Is having heterosexual feelings a choice?

[minionofmidas]

"Be no longer so horridly, hellishly, impudently, arrogantly wicked as to judge what is sin, what not."
                                            -Abiezer Coppe-

[minionofmidas]

JMF's position, of course, is the orthodox theological one.
That doesn't care about that neocon "it's a choice" crap...it simply denies that just because something is natural and normal means it's allowed.
I could never subscribe to that view myself - I don't wage war on natural man - , but I have to say, it's a valid standpoint.

[minionofmidas]

The bible is not irrelevant in this discussion...this is a good old jmf discussion (ah, how I missed them. Really.) and nothing else is relevant.

The thing is: jmf is right in his assumptions of what the biblical authors meant when they wrote what they wrote (some minor points of omission, and many points where I simply don't know what he's talking about, not having a bible on me, not knowing it by heart, excluded).
The main one of the points where he parts company with everybody else here in this thread is that the Bible is the Word of God.
Now that's what I indeed would call purely a personal taste of his.
Obviously, since he won't discuss that point (and I can totally understand why, from his point of view), and he won't be able to convince me, or I guess any other poster who isn't convinced already, to believe anything like that, these discussions will always be somewhat pointless.

[minionofmidas]

The bible is not irrelevant in this discussion...this is a good old jmf discussion (ah, how I missed them. Really.) and nothing else is relevant.

We might as well have a discussion about the things my talking dog tells me.  Discussing others delusions is not all that fun.  Actually I'm kidding I don't have a dog, and my cat is back in the States.

What's the point in trying to insult people, though?
Anyways it's not as if jmf were the only one who believes that.

What my cat tells me, btw, is that I commit a sin whenever I do something that I myself do not approve of, or would not approve of if others did it to me in the same circumstances.
My cat calls that the Doctrine of the Inner Light. Yeah, my cat is a Ranter or maybe a very early Quaker.

[minionofmidas]

I don't think you get it. The bible is irrelevant in this conversation. We are talking science.

Sorry, I was using you to talk to angus since he is ignoring me.

My point to you is that I have MANY desires that I didn't choose to have;  they are simply part of my human nature.  But just because these desires happen naturally and are not by choice, that doesn't make it ok for me to attempt to satisfy those desires.   Agreed?

What possible reason could their be for thinking it wouldn't be 'OK' to satisfy homosexual desires?
They're:
1) private
2) consenting
3) harmless to those not participating
I mean really you might as well condemn masturbation.

For all you know, he might. Throughout the early modern ages (I'm not sure about before...but probably before as well) most Christian divines did.

[minionofmidas]

also, to your question about satisfying desires, you can't really equate the desire to, say, steal, which is specifically forbidden (as I understand it) in the old testament, with homosexuality and witchcraft, which (by your own admission) is not. 

I think you meant New. All of them are explicitly forbidden in the Old Testament.

[minionofmidas]

That has never been debunked...millions of people just didn't decide to lie about themselves.

That is not what I was saying....nevermind.

Yeah, that's usually the way I feel after a debate with him JMF. lol

LOL!

jmf is right in this case, though...that's really not what he was talking about.

But your arson mention is from the Old Testament, J. That won't do.
And far from all arson is committed due to hatred or envy (or covetousness, for that matter.) I'd want a theological definition of "lawlessness" before I can decide whether that captures it.

[minionofmidas]

He's referring to consensual incest, not to rape, though...