Pacific Council: Great Reform Amendment: Voting on an Amendment.

[PJ]

This text confuses me.  I thought we were going to create special elections for council vacancies?  Why would the Governor be appointing anyone via the first sentence?  This says, "The Governor may appoint".  So, I have discretion?

Also,  this text should be fixed.

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Fixed.


That simply means that they would appoint someone as interim council member until the special election.

[PJ]

This text confuses me.  I thought we were going to create special elections for council vacancies?  Why would the Governor be appointing anyone via the first sentence?  This says, "The Governor may appoint".  So, I have discretion?

Also,  this text should be fixed.

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Fixed.


That simply means that they would appoint someone as interim council member until the special election.

Cinci, do you find this amendment friendly?

[Cincinnatus]

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Is this agreeable?

[PJ]

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Is this agreeable?

Yeah that looks good. There were no objections from other councillors so this is now part of the amendment.

[Napoleon]

But where is The People?

[President Tyrion]

But where is The People?

Cinci didn't like the reference to The People

[Napoleon]

But where is The People?

Cinci didn't like the reference to The People

Yes, but his reasoning was flawed IMO.

Using The People in the Pacific constitution was wolfentoad's awful use of the concept, The People. 

Wolfentoad may have created a terrible constitution, but including The People in constitutions is a practice that dates back to my time in the Northeast and has a place in any decent constitution.

And for the sake of sanity, do not change the name of the region. That will almost certainly cause defeat, i believe. This is the People's Republic.

[President Tyrion]

Would people vote against a new constitution solely on the basis of pulling The People from the name?

[Napoleon]

Would people vote against a new constitution solely on the basis of pulling The People from the name?

Without question.

[PJ]

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[/quote]


Current text of the Constitution. The Bill of Rights Remains unchanged. We are ready for new amendments.

[Cincinnatus]

Someone should really take sponsorship of this...

[PJ]

Someone should really take sponsorship of this...

Oops! I will take sponsorship.

[Flake]

Can I co-sponsor?

[PJ]

Can I co-sponsor?

Yes. You are now the 6th sponsor of the bill.

[LastVoter]

This is an abomination. I will have some revisions later.

[Spamage]

What months are the gubernatorial elections supposed to take place, I'm unable to find it.

Also there's an error regarding the relationship between Article II and the dates specified in Article IV. Should not the text read like this in Article 2:

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[PJ]

What months are the gubernatorial elections supposed to take place, I'm unable to find it.

Also there's an error regarding the relationship between Article II and the dates specified in Article IV. Should not the text read like this in Article 2:

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Thanks for catching that spamage! I don't believe it is in the amendment. Amendment is friendly. Councillors have 24 to object. We do need gubernatorial election times though. How about December, April, and August?

This is an abomination. I will have some revisions later.

Okay, but don't expect us to wait a month for you to make your 'revisions.'

[President Tyrion]

I knew about the gubernatorial elections thing. I thought we would put it in once we sorted out the gubernatorial issues we have now. In any case, it would be fine to put it in now so we don't forget.

[PJ]

Bump

[DemPGH]

I like that Speaker must be a sitting Councillor.

I'm not a big fan of lifetime appointments (It's probably not unconstitutional, but it is borderline to have a lifetime regional appointment), and I think after a year or a set timespan the Pacific Justice should be "able to be reappointed for another term." I'm also not a big fan of requiring approval from the Pacific Justice to expel or impeach someone - seems like really broad powers. The Justice's job should be to decide if something is or is not in agreement with the Pacific Constitution.

[PJ]

I like that Speaker must be a sitting Councillor.

I'm not a big fan of lifetime appointments (It's probably not unconstitutional, but it is borderline to have a lifetime regional appointment), and I think after a year or a set timespan the Pacific Justice should be "able to be reappointed for another term." I'm also not a big fan of requiring approval from the Pacific Justice to expel or impeach someone - seems like really broad powers. The Justice's job should be to decide if something is or is not in agreement with the Pacific Constitution.

I agree with this, and I also think that if the Justice controls special elections, electoral irregularities cannot be fairly sorted out.

[DemPGH]

I hate the timeout feature here. Tried to post this earlier.

Anyway, let's try to approve this and then get to the earlier stuff.

Article V: The Pacific Justice

1. Judicial power will be vested in the Pacific Justice, who will be a Pacific citizen and the sole Justice on the Court, and serve for life a term of one year, after which he or she may be reappointed by the Governor to an additional term of one year, unless he/she resigns or otherwise leaves office. The Governor may elect to reappoint or dismiss the Justice at the conclusion of the term; if the Justice is reappointed, a hearing and vote must be held as if it were a new confirmation. The Justice may serve a total of no more than two consecutive terms unless no one else can be found. The Justice will start and operate in a new thread in the Regional Government boards, referred to hereafter as the Court thread.

2. The Justice will have the power to nullify or void a regional law if they he or she believes that it contradicts the regional or federal constitution. The Justice shall also arbitrate in Pacific election disputes. In such an instance the Justice must provide their reasoning reasons when issuing a ruling on either matter, citing the regional or federal constitution, in the Court thread.

3. The Justice will be appointed by the Governor and require confirmation by a majority vote of sitting Councilors present.

4. In the event of a majority of the Council voting to expel a Councilor, the Justice will be required to consent for the expulsion to take place.

5. In the event of a majority of the Council voting to impeach a Governor, the Justice will be required to consent for the expulsion to take place.

4. The Justice may be impeached with due cause - articles of impeachment may be brought by any Councilor or the Governor and, if voted on by the majority of the Council, the impeachment will proceed to a public vote. Should a majority of the public vote to impeach, the Justice will be immediately expelled from office and the Governor is free to appoint a new Justice. Such an impeachment vote will not for the purposes of this constitution be considered an "early election" or recall as prohibited by Article II.

[PJ]

Why not have a confirmation hearing at the beginning of each council session?

(Love your sig, btw)

[DemPGH]

Why not have a confirmation hearing at the beginning of each council session?

(Love your sig, btw)

Good idea. Should we just define a term that way, then? It would probably make more sense, I think. How many terms do you think would be reasonable for a limit?

[President Tyrion]

Having a confirmation hearing every two months might be unwieldy.