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1  General Politics / Individual Politics / Re: Hypothetical German snap election, 2018 on: Today at 09:44:36 pm
Left/Left.
2  General Politics / Individual Politics / Re: Battle of the Bastards TL: Conservative Leadership Round 1 (1995) on: November 19, 2017, 09:05:38 pm
Hesseltine, if only because I enjoy seeing him on telly every now and then laying into the current Tory party.
3  General Politics / Individual Politics / Re: Alternative French Presidential Election Runoff, 2017 on: November 19, 2017, 08:32:48 pm
If only this could've been the real run-off.
4  General Politics / Individual Politics / Re: Alternative French Presidential Election, 2017 on: November 19, 2017, 08:31:45 pm
¯\_(ツ)_/¯ Still can't do the runoff because Macron and Le Pen are tied.

Speak of the Devil (literally), Le Pen pulls ahead.


I'll make the runoff now, between Mélenchon and Le Pen.

Frexit ensured?
5  General Politics / Individual Politics / Re: Should welfare recipients be required to use birth control? on: November 19, 2017, 08:28:50 pm
No, but benefits should be cut off for people who continue to have kids while on welfare.
How are you a socialist?

The welfare state cannot sustain handing out benefits to people who won't work (assuming they are able) and continue to have kids. If they are able bodied and on welfare and want to have more kids they can get a job to support them.

As we are both in free-market economies that do not strive for (let alone offer) full-employment, and (in mine at least) most recipients of welfare benefits are the working poor, I'd have to question why you're assuming everyone is turning down work? I'm used to Thatcherites sporting D avatars (it makes sense) but your views don't sound socialist.

Personal experience. I know several people who are on government benefits who never look for work and have never worked in their lives, who continue to have multiple kids and keep receiving government benefits (that now extend to those new kids).

Furthermore, I never said everyone who receives benefits refuses to work, however (in my experience) there is a substantial portion who do turn down the option to work.

There should be a system of investigation that mandates that people who receive government benefits prove that they are either looking for work or enrolled in an education or job training program.

In my opinion benefits should extend only to the kids that they had when they began receiving benefits. If they cant afford to support the kids they had when they filed to receive benefits, the government shouldn't be asked to cover the cost of new kids that they know they can't afford to support (or else why would they be on benefits).


Personal experience has also shown how many jobs that have been taken for granted quickly vanish - so many of the major high-street employers that I grew up with have folded since the crash, leaving thousands unemployed and looking for work in an impossible jobs market. Are you trying to tell me people are expected to pay into a social security system for decades to be made unemployed for an extended amount of time through no fault of their own and unable to draw from that without being made to feel like parasites? Many parents have a specific window in mind for children - if only to ensure their existing child has a sibling growing up. It is crazy to deny them that right without impoverishing them - on the basis that some are playing the system.

We'll be entering an age of automation shortly (only yesterday I was reminded of that fact having visited McDonalds for the first time in a while and wondered how long before those order screens have replaced the till staff) - with next to no help on retraining and no commitment to find these people work I have to question the motives of those who see benefit recipients in the worst possible light and legislate accordingly.
6  Other Elections - Analysis and Discussion / International Elections / Re: German Elections & Politics on: November 19, 2017, 07:57:26 pm
At the end of the day Merkel nor the CDU are owed never-ending majorities with unwilling coalition partners being their sacrificial lambs when they can barely scrape together a third of the vote with the CSU. 

If Germany can put behind their history in terms of forging a new defence (as her recent speech indicated) I don't see why they can't accept minority governments are not the done thing until they have to be.
7  Other Elections - Analysis and Discussion / International Elections / Re: Czech parliamentary election, 20-21 October 2017 on: November 19, 2017, 07:42:23 pm
Ugh. Friendship ended with SPD

Up until this point you were friends with the Czech far-right?
8  General Politics / Individual Politics / Re: Should welfare recipients be required to use birth control? on: November 19, 2017, 07:30:47 pm
No, but benefits should be cut off for people who continue to have kids while on welfare.
How are you a socialist?

The welfare state cannot sustain handing out benefits to people who won't work (assuming they are able) and continue to have kids. If they are able bodied and on welfare and want to have more kids they can get a job to support them.

As we are both in free-market economies that do not strive for (let alone offer) full-employment, and (in mine at least) most recipients of welfare benefits are the working poor, I'd have to question why you're assuming everyone is turning down work? I'm used to Thatcherites sporting D avatars (it makes sense) but your views don't sound socialist.
9  General Politics / Individual Politics / Re: Favorite European center-left party on: November 19, 2017, 03:16:23 pm
Also, where's Denmark's SocDems (and Alternativet, on that note)?

Isn't that a green party that split from the social liberals?
10  General Politics / Individual Politics / Re: Favorite European center-left party on: November 19, 2017, 03:07:08 pm
Yeah, it doesn't appear to be getting anywhere.

Italian Democrats > Danish Social Democrats > SPÖ > Finnish SDP > SPD > Portuguese PS > PvdA (lol) > French PS (lol) > Flemish sp.a > PSOE > Walloon PS > Norwegian Labour > Swedish Social Democrats > UK Labour.

Curious what driven this ranking for you?
11  General Politics / Individual Politics / Re: Alternative French Presidential Election, 2017 on: November 19, 2017, 03:04:43 pm
Funny how Mélenchon still does really well despite the presence of more left-wing/legit Trotskyist parties. He'll likely make the runoff, but second place is tied between Le Pen and Macron, with Sarkozy and Hidalgo not far behind.

The far left have long been a wasted vote in France's run-off. With the real prospect of no left-winger making the run-off I wouldn't class this as surprising.
12  General Politics / Individual Politics / Re: Moving to Another Country on: November 18, 2017, 09:42:51 pm
Canada - maybe.
13  Other Elections - Analysis and Discussion / International Elections / Re: UK local by-elections, 2017 on: November 18, 2017, 09:22:46 pm
On Wandsworth whilst you are correct Thamesfield is one of the Tories best wards in the borough but the swing to Labour in that ward last week was significantly below what they were expecting. Indeed applying that swing to all wards from the Wandsworth council elections from 2014 would give Labour the Tory seats in the three split wards and nothing else leaving a Tory majority on the council. If the Tory council survives in Wandsworth next year despite Brexit and the best efforts of Theresa 'citizens of nowhere' May it will be an incredibly disappointing result for Labour considering that not only did Labour absolutely trounce the Tories in Wandsworth in the mot recent general this was a borough Kahn won in the mayoral race.

With respect, no it won't. Labour hasn't been anywhere near power in Wandsworth in (my) living memory, and if last week's performance were repeated they'd win the popular vote there - which they failed to do by a wide margin in both 94 and 98. In a mayoral contest that matters but in terms of seats and controlling the council they'd be nowhere near. I'd hate to meet the people disappointed at not gaining Wandsworth - they must be perennially crushed and would burn out in months.
14  General Politics / Individual Politics / Re: Favorite European center-left party on: November 18, 2017, 03:53:25 pm
Guess.
15  Other Elections - Analysis and Discussion / International Elections / Re: UK local by-elections, 2017 on: November 18, 2017, 02:59:54 pm
The results in Waveney and Darlington are truly shocking and disappointing to say the least,
Labour have never lost the waveney seat in a long time
we are being governed by the most incompetent government since the 1970s, brexit negotiations and universal credit aren't going well,
Labour should be 20+ ahead in the polls yet, we are level pegging nationally and losing votes locally  

Scroll up? Labour have been fairly consistently putting on votes since the election. There's cases where that's not the case - differential turnout, minor parties standing that weren't before, local factors - but to say Labour are losing votes locally is horsesh*t. Speaking of horsesh*t, there's no way Labour would be in a twenty point lead now! Like it or not half the country are prepared to Brexit knowing the costs - they're not going to suddenly desert their party for one who'd stop that. So then you're left with those voting Tory even despite their preference to Remain - who I suspect in the main are wealthy f**kers in Wandsworth who are simply not going to vote Labour (and I'd hate to see what policies we'd need to jettison for them to do so).
16  General Politics / Individual Politics / Re: Opinion of John McDonnell on: November 18, 2017, 02:42:46 pm
Huge FF. To say I was disappointed by his absence for the leadership in 2007/2010 would be an understatement.

How much of an impact do you think he would've made in 2010 had he ended up with enough loaned nominations to make it onto the leadership ballot? (Assuming, of course, that Abbott stayed out)

I assume somewhere between Abbott and Corbyn - certainly competitive. At that point Labour were already unhappy with the continuity Blairism that David offered, and Ed became the left opposition to that (and won). I think someone more persuasive than both Ed and Dianne could've gained momentum (excuse the pun) in much the same way Corbyn did (although I expect not to the same extent: McDonnell is more divisive and left-wing).
17  General Politics / Individual Politics / Re: Favorite left wing party of Western Europe on: November 18, 2017, 02:26:31 pm
I think the idea is that this is for "left of the left" rather than mainstream left parties, which would still include Labour notwithstanding their current leadership.

It would also be a rather... er... substantial misreading of the politics of the present leadership. Labour ran on a solid social democratic platform at this year's General Election not SEIZE THE COMMANDING HEIGHTS COMRADES and there has been precisely zero indication that this is likely to change (quite the opposite actually). In a weird and round-about way, Corbynism has turned out to be about the Left finally burying Bennism and moving on with its life.

I think there's a recognition between the SCG/leadership that they needed to adopt social democratic consensus politics to win leadership and arrest this relentless march to neoliberal madness (that is now attacking the very basics of state provision). I don't however think that any have disowned Bennism long-term and are simply willing to return to social democracy before pursuing socialist proposals (the EU in many ways being the defining divide between the soft and hard left, and on that score you'd expect to see more movement if they had been converted).
18  General Politics / International General Discussion / Re: EU creates mega-army on: November 18, 2017, 10:00:15 am
Another proof that Brexit is one of the best thing that ever happened to the EU.
We are finally moving forward without the UK blocking any further political integration.

Yup.

Fairly sure this was being reported as in the works before Brexit - I think Leave even made hey with it during the campaign.

You'd also have to assume there were more obstacles than the UK if it's ended up a damp squib, as the link above appears to suggest.

The UK was always a big obstacle.

EDIT : except for a brief period under Blair. Then Iraq happened.

Of course - my point was the article you posted suggests by the nature of its dilution that the UK wasn't the only obstacle and it won't be plain sailing to federalism now we've left.
19  General Politics / Individual Politics / Re: Memri-ish news/politics show on: November 17, 2017, 05:42:19 pm
Probably No for both. I get a headache just seeing the deluded clowns filling the QT panel/audience here - to purposely give a platform to loons and see them winning the audience around isn't so much entertaining as profoundly depressing to watch.
20  General Politics / International General Discussion / Re: EU creates mega-army on: November 17, 2017, 05:39:03 pm
Another proof that Brexit is one of the best thing that ever happened to the EU.
We are finally moving forward without the UK blocking any further political integration.

Yup.

Fairly sure this was being reported as in the works before Brexit - I think Leave even made hey with it during the campaign.

You'd also have to assume there were more obstacles than the UK if it's ended up a damp squib, as the link above appears to suggest.
21  General Politics / Individual Politics / Re: Opinion of John McDonnell on: November 17, 2017, 05:32:40 pm
Huge FF. To say I was disappointed by his absence for the leadership in 2007/2010 would be an understatement.

22  General Politics / Individual Politics / Re: What parties would you be in other countries? (new thread) on: November 17, 2017, 07:27:08 am
US: DSA
UK: Labour
Canada: NDP
Germany: Left
France: FI
Austria: Greens
Italy: Italian Left
Spain: Podemos
Australia: Greens
New Zealand: Greens
Netherlands: sp
Norway: SV
23  General Politics / Individual Politics / Re: The Iron Lady - 2001 General Election on: November 17, 2017, 07:06:38 am
Radical Labour.
24  Other Elections - Analysis and Discussion / International Elections / Re: German Elections & Politics on: November 13, 2017, 04:43:04 pm
Minority governments are not plain sailing precisely because you've failed to convince voters, or many potential coalition partners, you're the right government. I'd rather you worry about doing something to fix that than upturn a well-functioning multi-party democracy with meaningful differences so you can remove those choices and force the German public into binary lesser-evilism to win an artificial mandate rewarded with seat totals far beyond what your votes deserve. Those Green and Left voters were already going towards SPD in the event they could form a government.
25  General Politics / International General Discussion / Re: UK General Discussion: 2017 and onwards, Mayhem on: November 13, 2017, 04:18:36 pm
The irony is that I (and a lot of other Labour people) have said that the Tory system for picking/removing the leader is much better than Labour's own system, when it actually appears that it has both given the party a piss poor leader, and one they can't get rid of.

Well, you and other Blairites who hate any internal party democracy.

I like Blair (hence the username) but I'm not a Blairite. FWIW the actual Blairites supported expanding party democracy with the Collins Review (which scrapped the old Electoral College). I mean as I wrote on the thread a couple of pages ago...

Quote
I could write a lot more about how the actual right of Labour (of which even I don't identity with) has been unpopular for years, has a lack of money, a lack of talent and no real support in the PLP.

They supported democracy for their own ends - as a wider effort to dilute union influence - but it hasn't worked out as intended. That isn't to say they still do, and certainly, ignoring the fiasco of registered supporters, those holding the Tory process up as worth replicating is certainly restricted to a minority within Labour, concentrated amongst mainly Blairites.
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