North Korea Mega Thread

[TheSaint250]

CNN's headline is pretty misleading. It implies Mattis said we would strike if they continued their actions, which are just threats and tests, when his real statement said they should stop DELIBERATING actions that would lead to strikes, like bombing Guam.

Very misleading.

[TheSaint250]

North Korea says it’ll complete plan to attack waters near Guam by mid-August

This certainly escalates the situation but there's still a chance they won't.

Praying for everyone's safety.

[TheSaint250]

North Korea says it’ll complete plan to attack waters near Guam by mid-August

This certainly escalates the situation but there's still a chance they won't.

Praying for everyone's safety.

North Korea's like the woman next door in an abusive relationship that you hear at 1am screaming at her boyfriend if he comes home drunk from the strip club that late again, she's packing her sh*t and leaving him for good. Then you hear same thing one week later.

Pretty much. Year after year (and this year day after day)

[TheSaint250]

I dont get it. There is nothing to gain from striking Guam. Its not even all that militarily important anymore due to the South Korean and Japanese bases. Ignoring that, why does North Korea think they can actually warn The United States. Thats like Denmark warning Germany.

It would probably just be a propaganda machine.  Think about it: "We struck the powerful U.S." The country's people wouldn't really know that Guam isn't a target to extensively brag about hitting.  They would just be given another reason to believe that they could beat back the "imperialists".

[TheSaint250]

You must be logged in to read this quote.

If he's trying to get America nuked he should just keep on doing what he's doing.

http://www.cnn.com/2017/08/10/politics/trump-north-korea/index.html

Well you should never rule out anything, even a pre-emotive strike, if intelligence suggests it would save Americans. Hopefully it doesn't happen but it could.

[TheSaint250]

You must be logged in to read this quote.

If he's trying to get America nuked he should just keep on doing what he's doing.

http://www.cnn.com/2017/08/10/politics/trump-north-korea/index.html

Well you should never rule out anything, even a pre-emotive strike, if intelligence suggests it would save Americans. Hopefully it doesn't happen but it could.

Everything Trump does is emotive. 

(I know you meant preemptive, but "emotive" is a good one here.

Lol thanks

Autocorrect...

[TheSaint250]

Would Trump have to get a declaration of war from congress if he wanted to launch a preemptive strike?

Good question. I fear that the answer is "no". Someone can correct me if I'm wrong.

I think you're right. Congress is more for declaring war, but the War Powers Act did curb some presidential powers

[TheSaint250]

Once communists always communists.

I can't believe China would defend such an idiotic leader like Kim.

Part of me wants to economically punish China for this, but that would just make things worse.

[TheSaint250]

Once communists always communists.

I can't believe China would defend such an idiotic leader like Kim.

Part of me wants to economically punish China for this, but that would just make things worse.

We're going to be nuking China soon, around the time they nuke us. Would that count as economic punishment, or just making things worse?

I meant sanctions for pledging to support an oppressive dictatorship.

If China were to nuke us, of course we should retaliate with something.

[TheSaint250]

If we see out Auggust and no one does any more stupid saber-rattling, will we be in the clear for a time?

Somewhat but not totally. Every Feb and August are the drills which has NK up in arms every time we do those and why they are concerned. So yes and no.

I'll take it.

Good article on Freedom Guardian (Aug drills) sch for 21-31 Aug. https://www.theguardian.com/world/2017/aug/11/north-korea-us-south-korea-huge-military-exercise KCNA article said the NK gens will present the plan to KJU to hit Guam in mid-Aug (15 Aug) for a go/no go. We are getting close. Either Kim blinks and does nothing or he goes all-in or is overruled by his gen staff.

Why would his staff overrule him? If Beet's theory is correct, they're the hardliners here.

If Kim doesn't want to strike, maybe the hardliners do and will go forward anyway.

[TheSaint250]

Just wondering, if the US government changes the DEFCON level, does it become public knowledge?

[TheSaint250]

I trust President Trump and the generals around him to protect us from any threats. If we have advanced notice of a NK attack on US land, we should attempt to stop it, preferably by an air strike.

Trump is right in telling North Korea to back off. If intelligence suggests they will attack, that is the only time we should attack first: to defend the homeland. Anything other than that in terms of pre-emotive strike should not happen. And won't happen.

I am strongly against war and hope it does not happen.

[TheSaint250]

Trump just called the governor of Guam... and congratulated him on Guam now being famous. That's what it's always about with Trump, isn't it? Fame and fortune.

He also said he was 1000% with Guam but whatever.

The governor also thanked Trump and was happy with him as president.

[TheSaint250]

Trump just called the governor of Guam... and congratulated him on Guam now being famous. That's what it's always about with Trump, isn't it? Fame and fortune.

He also said he was 1000% with Guam but whatever.

The governor also thanked Trump and was happy with him as president.

I'm certain that wasn't because Trump is the sort of petty tyrant who would pay back anything but utter sycophancy by taking it out on the people of Guam.

Well then good thing it was just a governor thanking a president for standing with Guam. So you're right--it wasn't because trump is some "tyrant" or anything else

[TheSaint250]

Of course he choked. We've gone to the brink of war before only to see the North Koreans back down from their threats

[TheSaint250]

Kind of nervous that the US will order a strike on NK.

We can only go ahead with a strike if South Korea gives us the okay. And if South Korea is in a position to give the okay, than the situation is worse than I thought.

This. We will only strike if something really is going to happen.

[TheSaint250]

Would China possibly OK South Korea getting all of the North knowing SK would be heavily distracted for years to come integrating the area?

I don't think the Chinese would mind too much since it's not the Cold War anymore but who knows

[TheSaint250]

Why is Trump's red line not a bigger deal than Obama's? Does nobody remember the 'fire and fury' threat he made last month and he did nothing...

Personally I'm happy that neither of them took it seriously. Otherwise, we'd be at war with Syria and North Korea.

[TheSaint250]

This is becoming very concerning. The Trump administration has to sh**t or get off the pot. Every day they don't attack, North Korea gets more powerful. On the other hand, if they're not going to attack, they should just admit it. All their posturing and threats haven't deterred Kim Jong Un. Does anyone really think more threats, posturing, and sanctions are going to work? If they are not going to attack, then they should take that option off the table and admit that North Korea is already a nuclear power, which we have no choice but to negotiate with them on that basis. The North Koreans want a peace treaty, which should not really be a problem. After that, they will want to develop their economy, which actually gives the U.S. some leverage, unlike now.

Right now, the Trump administration sounds like it is going to wait until the last possible minute to attack, at which point North Korean forces will be at maximum capability, but will attack nonetheless, which is the course of action guaranteed to maximize a nuclear exchange. In other words, the worst possible option. My view is the same as Steve Bannon's - if we really think about it, there is no military option. If Bannon can say it, mainstream politicians can, too.

We haven't threatened a nuclear exchange in any other way but to fight back against an attack.  The North Koreans are the ones who are likely to attack to appear strong.

[TheSaint250]

The Trump administration has been threatening an attack since April, when it started emphasizing that "all options are on the table, including military options." All military experts agree could result in a nuclear response by North Korea, and Trump has implied that he would "totally destroy" North Korea, which again, can only be done by nuclear canvass. This is not a realistic option and I wish the administration or someone in mainstream US politics would say so, so we could have a debate about it. Even Bernie Sanders is only saying more sanctions and pressure.

The sooner we realize we have no leverage over North Korea on this issue, the sooner we can start to think realistically about our options, rather than hoping for some extremely unlikely sudden North Korean change of mind. It's amazing that after 14 years of castigating Hillary Clinton over her vote for AUMF and regretting the Iraq war, now that we are faced with regional nuclear armageddon, actual nuclear war, not a single mainstream member of Congress has stood up and been vocal to say that war is not an option.

"Totally destroy" the nation if it attacks us. And saying all options are on the table is logical. If they are to threaten us, we need to think of all the options and, eventually eliminate some.

[TheSaint250]

“The US has great strength and patience,” Trump said. But he added: “If it is forced to defend ourselves or our allies, we will have no choice but to totally destroy North Korea.”

But whatever you say.

[TheSaint250]

"Just heard Foreign Minister of North Korea speak at U.N. If he echoes thoughts of Little Rocket Man, they won't be around much longer!"
https://twitter.com/realdonaldtrump/status/911789314169823232

And Rocket Man’s thoughts are of attacking the US.

[TheSaint250]

"Just heard Foreign Minister of North Korea speak at U.N. If he echoes thoughts of Little Rocket Man, they won't be around much longer!"
https://twitter.com/realdonaldtrump/status/911789314169823232

And Rocket Man’s thoughts are of attacking the US.

Nah, North Korea won't start a war it can't win.  Kim Jong-Un is behaving like a rational actor in the sense that dictatorships which gave up their WMD programs (ex: Saddam, Qaddafi, etc) were ultimately overthrown with military intervention by the West.  Iran and Syria kept theirs and both regimes are still in power.  So if you're Kim Jong-Un, the logical thing is to keep your nuclear weapons program going and adjust your saber-rattling to whatever volume is necessary to match the West's tone.  Honestly, the risk of North Korea pre-emptively attack the U.S. or any of our regional allies is negligible at most.

I agree with you on that. He probably won’t but that’s probably what he would like to do.

[TheSaint250]

"Just heard Foreign Minister of North Korea speak at U.N. If he echoes thoughts of Little Rocket Man, they won't be around much longer!"
https://twitter.com/realdonaldtrump/status/911789314169823232

And Rocket Man’s thoughts are of attacking the US.

Nah, North Korea won't start a war it can't win.  Kim Jong-Un is behaving like a rational actor in the sense that dictatorships which gave up their WMD programs (ex: Saddam, Qaddafi, etc) were ultimately overthrown with military intervention by the West.  Iran and Syria kept theirs and both regimes are still in power.  So if you're Kim Jong-Un, the logical thing is to keep your nuclear weapons program going and adjust your saber-rattling to whatever volume is necessary to match the West's tone.  Honestly, the risk of North Korea pre-emptively attack the U.S. or any of our regional allies is negligible at most.

I agree with you on that. He probably won’t but that’s probably what he would like to do.

And I'd like $100 million, but that ain't happening any time soon either

Lol