Pelosi, Schumer should say they're open to SOME funding for The Wall-but first..

[All Along The Watchtower]

...they should drive a hard bargain regarding what they want, and be as ambitious as possible in their demands in exchange for negotiating over The Wall. Trump says he's a great at Making Deals, make him prove it!

Democrats, now controlling the House - but only the House, not the Senate or the other two branches of government - need to demonstrate that they're a responsible party of government, that they're not reflexively opposed to negotiating with Trump on what is clearly an issue on which he won't budge, and on which his political base and his friends on FOX, etc. will consistently hold his feet to the fire, as all saw at the end of 2018.

Democrats absolutely do need to use the leverage they have - but if you're a Democrat and you want to get concessions from the Republicans, you have to separate what is negotiable on the Republican side from what is clearly not. Being 100% anti-Trump is all well and good for the Democratic base, and I am obviously personally sympathetic and largely agree in spirit, but it's frankly not good politics when you stray outside the borders (no pun intended) of the "Resistance." Nor does it lead to good governance, as it turns out. He IS the President and he does have the Senate majority and House Republicans in his corner (for now), after all...

Related: Democrats should ruthlessly drive a wedge between Mitch McConnell and Donald Trump. It's clear which of these two is more (or less, if you prefer) popular among Republican voters. It would help Democrats politically, but more importantly, it would help break Cocaine Mitch's stranglehold over the Senate! (Honestly, does ANYONE like that guy?! Even Ted Cruz has a genuine ideology...)

This isn't just good politics IMO. It would be good for the country and the world and help move us forward from this ridiculous and completely destructive government shutdown. Unfortunately I think too many of my fellow Democratic voters won't countenance negotiating with President Trump, even if only on what I can tell are just a few absolute deal-breakers for him - like The Wall.

That's my view anyway, feel free to burn me at the stake for this, etc.

[Devout Centrist]

Simply attach all wall funding onto HR 1, and toss in Medicare for All, a repeal of the taxable cap for Social Security, along with amnesty and a pathway to citizenship for all nonviolent illegal immigrants.

Mission accomplished.

[Storr]

Simply attach all wall funding onto HR 1, and toss in Medicare for All, a repeal of the taxable cap for Social Security, along with amnesty and a pathway to citizenship for all nonviolent illegal immigrants.

Mission accomplished.

Add in DC, Puerto Rico, and Marianas (Guam + CNMI) statehood and boom 6 likely Dem Senate seats.
Guam + CNMI, makes geographic sense they are both in the Marianas island chain and in order for a large enough population for a state, 220,618 according to wikipedia. There is precedent for admitting states with population similar to the Marianas among just the 5 most recently admitted states. Arizona only had a population of 204,534 in 1910, with statehood in 1912. Alaska had a population of 226,167 in 1960, with statehood in 1959. Utah had a population of 210,779 in 1890 (276,749 in 1900), with statehood in 1896. New Mexico had a population of 327,301 in 1910, with statehood in 1912.

[NewYorkExpress]

The wall for Trump and Pence resigning. Nothing more, nothing less.

[Former Dean Phillips Supporters for Haley (I guess???!?) 👁️]

Simply attach all wall funding onto HR 1, and toss in Medicare for All, a repeal of the taxable cap for Social Security, along with amnesty and a pathway to citizenship for all nonviolent illegal immigrants.

Mission accomplished.

Add in DC, Puerto Rico, and Marianas (Guam + CNMI) statehood and boom 6 likely Dem Senate seats.
Guam + CNMI, makes geographic sense they are both in the Marianas island chain and in order for a large enough population for a state, 220,618 according to wikipedia. There is precedent for admitting states with population similar to the Marianas among just the 5 most recently admitted states. Arizona only had a population of 204,534 in 1910, with statehood in 1912. Alaska had a population of 226,167 in 1960, with statehood in 1959. Utah had a population of 210,779 in 1890 (276,749 in 1900), with statehood in 1896. New Mexico had a population of 327,301 in 1910, with statehood in 1912.

Precisely. It is well worth it to trade a pointless wall for all those things. Another bunch of Dem Senators plus major progressive policy achievements. Sure, a wall will have some negative environmental effects locally, especially in TX, but what's that compared to Medicare for All etc?

[Dr. Arch]

Simply attach all wall funding onto HR 1, and toss in Medicare for All, a repeal of the taxable cap for Social Security, along with amnesty and a pathway to citizenship for all nonviolent illegal immigrants.

Mission accomplished.

Add in DC, Puerto Rico, and Marianas (Guam + CNMI) statehood and boom 6 likely Dem Senate seats.
Guam + CNMI, makes geographic sense they are both in the Marianas island chain and in order for a large enough population for a state, 220,618 according to wikipedia. There is precedent for admitting states with population similar to the Marianas among just the 5 most recently admitted states. Arizona only had a population of 204,534 in 1910, with statehood in 1912. Alaska had a population of 226,167 in 1960, with statehood in 1959. Utah had a population of 210,779 in 1890 (276,749 in 1900), with statehood in 1896. New Mexico had a population of 327,301 in 1910, with statehood in 1912.

Precisely. It is well worth it to trade a pointless wall for all those things. Another bunch of Dem Senators plus major progressive policy achievements. Sure, a wall will have some negative environmental effects locally, especially in TX, but what's that compared to Medicare for All etc?

That would be too much for just a wall, but I'd be okay with conceding funding for the stupid thing if it helps save lives (Medicare for all, SS improvements). It could always be torn down after everyone realizes how dumb the idea is to begin with.

[Ashley Biden's Diary]

LMAO, the Democrats in leadership don't want Medicare For All. They are bought and paid for by the insurance industry. Are you people high?

[Absentee Voting Ghost of Ruin]

No wall.

No monument to modern American Fascism.

No negotiation with the hostage-taking GOP terrorists in DC.

[7,052,770]

If it were all just about politics, sure there could be negotiation for a wall and some liberal win too, but the wall is an actively jad idea that will hurt America, so they would have to offer something really big to overcome that hurt for it even to be a consideration. Just one thing isn't going to cut it.

One thing I would be willing to consider is the wall in exchange for DC, Guam, and Puerto Rican statehood. Those American citizens deserve representation in Congress, even if they decide to elect Trumpist Republicans.

[Starry Eyed Jagaloon]

A wall for 2 million visas per year, keeping DACA, a pathway to citizenship, and some environmental protection for the border region. Nothing less.

[All Along The Watchtower]

No wall.

No monument to modern American Fascism.

No negotiation with the hostage-taking GOP terrorists in DC.

Enjoy the prolonged shutdown and the suffering it causes.

[Reaganfan]

No wall.

No monument to modern American Fascism.

No negotiation with the hostage-taking GOP terrorists in DC.

I'm sorry you care about inconsequential foreigners over American citizens.

[Dr. Arch]

No wall.

No monument to modern American Fascism.

No negotiation with the hostage-taking GOP terrorists in DC.

I'm sorry you care about inconsequential foreigners over American citizens.

You don't either. Just take a look at those hundreds of thousands of hard working Americans your master negotiating idol has taken hostage.

[Reaganfan]

No wall.

No monument to modern American Fascism.

No negotiation with the hostage-taking GOP terrorists in DC.

I'm sorry you care about inconsequential foreigners over American citizens.

You don't either. Just take a look at those hundreds of thousands of hard working Americans your master negotiating idol has taken hostage.

You don't understand. Many WWC people hate federal workers. I've spent 30 years since I was a kid hearing jokes about Reagan firing the ATC workers. Many WWC people think federal workers are paid too much, bad at work, and impossible to fire. It's not exactly a good thing, but I don't think it factors as much sympathy as you guys keep saying.

[Peanut]

No wall.

No monument to modern American Fascism.

No negotiation with the hostage-taking GOP terrorists in DC.

I'm sorry you care about inconsequential foreigners over American citizens.

You don't either. Just take a look at those hundreds of thousands of hard working Americans your master negotiating idol has taken hostage.

You don't understand. Many WWC people hate federal workers. I've spent 30 years since I was a kid hearing jokes about Reagan firing the ATC workers. Many WWC people think federal workers are paid too much, bad at work, and impossible to fire. It's not exactly a good thing, but I don't think it factors as much sympathy as you guys keep saying.

And that makes it more acceptable to cut off their pay?

[Reaganfan]

No wall.

No monument to modern American Fascism.

No negotiation with the hostage-taking GOP terrorists in DC.

I'm sorry you care about inconsequential foreigners over American citizens.

You don't either. Just take a look at those hundreds of thousands of hard working Americans your master negotiating idol has taken hostage.

You don't understand. Many WWC people hate federal workers. I've spent 30 years since I was a kid hearing jokes about Reagan firing the ATC workers. Many WWC people think federal workers are paid too much, bad at work, and impossible to fire. It's not exactly a good thing, but I don't think it factors as much sympathy as you guys keep saying.

And that makes it more acceptable to cut off their pay?

I didn't say that, I said I think you guys are overestimating some of the public sympathy.

[Karpatsky]

No wall.

No monument to modern American Fascism.

No negotiation with the hostage-taking GOP terrorists in DC.

I'm sorry you care about inconsequential foreigners over American citizens.

You don't either. Just take a look at those hundreds of thousands of hard working Americans your master negotiating idol has taken hostage.

You don't understand. Many WWC people hate federal workers. I've spent 30 years since I was a kid hearing jokes about Reagan firing the ATC workers. Many WWC people think federal workers are paid too much, bad at work, and impossible to fire. It's not exactly a good thing, but I don't think it factors as much sympathy as you guys keep saying.

And that makes it more acceptable to cut off their pay?

I didn't say that, I said I think you guys are overestimating some of the public sympathy.

No one mentioned 'public' opinion, the person you were quoting was talking about your opinion. When you say 'many WWC people', do you mean 'I'?

[MASHED POTATOES. VOTE!]

No wall.

No monument to modern American Fascism.

No negotiation with the hostage-taking GOP terrorists in DC.

I'm sorry you care about inconsequential foreigners over American citizens.

Oh, the irony of Naso calling other people "inconsequential".

[Comrade Funk]

No wall.

No monument to modern American Fascism.

No negotiation with the hostage-taking GOP terrorists in DC.

I'm sorry you care about inconsequential foreigners over American citizens.

You don't either. Just take a look at those hundreds of thousands of hard working Americans your master negotiating idol has taken hostage.

You don't understand. Many WWC people hate federal workers. I've spent 30 years since I was a kid hearing jokes about Reagan firing the ATC workers. Many WWC people think federal workers are paid too much, bad at work, and impossible to fire. It's not exactly a good thing, but I don't think it factors as much sympathy as you guys keep saying.

WWC these days is just the politically correct way of saying resentful racists. A lot of people who technically should be considered "white working class" are receiving no income this week.

[Absentee Voting Ghost of Ruin]

No wall.

No monument to modern American Fascism.

No negotiation with the hostage-taking GOP terrorists in DC.

Enjoy the prolonged shutdown and the suffering it causes.

The shutdown does not have agency. The shutdown did not go on national TV and claim credit for itself. The shutdown is not refusing to allow bills to the floor of the Senate.