의자)]

One thing people are amazed with online is that women actually want to sleep with Boris Johnson...

"Power is the ultimate aphrodisiac." -- Henry Kissinger

[Slow Learner]

https://twitter.com/Gilofthepeople/status/1038726946522324992?s=19

[Silent Hunter]

Some unions have done this against directors recently too.

[Zaybay]

Glad that this thread has become "lets bash Labour for tiny things that the party activists have done".


Anyway, it does seem that Brexit is coming to a head in Northern Ireland, and more demonstrations are taking place for secession. And thanks to a negotiation made during the peace deal between the IRA and the UK, they could easily vote to succeed. I would not be surprised if we went back to the Old (and my favorite) English Jack before the incorporation of Ireland.

[Silent Hunter]

A majority just means 50% or more. It would be better to break down by actual percentages.

[Meclazine for Israel]

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2018/09/13/skripal-poisoning-suspects-claim-salisbury-visit-historical/

I think the Russian Spies saying that Salisbury is an inspiring place to visit as a tourist is a big development in the case that the UK are trying to put forward.

Legally, all you have to do now is to prove that Salisbury is the most boring place on Earth to negate their argument.

[🦀🎂🦀🎂]

In all fairness, tourists can be weird. I once met a family from the US who adamantly wanted to visit Staines, of all places. Not Thorpe Park (the theme park based in Staines) - the completely generic exurb best known for being the home of Ali G.

[Silent Hunter]

I've been to Salisbury myself on a rail tour. It does have a nice cathedral.

[cp]

It is nice. Jonathan Meades did a great documentary about it a few years back.