What exactly will Trump do to end democracy?

[Tekken_Guy]

People talk about how Trump returning to power is the end of democracy, but nobody can seem to explain how he’s going to do that. Would anyone care to elaborate?

[TheReckoning]

If America is to become an autocracy over the next couple decades, it will be from Democrats, not Republicans. This is not because Democrats are more inclined to make America autocratic- the opposite is true- but because they have the support required to make America autocratic (or at least, more support than Republicans do).

[ꙮ]

I don’t know if he’s going to do anything like that, but some actions well-within the realm of possibility given his previous statements and actions could include:

1. Attempting to overturn the results of elections that his side loses. See his actions between Election Day and certification in 2021 for examples. Actions could include pressuring Secretaries of State, county boards of elections, or state legislatures to change vote totals or invalidate elections.

2. Abusing pardon power to remove punishments for people who attempt to overturn elections. He’s already planning on pardoning all of the “1/6 political prisoners” if he returns to power. Such actions could also be used to remove consequences for state and local officials who attempt to illegally influence elections.

3. Changing laws to eliminate or substantially skew elections. He couldn’t do this directly, but he could make a strong push for it as the resurgent leader of the party. In the 2020 election transition period there were efforts in some states to change state laws to allow state legislatures to appoint their own slates of pro-Trump electors. None of those efforts succeeded, but not for lack of trying on Trump’s side. Trying to bait a supreme court case on equal population districts would be another possibility. Democrats would hardly control a state legislature outside the northeast if state senates were elected on a county by county basis, regardless of the popular vote margin.

4. Removing all of the “sane” people who restricted his worst impulses during his first term. This is something that I don’t think people are considering. For the most part the “mainstream” Republicans went along with the president, but there were a few key times Trump was actually held back from carrying out his most insane ideas. Imagine, for example, if Kristi Noem was VP instead of Mike Pence. She would have unquestioningly gone along with Trump’s insane idea that the VP could unilaterally reject the slates of electors during certification. That would have precipitated a true constitutional crisis on January 6 with the VP refusing to properly preside over the counting as required.

[Crumpets]

@realDonaldTrump
Happy 4th of July to everyone, even the losers and haters. Today I'm announcing the Official Repeal of American Democracy effective IMMEDIATELY. Keep America Great Forever! Thank you.

[T'Chenka]

If America is to become an autocracy over the next couple decades, it will be from Democrats, not Republicans. This is not because Democrats are more inclined to make America autocratic- the opposite is true- but because they have the support required to make America autocratic (or at least, more support than Republicans do).

This is maybe your worst post. The logic is lacking in a major way.

[TheReckoning]

If America is to become an autocracy over the next couple decades, it will be from Democrats, not Republicans. This is not because Democrats are more inclined to make America autocratic- the opposite is true- but because they have the support required to make America autocratic (or at least, more support than Republicans do).

This is maybe your worst post. The logic is lacking in a major way.

Autocratization happens easiest when a majority of people support the people doing the autocratization. It’s really, really hard for a minority of people in a democracy to install a dictatorship with them at the top, as a simple understanding of history would tell you.

[T'Chenka]

If America is to become an autocracy over the next couple decades, it will be from Democrats, not Republicans. This is not because Democrats are more inclined to make America autocratic- the opposite is true- but because they have the support required to make America autocratic (or at least, more support than Republicans do).

This is maybe your worst post. The logic is lacking in a major way.

Autocratization happens easiest when a majority of people support the people doing the autocratization. It’s really, really hard for a minority of people in a democracy to install a dictatorship with them at the top, as a simple understanding of history would tell you.

The Democratic Party has shown no interest in attacking democracy. They certainly like corruption, the status wuo, crushing progressives and anti-corruption candidates, and ensuring that the establishment stays in power over outsiders (within their own party). They usually vocally fight back against Republican attacks on democracy. They may be in a good position to do it, but that doesn't mean anything if they have zero intentions of pursuing it.

[the artist formerly known as catmusic]

As has been said, the main concern with upholding our (already fragile) democracy under a Trump admin has to do with the electoral process and bureaucratic functioning of government agencies. It's not that he's going to be Hitler and send everyone into camps, but that's a very narrow view of how fascism and anti-democratic governing works, especially in the 21st century where you can't hide things the same way you could 80/90 years ago.

I don't even think he's particularly inclined to do Viktor Orban style gerrymandering and various other weird fascist-lite policies. (The people he surrounds himself with in power might, though) I really think the problem is he is acting as a selfish and self-involved person. It's all about him, not about the country. So if someone says something he doesn't like, or disagrees with him, he feels no remorse about throwing them out even if it's a danger to the country. He doesn't like losing and he's going to call it rigged if he (or his proxy candidates) do not win their respective elections. He likes the drama and being the center of attention, so he'll get people to cause uprisings due to the "fraudulent" elections.

Trump has already created a guidebook for how to do things like this. Just look at Brazil after Lula was elected. Therein lies the danger. That's how there's the potential to end democracy. I don't know if he'd be successful per se either. It's just that there's the possibility. Personally, I think DeSantis or in the future a Josh Hawley type is far more dangerous to democracy.

[Person Man]

The end of American Democracy is kind of an abstract thing. A more interesting question is if democracy is functionally over, what comes next?


If Democracy ended, would the country continue to function with no established way from going from one regime to the next or determining which, if any, regime is actually in charge? Is our society that married to how it is governed? Would American culture be able to adapt fast enough to survive? We might not be talking about changing or ending Democracy. We might be talking about well… everyday until forever being Opposite Day.

[Del Tachi]

If America is to become an autocracy over the next couple decades, it will be from Democrats, not Republicans. This is not because Democrats are more inclined to make America autocratic- the opposite is true- but because they have the support required to make America autocratic (or at least, more support than Republicans do).

This is maybe your worst post. The logic is lacking in a major way.

Autocratization happens easiest when a majority of people support the people doing the autocratization. It’s really, really hard for a minority of people in a democracy to install a dictatorship with them at the top, as a simple understanding of history would tell you.

The Democratic Party has shown no interest in attacking democracy. They certainly like corruption, the status wuo, crushing progressives and anti-corruption candidates, and ensuring that the establishment stays in power over outsiders (within their own party). They usually vocally fight back against Republican attacks on democracy. They may be in a good position to do it, but that doesn't mean anything if they have zero intentions of pursuing it.

The Democrats' only coherent governing principle since Donald Trump was elected has been autocratization.  Their answer to the "threat" Trump poses to "democracy" is to preemptively attack and dismantle democracy on their own terms.  This attack takes many forms, some relatively benign (like suggesting we pack the Supreme Court), others more existential (extreme scientism and technocracy.)

It's uncanny how the response to authoritarianism is always to reinforce the existing, "authorized" authorities.   

[Person Man]

If America is to become an autocracy over the next couple decades, it will be from Democrats, not Republicans. This is not because Democrats are more inclined to make America autocratic- the opposite is true- but because they have the support required to make America autocratic (or at least, more support than Republicans do).

This is maybe your worst post. The logic is lacking in a major way.

Autocratization happens easiest when a majority of people support the people doing the autocratization. It’s really, really hard for a minority of people in a democracy to install a dictatorship with them at the top, as a simple understanding of history would tell you.

The Democratic Party has shown no interest in attacking democracy. They certainly like corruption, the status wuo, crushing progressives and anti-corruption candidates, and ensuring that the establishment stays in power over outsiders (within their own party). They usually vocally fight back against Republican attacks on democracy. They may be in a good position to do it, but that doesn't mean anything if they have zero intentions of pursuing it.

The Democrats' only coherent governing principle since Donald Trump was elected has been autocratization.  Their answer to the "threat" Trump poses to "democracy" is to preemptively attack and dismantle democracy on their own terms.  This attack takes many forms, some relatively benign (like suggesting we pack the Supreme Court), others more existential (extreme scientism and technocracy.)

It's uncanny how the response to authoritarianism is always to reinforce the existing, "authorized" authorities.   

You mean above and beyond the lies, schemes, and conspiracies that have already fundamentally changed our form of government and the social contract between approximately April 2016 and today?

[ProudModerate2]

Oh I don't know ...
Maybe like rounding-up and convincing his ignorant MAGA base to invade The Capitol next time he doesn't get his way, hurting/killing security personnel and possibly legislative members that are present.
Nothing like this has ever happened before to damage democracy in our nation, but I guess it's possible.

[Del Tachi]

If America is to become an autocracy over the next couple decades, it will be from Democrats, not Republicans. This is not because Democrats are more inclined to make America autocratic- the opposite is true- but because they have the support required to make America autocratic (or at least, more support than Republicans do).

This is maybe your worst post. The logic is lacking in a major way.

Autocratization happens easiest when a majority of people support the people doing the autocratization. It’s really, really hard for a minority of people in a democracy to install a dictatorship with them at the top, as a simple understanding of history would tell you.

The Democratic Party has shown no interest in attacking democracy. They certainly like corruption, the status wuo, crushing progressives and anti-corruption candidates, and ensuring that the establishment stays in power over outsiders (within their own party). They usually vocally fight back against Republican attacks on democracy. They may be in a good position to do it, but that doesn't mean anything if they have zero intentions of pursuing it.

The Democrats' only coherent governing principle since Donald Trump was elected has been autocratization.  Their answer to the "threat" Trump poses to "democracy" is to preemptively attack and dismantle democracy on their own terms.  This attack takes many forms, some relatively benign (like suggesting we pack the Supreme Court), others more existential (extreme scientism and technocracy.)

It's uncanny how the response to authoritarianism is always to reinforce the existing, "authorized" authorities.   

You mean above and beyond the lies, schemes, and conspiracies that have already fundamentally changed our form of government and the social contract between approximately April 2016 and today?

A democratic system of government does not guarantee freedom from "lies, schemes and conspiracies."  You are essentially admitting you're ok with less democracy if it means Trump and the Republicans lose.

[Person Man]

If America is to become an autocracy over the next couple decades, it will be from Democrats, not Republicans. This is not because Democrats are more inclined to make America autocratic- the opposite is true- but because they have the support required to make America autocratic (or at least, more support than Republicans do).

This is maybe your worst post. The logic is lacking in a major way.

Autocratization happens easiest when a majority of people support the people doing the autocratization. It’s really, really hard for a minority of people in a democracy to install a dictatorship with them at the top, as a simple understanding of history would tell you.

The Democratic Party has shown no interest in attacking democracy. They certainly like corruption, the status wuo, crushing progressives and anti-corruption candidates, and ensuring that the establishment stays in power over outsiders (within their own party). They usually vocally fight back against Republican attacks on democracy. They may be in a good position to do it, but that doesn't mean anything if they have zero intentions of pursuing it.

The Democrats' only coherent governing principle since Donald Trump was elected has been autocratization.  Their answer to the "threat" Trump poses to "democracy" is to preemptively attack and dismantle democracy on their own terms.  This attack takes many forms, some relatively benign (like suggesting we pack the Supreme Court), others more existential (extreme scientism and technocracy.)

It's uncanny how the response to authoritarianism is always to reinforce the existing, "authorized" authorities.   

You mean above and beyond the lies, schemes, and conspiracies that have already fundamentally changed our form of government and the social contract between approximately April 2016 and today?

A democratic system of government does not guarantee freedom from "lies, schemes and conspiracies."  You are essentially admitting you're ok with less democracy if it means Trump and the Republicans lose.

As if the entire court packing and gerrymandering that has occurred is somehow just democracy in action? By that standard there is nothing objectionable about any plan anyone currently has and therefore there is bo authoritarianism. Which isn’t true. Or at least if you believe that to the case.

[TML]

All he has to do is something along the lines of what Alberto Fujimori did in Peru in 1992.

[oldtimer]

My vision of a second Trump term goes like this:

He will hire people based on their CV and looks, find out they are crap, and fire them every 6 months.

Clash with McConnell or Thune, and with the Senators who voted to impeach him in 2020.

Since Democrats are the ones who are doing better in Midterms now, suffer a Midterm blue wave.

Try to make the FED lower interest rates to try to stop an inevitable recession.

Propose literal Helicopter Money drops, only for McConnell or Thune to block it even if the Senate is in favour.

Try to finish his Mexico Wall.

Make radical foreign policy proposals that are blocked by the State Department.

Rename the Intelligence Agencies and claim victory against the Deep State.

Rogue Intelligence Agents causing trouble to try and get rid of him.

Fire some outspoken Liberals from the government to try to show whose the Boss.

Making Democrat comedians popular again.

Get Impeached at least another 2 times.

Endorse his VP for the 2028 nomination.

He might even propose a Canada Wall against Trudeau.

Alternatevely, just have DeSantis as VP to do all the work, while Trump focuses on the PR battles.

[Progressive Pessimist]

Nobody predicted he would cause an insurrection, blackmail the President of Ukraine, or steal classified information either.

We don't need to have an idea of what he will do, he is unpredictable in that sense, but what is predictable about him is his complete lack of good faith or the ability to consider anyone's interests but his, so if given another opportunity to be President it is not a stretch to think that he will continue to trample on our institutions and guardrails once again in some completely out of left field way. That's why it's for the best that we don't get into a situation where we're capable of finding out and jumping to hopeful conclusions that he can somehow be tamed next time.
 

[Absentee Voting Ghost of Ruin]

People talk about how Trump returning to power is the end of democracy, but nobody can seem to explain how he’s going to do that. Would anyone care to elaborate?

Well, maybe -  and I'm just being hypothetical here - after he loses an election, he'll refuse to hand the government over to his successor, lie that the election is rigged, illegally pressure officials to overturn the election, unlawfully install his cronies into key government positions, coordinate with allies in Congress and right-wing paramilitaries, then incite a mob to storm the Capitol with the aim of keeping him in power, while the indescribably vile waste of humanity that supports him pretends there's nothing wrong with what he did. Hypothetically.