Talk Elections

General Politics => U.S. General Discussion => Topic started by: Hermit For Peace on November 13, 2019, 02:55:33 AM



Title: What Happened to Respect?
Post by: Hermit For Peace on November 13, 2019, 02:55:33 AM

In 2009 when Rep Joe Wilson yelled at Obama "You lie!" during a joint session of congress, that was a pivotal moment when respect in politics started a sharp decline, in my view.

Today, look what we have going on now. It's messy, and it's ugly. There is little cooperation between members of the parties and lots of ill will.

What happened to respect for one another? And how are we going to get it back? I mean, you can disagree with your co-workers but still be respectful towards them.

What's it going to take to put a semblance of decency back into our government?

I think more than this impeachment thing going on, the disintegration of respect for one another is the worst thing that can happen and that has happened to our country. And it's a shame because when you don't have respect for others, you have nothing worth having.


Title: Re: What Happened to Respect?
Post by: T'Chenka on November 13, 2019, 05:32:30 AM
Respect is for beta cucks. (Insert opposite political party) are animals and you're a soy boy for having empathy for them.


Title: Re: What Happened to Respect?
Post by: Progressive Pessimist on November 13, 2019, 08:08:44 PM
Fox News, other right wing "news" sources, the internet, and the ascent of the culture wars all happened; among others things, and they led to President Trump.


Title: Re: What Happened to Respect?
Post by: Xing on November 13, 2019, 09:12:26 PM
People seem to find it much more entertaining to be an asshole and say that anyone who disagrees with them is a moron than to try and empathize with those who disagree.


Title: Re: What Happened to Respect?
Post by: Devout Centrist on November 13, 2019, 10:34:09 PM
Respect dissolved in 2016 after it voluntarily deregistered from the UK Electoral Commission


Title: Re: What Happened to Respect?
Post by: Hammy on November 14, 2019, 01:38:48 AM
There was never respect in politics. Have we already forgotten the 90s? Or the fact that a hundred years ago it wasn't uncommon for lawmakers to physically attack each other during sessions of congress?


Title: Re: What Happened to Respect?
Post by: Annatar on November 14, 2019, 09:02:33 AM
Respect is an overblown idea in politics, I don't think its particularly honest or genuine to pretend to respect people whom you consider evil and immoral. I think politics is better when everyone is upfront and states what their ideas and challenges the other side, voters at least than get a clear sense about what a particular politician or party stands for.


Title: Re: What Happened to Respect?
Post by: HillGoose on November 14, 2019, 09:11:49 AM
respect still exists lmao you just have 2 stop listening to the lamestream media lies and sensationalism

the world is great right now


Title: Re: What Happened to Respect?
Post by: Kingpoleon on November 14, 2019, 09:20:50 AM
It deregistered post-Galloway.


Title: Re: What Happened to Respect?
Post by: Amenhotep Bakari-Sellers on November 14, 2019, 10:31:16 AM
Politicians are going on talk shows and debating the same way they are on talk shows. Members of each body talking past one another and not to each other. That's why we got an impeachment going on that spoiled gun control legislation and no balanced budget; thus, a shutdown looming over more wall funding.


Title: Re: What Happened to Respect?
Post by: Hermit For Peace on November 14, 2019, 11:13:55 AM

Maybe the word I should have used is civility.

Where is the civility in politics today? You don't have to like people to act civil toward them.

Respect is something one earns. We can respect the office of the presidency, but not the man in it. I would be civil to Trump if I met him, but he has earned zilch from me in the respect department.

I am correcting myself then.

Civility is what is needed now. How hard can that be?


Title: Re: What Happened to Respect?
Post by: Annatar on November 14, 2019, 11:29:21 AM
Civility has declined because there's no social pressure to be civil anymore, nobody gets socially shamed for being uncivil in politics anymore, also voters don't care, if voters cared and were willing to punish people for being uncivil, politicians would be more civil.


Title: Re: What Happened to Respect?
Post by: Slander and/or Libel on November 14, 2019, 11:31:58 AM
People are just saying out loud what they had been doing with a smile for a long time. Is it better to have bigots being bigots out in the open, or hiding it just enough to give people an excuse to ignore it?


Title: Re: What Happened to Respect?
Post by: The Arizonan on November 14, 2019, 11:58:03 AM

Maybe the word I should have used is civility.

Where is the civility in politics today? You don't have to like people to act civil toward them.

Respect is something one earns. We can respect the office of the presidency, but not the man in it. I would be civil to Trump if I met him, but he has earned zilch from me in the respect department.

I am correcting myself then.

Civility is what is needed now. How hard can that be?

In general, civility in society has declined over the years and that is the real issue. I mean, just look at any high school.


Title: Re: What Happened to Respect?
Post by: Hermit For Peace on November 14, 2019, 12:12:36 PM

So where and how does this lack of civility road end?

We can't keep the downward spiral going. We will turn ourselves into a third world country.


Title: Re: What Happened to Respect?
Post by: Atlas Has Shrugged on November 14, 2019, 02:37:23 PM
George Galloway.


Title: Re: What Happened to Respect?
Post by: Kingpoleon on November 14, 2019, 06:59:03 PM
Politicians are going on talk shows and debating the same way they are on talk shows.
Yep. Then they do those interviews and talk the same way they do in those interviews!


Title: Re: What Happened to Respect?
Post by: Hammy on November 14, 2019, 07:17:41 PM

Maybe the word I should have used is civility.

Where is the civility in politics today? You don't have to like people to act civil toward them.

Respect is something one earns. We can respect the office of the presidency, but not the man in it. I would be civil to Trump if I met him, but he has earned zilch from me in the respect department.

I am correcting myself then.

Civility is what is needed now. How hard can that be?

Politicians are a reflection of society, i.e. the people that vote for them. The people are going to need to regain some semblance of civility if we're ever going to expect it from politicians.


Title: Re: What Happened to Respect?
Post by: Yellowhammer on November 14, 2019, 07:19:17 PM
I am not capable of respecting communists.


Title: Re: What Happened to Respect?
Post by: Hermit For Peace on November 14, 2019, 09:23:28 PM

Maybe the word I should have used is civility.

Where is the civility in politics today? You don't have to like people to act civil toward them.

Respect is something one earns. We can respect the office of the presidency, but not the man in it. I would be civil to Trump if I met him, but he has earned zilch from me in the respect department.

I am correcting myself then.

Civility is what is needed now. How hard can that be?

Politicians are a reflection of society, i.e. the people that vote for them. The people are going to need to regain some semblance of civility if we're ever going to expect it from politicians.

That's true. Trump is a symptom, not the cause.


Title: Re: What Happened to Respect?
Post by: World politics is up Schmitt creek on November 14, 2019, 09:26:32 PM
Respect is on vacation in Vegas, along with God, love, and dreams.

Respect is an overblown idea in politics, I don't think its particularly honest or genuine to pretend to respect people whom you consider evil and immoral.

That's not what "respect" means.


Title: Re: What Happened to Respect?
Post by: junior chįmp on November 14, 2019, 10:44:36 PM
Bipartisanship, respect, civility is a scam that only exists in journo narrative fiction land (https://www.salon.com/2013/11/24/stop_whining_centrists_bipartisanship_is_a_myth_thats_never_existed/)


Title: Re: What Happened to Respect?
Post by: Santander on November 14, 2019, 10:50:44 PM
We can respect the office of the presidency, but not the man in it. I would be civil to Trump if I met him, but he has earned zilch from me in the respect department.

Political offices should not be respected by virtue of existence. Respecting America as a country, the rule of law, the democratic process, and in the case of international affairs, diplomatic convention, would lead one to afford the officeholder of the Presidency a certain level of courtesy and decorum, but that is not out of respect for the office itself. Politicians work for the people, not the other way around. People shouldn't have too much respect for politicians.


Title: Re: What Happened to Respect?
Post by: T'Chenka on November 14, 2019, 10:52:56 PM
I am not capable of respecting communists.
What do communists have to do with 2019 American civil discourse though?


Title: Re: What Happened to Respect?
Post by: Santander on November 14, 2019, 10:57:04 PM
I am not capable of respecting communists.

I am not capable of respecting national socialists.


Title: Re: What Happened to Respect?
Post by: R.P. McM on November 14, 2019, 11:15:02 PM
Respect is for beta cucks. (Insert opposite political party) are animals and you're a soy boy for having empathy for them.

Well, when the other party is supporting a racist sexual predator who praises Nazis, attempts to bribe foreign powers, and completely undermines the rule of law, WTF do you want us to say?! Obviously, none of their prior concerns about principle or process were even remotely genuine. So if I point out that they're just authoritarian animals, why does that so upset you? It's an accurate assessment, much as you'd love to live in denial.   


Title: Re: What Happened to Respect?
Post by: World politics is up Schmitt creek on November 14, 2019, 11:16:53 PM
Respect is for beta cucks. (Insert opposite political party) are animals and you're a soy boy for having empathy for them.

Well, when the other party is supporting a racist sexual predator who praises Nazis, attempts to bribe foreign powers, and completely undermines the rule of law, WTF do you want us to say?! Obviously, none of their prior concerns about principle or process were even remotely genuine. So if I point out that they're just authoritarian animals, why does that so upset you? It's an accurate assessment, much as you'd love to live in denial.   

You have a lot of anger, don't you?


Title: Re: What Happened to Respect?
Post by: R.P. McM on November 14, 2019, 11:36:14 PM
Respect is for beta cucks. (Insert opposite political party) are animals and you're a soy boy for having empathy for them.

Well, when the other party is supporting a racist sexual predator who praises Nazis, attempts to bribe foreign powers, and completely undermines the rule of law, WTF do you want us to say?! Obviously, none of their prior concerns about principle or process were even remotely genuine. So if I point out that they're just authoritarian animals, why does that so upset you? It's an accurate assessment, much as you'd love to live in denial.   

You have a lot of anger, don't you?

Not much of a response, hombre. Again, you're basically crying at the fact that I've pointed out that Republicans are unwilling to follow even the basic rules/norms/laws that have allowed us to coexist as a political community for ~150 years. You can keep whining, but it doesn't really change the reality at heart.


Title: Re: What Happened to Respect?
Post by: T'Chenka on November 14, 2019, 11:39:30 PM
Respect is for beta cucks. (Insert opposite political party) are animals and you're a soy boy for having empathy for them.

Well, when the other party is supporting a racist sexual predator who praises Nazis, attempts to bribe foreign powers, and completely undermines the rule of law, WTF do you want us to say?! Obviously, none of their prior concerns about principle or process were even remotely genuine. So if I point out that they're just authoritarian animals, why does that so upset you? It's an accurate assessment, much as you'd love to live in denial.   
Both sides do it bro.


Title: Re: What Happened to Respect?
Post by: R.P. McM on November 14, 2019, 11:42:14 PM
Respect is for beta cucks. (Insert opposite political party) are animals and you're a soy boy for having empathy for them.

Well, when the other party is supporting a racist sexual predator who praises Nazis, attempts to bribe foreign powers, and completely undermines the rule of law, WTF do you want us to say?! Obviously, none of their prior concerns about principle or process were even remotely genuine. So if I point out that they're just authoritarian animals, why does that so upset you? It's an accurate assessment, much as you'd love to live in denial.  
Both sides do it bro.

You've just destroyed your credibility. Pat yourself on the back, you brownshirt bootlicker.


Title: Re: What Happened to Respect?
Post by: World politics is up Schmitt creek on November 15, 2019, 12:20:52 AM
Respect is for beta cucks. (Insert opposite political party) are animals and you're a soy boy for having empathy for them.

Well, when the other party is supporting a racist sexual predator who praises Nazis, attempts to bribe foreign powers, and completely undermines the rule of law, WTF do you want us to say?! Obviously, none of their prior concerns about principle or process were even remotely genuine. So if I point out that they're just authoritarian animals, why does that so upset you? It's an accurate assessment, much as you'd love to live in denial.   

You have a lot of anger, don't you?

Not much of a response, hombre. Again, you're basically crying at the fact that I've pointed out that Republicans are unwilling to follow even the basic rules/norms/laws that have allowed us to coexist as a political community for ~150 years. You can keep whining, but it doesn't really change the reality at heart.

I didn't deny any of that.


Title: Re: What Happened to Respect?
Post by: Hermit For Peace on November 15, 2019, 08:27:02 AM
Bipartisanship, respect, civility is a scam that only exists in journo narrative fiction land (https://www.salon.com/2013/11/24/stop_whining_centrists_bipartisanship_is_a_myth_thats_never_existed/)

That was an interesting article. I think it spoke mostly to bipartisanship. There certainly doesn't seem to be much of that going on today. But can't we be civil when we disagree? Can't we treat others with civility that we ourselves want to be treated with?

In the age of Trump, in the age of bullying on social media and in the public arena, in the age of school shootings that we experience today, how far down the rabbit hole are we willing to go before we do a turn around and start changing the way we treat each other?


Title: Re: What Happened to Respect?
Post by: R.P. McM on November 15, 2019, 11:40:18 PM
Respect is for beta cucks. (Insert opposite political party) are animals and you're a soy boy for having empathy for them.

Well, when the other party is supporting a racist sexual predator who praises Nazis, attempts to bribe foreign powers, and completely undermines the rule of law, WTF do you want us to say?! Obviously, none of their prior concerns about principle or process were even remotely genuine. So if I point out that they're just authoritarian animals, why does that so upset you? It's an accurate assessment, much as you'd love to live in denial.   

You have a lot of anger, don't you?

Not much of a response, hombre. Again, you're basically crying at the fact that I've pointed out that Republicans are unwilling to follow even the basic rules/norms/laws that have allowed us to coexist as a political community for ~150 years. You can keep whining, but it doesn't really change the reality at heart.

I didn't deny any of that.

Well then WTF are you doing? I'm pointing out that the opposition is creeping ever closer to outright fascism, and you're whining about my tone. Who gives a sh!+?!!!


Title: Re: What Happened to Respect?
Post by: World politics is up Schmitt creek on November 16, 2019, 01:46:19 AM
Respect is for beta cucks. (Insert opposite political party) are animals and you're a soy boy for having empathy for them.

Well, when the other party is supporting a racist sexual predator who praises Nazis, attempts to bribe foreign powers, and completely undermines the rule of law, WTF do you want us to say?! Obviously, none of their prior concerns about principle or process were even remotely genuine. So if I point out that they're just authoritarian animals, why does that so upset you? It's an accurate assessment, much as you'd love to live in denial.   

You have a lot of anger, don't you?

Not much of a response, hombre. Again, you're basically crying at the fact that I've pointed out that Republicans are unwilling to follow even the basic rules/norms/laws that have allowed us to coexist as a political community for ~150 years. You can keep whining, but it doesn't really change the reality at heart.

I didn't deny any of that.

Well then WTF are you doing? I'm pointing out that the opposition is creeping ever closer to outright fascism, and you're whining about my tone. Who gives a sh!+?!!!

Eh.


Title: Re: What Happened to Respect?
Post by: MarkD on November 16, 2019, 03:23:06 AM
I think all Americans should read the speech by Benjamin Franklin at the end of the Constitutional Convention of 1787. I will not quote the entire speech here, just a majority of it.

Quote
Mr. President,
I confess that there are several parts of this constitution which I do not at present approve, but I am not sure I shall never approve them: For having lived long, I have experienced many instances of being obliged by better information, or fuller consideration, to change opinions even on important subjects, which I once thought right, but found to be otherwise. It is therefore that the older I grow, the more apt I am to doubt my own judgment, and to pay more respect to the judgment of others. Most men indeed as well as most sects in Religion, think themselves in possession of all truth, and that wherever others differ from them it is so far error. ...
In these sentiments, Sir, I agree to this Constitution with all its faults, if they are such; because I think a general Government necessary for us, and there is no form of Government but what may be a blessing to the people if well administered. ... I doubt too whether any other Convention we can obtain, may be able to make a better Constitution. For when you assemble a number of men to have the advantage of their joint wisdom, you inevitably assemble with those men, all their prejudices, their passions, their errors of opinion, their local interests, and their selfish views. From such an assembly can a perfect production be expected? It therefore astonishes me, Sir, to find this system approaching so near to perfection as it does; and I think it will astonish our enemies, who are waiting with confidence to hear that our councils are confounded like those of the Builders of Babel; and that our States are on the point of separation, only to meet hereafter for the purpose of cutting one another's throats. Thus I consent, Sir, to this Constitution because I expect no better, and because I am not sure, that it is not the best. ... Much of the strength & efficiency of any Government in procuring and securing happiness to the people, depends, on opinion, on the general opinion of the goodness of the Government, as well as of the wisdom and integrity of its Governors. I hope therefore that for our own sakes as a part of the people, and for the sake of posterity, we shall act heartily and unanimously in recommending this Constitution (if approved by Congress & confirmed by the Conventions) wherever our influence may extend, and turn our future thoughts & endeavors to the means of having it well administered.
On the whole, Sir, I can not help expressing a wish that every member of the Convention who may still have objections to it, would with me, on this occasion doubt a little of his own infallibility, and to make manifest our unanimity, put his name to this instrument.


Title: Re: What Happened to Respect?
Post by: Fuzzy Stands With His Friend, Chairman Sanchez on November 16, 2019, 01:13:23 PM
MarkD's above post is a Freedom Post.

The problem today is that we have ideologically-based parties held together in no small measure by identity politics.  We've had identity politics in varying degrees throughout our history, but the ideologically-based political parties is, honestly, a relatively new feature.  These conditions tend to cause people to be certain in their judgment and less open to the idea that they may be wrong on an issue.


Title: Re: What Happened to Respect?
Post by: Suburbia on November 16, 2019, 04:39:10 PM
MarkD's above post is a Freedom Post.

The problem today is that we have ideologically-based parties held together in no small measure by identity politics.  We've had identity politics in varying degrees throughout our history, but the ideologically-based political parties is, honestly, a relatively new feature.  These conditions tend to cause people to be certain in their judgment and less open to the idea that they may be wrong on an issue.


Title: Re: What Happened to Respect?
Post by: Fuzzy Stands With His Friend, Chairman Sanchez on November 17, 2019, 10:14:12 PM
People seem to find it much more entertaining to be an asshole and say that anyone who disagrees with them is a moron than to try and empathize with those who disagree.

That's one aspect of it, to be sure.

The other aspect of the matter is that we now have ideological parties.  All the conservatives are Republicans these days.  All the liberals are Democrats.  It's easier to talk trash about others when they're of the other party.  It's harder to do so when the conservative blocking liberal legislation is part of your own Democratic caucus.


Title: Re: What Happened to Respect?
Post by: junior chįmp on November 18, 2019, 12:30:59 AM
MarkD's above post is a Freedom Post.

The problem today is that we have ideologically-based parties held together in no small measure by identity politics.  We've had identity politics in varying degrees throughout our history, but the ideologically-based political parties is, honestly, a relatively new feature.  These conditions tend to cause people to be certain in their judgment and less open to the idea that they may be wrong on an issue.

Identity politics is an American tradition. (https://www.nybooks.com/daily/2019/02/07/americas-original-identity-politics/)

Everyone is clamoring to denounce identity politics like it's some new phenomenon that just recently appeared out of nowhere. It's always been there and always will be. The idea that you can have politics without identity is just another one of these lofty intellectual ideals, like bipartisanship or civility, cooked up by beltway journo's that simply dont exist in the real world.


Title: Re: What Happened to Respect?
Post by: Intell on November 18, 2019, 12:40:08 AM
I am not capable of respecting communists.

I am not capable of respecting fascists and war criminals; Bush should be executed for war crimes and Trump should be in jail.