Talk Elections

It will be a gigantic setback for race relations in America. It's pretty evident that +75% of Blacks have an extensive sentimental investment in Barack Obama. And the belief that Mormonism is racist is already widely held in the Black community... I suspect strongly that anti-Mormon sentiments will spread and strengthen among blacks in a meme-esque fashion during Romney's campaign and presidency.

I fully expect riots by blacks.

Which is sad. Its contrary to the democratic process for this implicit threat to hang over a nations head. But it remains no less true regardless. This is the price of multiculturalism... even democracy is undermined.

The reaction among whites to anti-Romney riots by blacks, and attendant surge in crime committed by a disillusioned black community suffering record-breaking poverty... I suspect we would see an anti-black backlash similar to that of the Johnson and Nixon years.

With Mitt Romney's tough stance on illegal immigrants, and a general increase in racial polarization, I would predict Hispanics becoming more polarized towards the Democrats as well... given their growing population and poverty this will be significant.

Basically we may end up with the sort of situation that presently exists in states like Mississipi- ~95% of minorities vote democrat and ~90% of whites vote Republican.

....

And it can only get worse from there. This decades economic prospects are so incredibly dire, with both Europe and China on a knife edge. With a depressed economy and Romney government, we know what the response will be- major cuts in present and future welfare spending, but with present retirees and baby boomers exempt from social security cuts, so as to fund major reductions in taxes that predominantly benefit the wealthy. In other words a redistribution of wealth from poor and young(whom constitute the majority of nonwhites and are majority nonwhite) towards the wealthy and old(whom are overwhelmingly white).

Of course whites suffering from the economic decline and welfare reductions will blame minorities, as has always been the case. And with Hispanics continuing to grow in number while becoming even more polarized in economic, political and cultural terms from White Americans, we can expect a surge of nativism even among elite whites... who mostly don't embrace outright racism but will consent to it out of political pragmatism and self preservation.

Depending on how bad the economy is I could see this devolving into a low level grassroots race war. As a consequence we will see a surge in white flight that finishes the job the 1960s and 70s started in American cities. Law and order conservatism on a national level will be a primary foundation of Romney's presidency, with an unapologetic sole mission to protect whites... cops will stop even protecting black neighborhoods on the pretense of being overstretched and black neighbourhoods being unsafe for cops.

...

Care to offer more then a few dots? Or will you refuse to believe me until blacks are rioting on your doorstep?

Is this corollary to the expectation that Obama's election would establish a Golden age of Race Relations?

Mittens Presidency might cause problems on it's own, but there is an inevitable economic trainwreck round #2 that's coming in next four years anyway. But really scaremongering leftists into voting for Democrats doesn't usually work well.

No, they're not synonymous. Obama's election triggered a short term euphoria among blacks that faded quickly, as well as a longer term sense of increased social solidarity and inclusion... but that has also faded by now on account of a)enough time has passed that Obama's become the new default and b)percieved racism by Obama's opponents and scandals like Trayvon Martin's death... as well as the generally poor economic conditions.

The thing to remember is that while euphoric gratitude over a gains fades quickly, resentment over a loss lasts a lot longer. This has been scientifically proven, for example by analysis of how people respond to an increase in their income vs a decline in their income.

Theirs also the fact that the economic situation for blacks is far worse then for whites... if you analyse the black community separately they've gone through a 4 years(and counting) depression, whereas the white community has merely suffered a statistical recession that has already finished. So consider what will happen if, on top of all that, Obama is defeated by what they perceive as the bigotry of Romney and White America, the economy collapses into an outright depression(as is probably inevitable thanks to Europe and China); and Romney responds by cutting spending that benefits the (predominantly nonwhit) poor/unemployed/young in name of preserving retirement benefits for over 55s and implementing further tax cuts that overwhelmingly flow to the wealthiest 25%(both areoverwhelmingly white demographics).

See, and that's the scariest part.

We all said that regardless of who won in 2008, it would look like a dire economic situation and either Obama or McCain would have to fight for re-election. It seems clear that President Obama or President Romney will also have a dire situation.

I'm not trying to scare anyone, simply pointing out a fact. Hell I was considering supporting Romney before he made his ridiculous pledge for 20% across the board tax cuts.

Forgive me, but if blacks start riots just because Mitt Romney is Mitt Romney, we have much bigger problems on our hands. Mitt has made it pretty clear that he absolutely does not want to talk about social issues if he doesn't have to. I think Mitt Romney's expressions of Mormonism will be even quieter than Barack's expressions of Christianity while in office. Romney's a calculated dude. If he upsets people, it won't be because he's "a racist Mormon."

White people like to get tax cuts. Blacks don't and so they'll riot.

I think you have too little faith in the majority of the African American population.  Sure there might be issolated incidents, but I don't see some major racial war going on if Romney is elected.

I love these false-conscious columns that people write.

Blacks are already suffering economic conditions comparable to a depression(while the rest of the population is seeing a weak recovery). So if the economy dips into a recession or outright depression thanks to international factors... what do you think it looks like when a groups that already in a defacto economic depression suffers a second additional depression on top of that?

And on top of that you have Obama, whom they have a intense sentimental investment in, losing to a man they will percieve as theologically racist against them.

And on top of that you have that man taking away the government assistance they depend on...

You really think that won't set off a spark? Remember the militia movement under Clinton? It emerged during the economic boom of the 90s among mostly rural whites, and they weren't at the bottom of the economic hierarchy like blacks are, nor deprived of government assistance by Clinton, nor had they suffered the sentimental alienation that blacks would if Romney beats Obama.


The majority of Republicans managed to convince themselves Obama was Muslim even though he isn't, so I find it hard to believe that blacks will remain ignorant of the fact of Romney's Mormonism.

I have faith that blacks will be able to know about Romney's Mormonism and still tolerate it.

"The only way blacks will accept Mitt Romney is if they forget he's a Mormon!" That ain't what I'm suggesting.

And it may be that many Republicans thought/think that Obama is a Muslim. Even so, I can't say it's led to riots in the streets.

Republicans are neither as poor, nor as dependant on government benefits, nor as perceptive of being under ethnic besiegement, nor as young a demographic. They're also disproportionately employed- they don't have so much time on their hands. And they're frankly far more civil then the average ghetto black... their Tea Party gatherings were distinguished by being remarkably clean when they left.

You just lost all your credibility.

I see Rockingham continues to be terrible.

"Rock dumb" was probably a little racist in retrospect. So I'll rephrase:  " they're frankly far more civil then the average ghetto black... their Tea Party gatherings were distinguished by being remarkably clean when they left."

I think a lot of black people will be pissed, but there will also be a lot of white people who will be pissed (me). It's not 1992 anymore, I don't think we have to worry about riots, especially because Obama will be reelected!

This is massive hyperbole surrounding a grain of truth.

My tl;dr version: There is a high probability of an uptick in racial tension in the next 1-2 years.  The uptick is more probable and would be more pronounced with Romney as president, but largely due to his status as not-Obama, not because of who he is.

How I see this rolling is as a reaction to the Trayvon Martin retaliations and similar news events.  If we keep seeing stories about white people getting attacked as retaliation for Trayvon, you'll start to see stories of black people getting attacked on their behalf.  I simply think the tenor today, particularly in the south, could facilitate active racial conflict in a way that would not have been possible in recent decades.  (I just can't see a Reginald Denny/LA Riots situation going unresponded to today.)  It's petering out a bit now but could flare up when Zimmerman gets acquitted (which I'm expecting).

Just to be clear, I don't see anything like race war happening, but I can see some white vs. black violence in racially charged unintegrated areas.

Damn right it's not 1992, it's infinitely worse:

-Worst economic environment since the great depression, with a serious possibility of an actual depression being triggered by international factors
-Most racially polarizing presidential contest since... ever really. Maybe 1964 is comparable. Imagine how much worse the 60's riots would have been if Goldwater was in charge?
-Serious possibility of economic programs upon which blacks depend being terminated.
-The internet era era makes it far easier for paranoia and outrage to spread.
-As the Globalizer observed, whites are far more likely to respond to such occurences with violence today then they were in 90s.

This whole thread is surreal, but since we are on the topic, do you think there is a possibility we could see a return of this?

()

I like to think we are beyond this kind of barbarism, but maybe I'm being naive...

Wow... If Obama had a son, he'd totally look like the one on the right.

If ever an election was going to produce a riot, it was 2000. And all we had then was the Brooks Brothers Riot.
Look, if Romney were to win thanks to some kind of Willie Horton race-baiting strategy, or by embracing birtherism, then there might be tension. But Romney's not going to do that; he's not the cleverest campaigner ever, but he can see that's a bad idea. If we did have another election decided the way 2000 was, and Romney won as a result, there might be tension. But overall, African-Americans have a lot of experience of watching white guys win elections.

You are naive. Hate crimes have been consistently increasing over the past few years
http://www.usatoday.com/news/nation/2009-11-23-hate-crimes_N.htm

Excuse me? Do you think I'm advocating this? I'm no bigot.

I don't think their will be much if any rioting after the election. But I think it will sow disillusionment and discontent in the black community. And that, coupled with an economic depression that hits blacks hardest(and this after 4 years of recession in their community), coupled with the abolition of government programs upon which they depend... you really think things wouldn't boil over?

Better question: Do you think white Southerners will riot if Obama gets re-elected?

Nah, the riots will happen a couple years later when the world stops trading in the USD and inflation destroys the US.

You know there are younger African Americans don't have experience watching black guys lose elections. If the election feels stolen(lost in by a hair in a state that recently passed voter ID) you can expect riots as bad as those in 1960's.

Nah, we'll have the Amero by that point, and the UN peacekeeping forces stationed in every US town will put a stop to any riots.

If Romney actually wins this, and we have major race riots, I'll buy you a car.

tl;dr

already got it in a postmodern, institutionalized form: mass incarceration and deportation.

I don't know what Rockinghams problem is but he doesn't seem to have a clue what he is talking about. First of all Romney will not win unless the economy sours. So if we start seeing a few job reports with less than 50k jobs, or even worse, job losses we will see Obama lose. If Europe starts collapsing and that causes a stock market collapse, the same will happen. But in that situation there will be plenty of justification for that to happen. And in that situation a lot of Latinos and Asians will switch to Romney along with Whites. Hell, I could see some Blacks switching as well. Romney will not run a racist campaign, mainly because he knows that won't work rather than any value system he may have.

Maybe Rockingham thinks the vast majority of Blacks are just violent, drug addled, ghetto people who will riot at the smallest perceived slight. But of course that would make him a racist wouldn't it.....Also kudos to everyone (save the globalizer who has made idiotic posts in the past iirc) from both sides of the aisle who have said this is ridiculous.

Race riots?

In 2013 America?

WTF is this s**t?

No, Rockingham thinks blacks are already suffering economic conditions comparable to a depression, and if you put another depression on top of that+the defeat of a president they have vast sentimental investment in by a percieved racist+that man abolishing welfare programs upon which they increasingly depend+the modern internet(and to a lesser media)'s propensity towards echo chambers of incendiary rage.... their has to be a breaking point where riots occur. 2 years of depression, 4, who knows.

That Mormons are considered racist.

Of course, if there is rioting, maybe I can pick up a new TV?

It is really hard to say that the same people that elected Obama in 2008 are racist.

It's becoming abundantly clear that Rockingham is about 15 years old.

He was a troll on AH.com back in 08, so he'd have to at least be in his late teens.

Excuse me? I am providing an argument in favour of my position(see below). Others are choosing to ignore it and ridicule me instead. And I'm the immature one?


Are people actually insane enough to believe that a breaking point doesn't exist?

Blacks aren't going to riot just because Obama loses.

Btw wormy, I would be the first minority senator, not you. I guess this is the best thread to say it since its basically just crap otherwise. :P

Asian?  Doesn't count.  (Oppressor, not oppressed).

I didn't say that. I said they would be disillusioned by his defeat. In combination with another recession or outright depression(courtesy of crisis in Europe and China) and the abolition of government assistance upon which their population depends(if you look at the economic statistics within the black community, they are akin to what you see amongst the general population during a depression, so imagine how bad things will get for blacks economically if an actual depression occurs)... and remember the internet and to a lesser extent other media increasingly function as echochambers that beget rage and paranoia...

You have to be severely optimistic to not see where this is headed/ Society and subpopulations within society always possess a tipping point at which social breakdown occurs, and we're going to cross that tipping point.

Well, he denies that's him (which is is hilarious considering the considerable overlap in membership between both places), but I guess he could have been a troll at 11 or 12. ;)

Provide proof or address the point I've been making on this thread.

Putting this post up again since it got sunk on the last post of page 4.

Yes, THERE (not "their") is a breaking point where riots occur.  We are not remotely close to that point, though.

What evidence are you basing this theory on?

A breaking point exists, but why only blacks? If what Rockingham says comes true, the entire population ought to be revolting.

Of course, no such thing will occur. People will sit at home and watching Dancing with the Stars, and lament the fact that they are deprived as their own fault. That is the nature of people- passive and docile.

Why, just look at Spain. They have been dealing with over 20% unemployment there for years. It is a wonder there are no riots. And yet, nothing. If anything, I would expect to see an explosion there first, before America.

Brown though, so I dunno.

In one post, the original poster of this thread, Kyro, has managed to insult the intelligence of blacks, hispanics, whites, passing it off as fact, whereas it is really nothing more than his own misguided conjecture and opinion.

You forgot Asians, Polynesians, etc.

In other words, it's not that I have a negative perspective of any given race, it's that I have a negative perspective of humans. One which is justified given a sufficiently cynical analysis of our daily lives or a macrosocial analysis.

Evidence?

The black community is already suffering depression economic conditions: http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2011/01/07/in-black-america-the-depression-rolls-on_n_805850.html

I trust you are already aware of the problems in Europe, the Middle East and China which are the basis of my assumption that a depression is imminent.

Mitt Romney and other Republicans have already stated their intent to destroy safety net programs that African Americans and other minorities are so heavily dependant on, in the name of tax cuts for the rich and preserving Social Security for Baby Boomers(both very white demographics).

The extent of support for Obama in the black community: http://www.nytimes.com/2011/10/27/us/politics/obamas-support-among-blacks-remains-strong.html?pagewanted=all

Do I need to provide a cite to prove my assertion that the internet(and to a lesser extent other media) are increasingly provide echochambers of opinion that facilitate fanaticism, rage and paranoia? I think that assertion is fairly unquestionable.

And what happens when welfare is abolished and so unemployed people can't afford to watch "Dancing with the Stars", nor can they afford any of the other bread and circuses that serve to distract them?

Spain hasn't implemented radical reductions in welfare like the Republicans plan. Spain is also less racially diverse and thus enjoys a greater degree of social solidarity(Basques not withstanding).

And their have in fact been some riots in Spain:http://www.google.com.au/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&source=web&cd=3&ved=0CHEQFjAC&url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.dailymail.co.uk%2Fnews%2Farticle-2122261%2FViolence-Spains-streets-sparks-slip-U-S-stock-futures--thousands-clash-police-24-hour-general-strike.html&ei=53enT469G6e3iQeCs-mtAw&usg=AFQjCNEkKYhgg07aW6k_iM5oaTX1oPAStQ&sig2=yHeyTKCRxrCGF1Hnzl7ALQ

Expect an outright revolution in Spain once the conditions there get even worse for several more years courtesy of the broader European crisis.