Palestine college student protest megathread

[ingemann]

Something that I've been wondering as this has continued to escalate over the last 6-7 months.

It's one thing to be passionate about an issue, especially something you deem human rights issues, which I completely understand.

But the way that so many young people continue to seem *SO* laser-focused on this *one* particular issue is just coming off more and more performative to me. I'm not sure if I can explain myself well, it's just... you see the stuff on campuses, the protests, the 'uncommitted' voters who are once again solely focused on this issue.

So many of these people - on social media and IRL are the same people who rarely ever know what is going on in the U.S., they rarely know how government works, they rarely know accomplishments of Biden's, etc. etc., but yet at the same time they think they're the most studied and versed on a decades-long foreign conflict? Like is this just becoming a rallying cry for some people of "I want something to belong to"? Because again, it's okay to feel strongly about a topic. But the level of 'passion' we've seen from a lot of these people is so unhinged that it doesn't feel organic.

Like, Donald Trump is running to be president. January 6th. Abortion and reproductive rights bans. Climate deniers. Election deniers. There are so many big things happening domestically in this country that you would think would warrant this attention from those people that live here, but their sole issue right now is ... a foreign conflict thousands of miles away that is very complex?

It just doesn't add up for me. And of course, social media and protests amplify these things where most young people (at least the ones I know, am friends with, encounter, etc.) are way more 'normal' on this topic than a lot of these people, but it still feels like a ton of them who are just making this entire conflict their personality.

I just saw an article about some Seattle-area schools (high schools and colleges) staging walkouts in protest of the Israel/Gaza war. THIS is what is getting you to stage walk outs? A foreign conflict that has been raging for decades that you probably don't even understand? Yet the things happening in this very country don't matter to you at all?

Sorry for the rant, it just has been so exhausting.

Why are the rest of USA so obsessed with Israel? Why were people in the 70-80ties obsessed with South Rhodesia and South Africa, why did people keep bringing up the Mugabe’s failed policies in the 00es. People obsess over things because it fit into a greater political narrative and domestic culture war.

I have for two decades thought it was obvious that USA would end up here where it is now. Because while Israel is not Apartheid South Africa, many of the same original sins exits in Israel as in ASA being a “White” “settler” “colonial” society in conflict with the indigenous “POC” population, the political narrative of the American left would at some point win out, it was only hold back by the fact that part of the Democratic coalition was very pro-Israeli and pro-Jewish. But it was also worsen by the election of Trump, who may have run as lukewarm on Israel was maybe the biggest supporter of Israel among American presidents and of course Bibi’s behavior worsen it, and both created a rift between pro-Israeli attitude and the left and the Democratic Party.

Also interesting I didn’t mention the Palestinians once, that was because no one cares about the Palestinians, they’re in best case just faceless extras*, and in worse0t case hated.

*something they have in common with American Indians, when the left discuss the original sin of USA.

[ingemann]

Everyone blaming "disinfo" and Tik Tok is off their rocker.  The Israel-Palestine discourse is so evergreen because it maps neatly onto left-wing narratives about imperialism, racism, "settler" colonialism, etc., etc.  These have been big debates in Western democracies for decades, not anything the youth have recently invented.

Most campuses have also long had chapters of various pro-Palestinian organizations, often for the above reasons, in a way that no other cause does. There was never a major pro-Ukrainian or pro-Yemeni or pro-Armenian structure on campuses - maybe the closest are the Free Tibet movements and anti-apartheid organizations. As the conflict in Gaza blew up, these pro-Palestinian organizations gained sympathy and were able to seize upon the rising salience of the conflict.

Israel also has organizations on virtually every campus.

That is irrelevant. The comparison was to other atrocities and genocides across the world that garner less attention. I don’t think anyone is asking “Why don’t left-leaning young adult support Israel?”

But that’s the real answer to the question.

[ingemann]

"why are so many young people so obsessed with Palestine?"
"its due to all the pro_Jewish groups on campuses!"

<admit it's about the racism without admitting it's about the racism>

Why are you conflating pro Israel with pro Jewish?

Because there are clearly a connection, it’s not a 1/1, but being pro-Jewish is connected to being pro-Israeli. Compare support of Israel to the foreign support of Armenia.

[ingemann]

I'm not complaining. It's good to finally see pushback to our government's idiotic policy of supporting Israel, no questions asked, despite all of the sh!t they've been doing, and getting away with, over the years.

Of course, the assholes who harass and threaten Jews for no reason other than simply being Jewish, can go f**k themselves.

Pretending that harassment of Jews and opposition to Israel is unconnected is foolish.

[ingemann]

Really inappropriate for the faculty to get involved in this.

It's very obvious that they would not be doing this if the students were protesting for the KKK or MAGA or pro-life or any other right-coded cause.  They probably wouldn't even do it for a student protest that was pro-Israel or lamenting the 10/7 attacks.

They are doing it for this protest because they agree politically with the message the students are sending, and that is inappropriate because it involves the faculty going against their own employer (Columbia University) in order to provide favorable treatment to a certain group of students based on their political beliefs.

This is aside from the point that making such a silly demonstration to protect students because you agree with their political beliefs is especially bad when those political beliefs are "there is only one solution, intifada revolution" and "from the river to the sea, Palestine will be free" which can be heard ad nauseum throughout the background noise of the video.

It's sad too because there are thousands of under-employed professors out there that actually want to educate students, but the top universities are full of these crackpots. I'm a huge advocate for getting a college education, but as I've said before, do not waste your money on these places.

Well that’s the universities choice.

Honestly I don’t get why more blue avatars doesn’t just decides to eat popcorn and enjoy the spectacle of the chickens coming home to roost.

[ingemann]

Being able to tell people you were expelled from Columbia for participating in the Gaza sit ins sounds like it probably guarantees you a decade-plus of employment of some kind in the nonprofit sector. I'm sure they'll be fine.

I don't know if this was meant in jest, but no, getting expelled from an Ivy League school is going to have career consequences for most of the students. Maybe a couple of them will be able to spin it into a great story for a sympathetic hiring manager, but most won't. How many "employment of some kind in the nonprofit sector" jobs even exist and how many of the expelled students want that?

And before anyone starts, there's no need for anyone to go to an Ivy League school. You can have a happy and successful life by going to your local state university, and I'm sure a lot of these expelled students will do just that. But there are opportunities that people with a degree from Columbia often get, that these students were in line to get, and it's a real shame they pissed those opportunities away for nothing. Not a single thing they've done in any of these protests will make one iota of difference in what's going on in Gaza, completely disconnected from the situation on the ground there.

Hot take, anyone who is unable to spin this into greater opportunities or is not already rich enough that this will have little consequences for them, would get just as little out of graduating from a Ivy League University as a state one.  

[ingemann]

So Is this an ideological win for the right? They've been calling out colleges and universities as indoctrination camps for a long time now. DEI as a whole has also probably taken a huge beating in public opinion.

Is the the Left self destruction in the most comically and embarrassing way possible a win for the Right? Yes I would say so.

[ingemann]

Was just talking to some of my younger gen z coworkers about this.

They are white, educated, left leaning young professionals in DC. The consensus from them was that the campus protestors are in the right and are treated unfairly, America is supporting war crimes and genocide, and these college students are young and broke so all they can do to make their voice heard is to protest.

One colleague who worked for the PA Dem Party in 2020 said she is ashamed that she helped Biden get elected but she will still vote for him.

I agreed with them on some of their points but said I worry about the implications of the US abandoning Israel. I also said I wish the protestors had the same energy for the hostages.

Idk how to feel. I don't want to be on the wrong side of history, but I don't know what the right side is. I wish I could see things as clearly as they do, but I just don't.

The truth is that this is a very complex issue. Let’s say Israel pull out of Gaza, what will happen then? Hamas will reestablish its position and rebuild, and begin throwing rockets against Israel again and Israel will attack them again resulting in more death then.

The solution which is needed is another occupier of Gaza than Israel, of course no one is really willing to step up.