Northeast Assembly Thread

[tpfkaw]

Hmm, seems you're right.  Anyways, I find that too vague (after an elected official is stripped of their position, what then?), so I'll amend my amendment () to replace that one.

[Sbane]

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I would like to propose an amendment. My concern is that in the Senate, it is quite hard to keep track of what would count as consecutive votes. Unlike our Assembly, which deals with a bill at a time, the Senate works on multiple pieces of legislation at once. Some get passed quicker than others. Enforcing it would be a mess. Rather, by keeping the quite strict standard of four missed non-consecutive votes, I believe we will achieve the same results. Also notice that I have not messed around with provision 3. It will be much easier to keep track of what are consecutive signing/vetoing of bills in our assembly thread.

[tpfkaw]

Amendment accepted as friendly, though I'll also take out the phrase "non-consecutive."

[tpfkaw]

Edit: Debate has closed, we will now enter voting procedure on this amendment.  Approval of an amendment requires a two-thirds vote of a majority of assemblymen.  (5 assemblymen, minimum is 2 in favor, 1 opposed).

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[tpfkaw]

Aye.

[Grumpier Than Thou]

Aye.

[Sbane]

Aye

[Free Palestine]

/e/

[tpfkaw]

Voting is now over.

The amendment passes with 4 yeas, 0 nays, and 1 not voting.

I will now ask the governor to start a voting booth for this amendment.  The amendment requires 2/3rds approval from at least 1/3rd of registered voters in the Northeast (39 registered voters, so at least 13 would need to vote).

[tpfkaw]

We shall now move on to the next piece of legislation...

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Sponsor: Rep. Jake Matthews

The question is whether the bill should be considered?

The ayes have it.

Debate shall continue until March 3, 2011, 12:32 PM EST, unless debate is extended or shortened in accordance with the SOAP.

The sponsor, Jake Matthews, has the floor.

[Grumpier Than Thou]

Thank you Mr. Speaker.

My friends, during my campaign around the region, I met many people. I shared stories, laughs and even moments of sorrow. When I asked these people what they'd like to see changed in our region, the overwhelming response was our tax structure. Currently our tax structure is so confusing, not even I can figure it out. There's so many different brackets for taxation, it is too much. With the passage of this proposal, not only will we see a drastic change in our region's economic prosperity, but we will also see a greater increase in our constituents' happiness, which is what we should all desire.

I yield back the balance of my time.

[tpfkaw]

I'll suggest we amend it so that the tax will be 5.5%, instead of 8%, given the current tax law; I wouldn't want Grover Norquist getting all pissy.

[Grumpier Than Thou]

I think 5.5 is more reasonable. So, do we vote on the amendment itself and add it to the bill if it passes or will we just vote on the amended bill?

[tpfkaw]

I think 5.5 is more reasonable. So, do we vote on the amendment itself and add it to the bill if it passes or will we just vote on the amended bill?

If the sponsor of the bill accepts an amendment as friendly, then it doesn't need to be voted on.

[Grumpier Than Thou]

I'll accept the amendment.

[Napoleon]

Who are we to decide what is or isn't a health hazard?
I see you included marijuana, which is legal for medicinal purposes in many states and likely will be in Connecticut soon. It makes no sense to have prescribed medications legislated as a health hazard, itself a vague term with no restrictions on application. Is a mountain bike or an automobile a health hazard that we will be taxing? I can't in good faith vote in favor of a tax system that is discriminatory against the poorest among us and those who are in need of medical assistance. Consequently, I think that our tax codes should be aimed at helping these people rise up and/or have the ability to get their medications at fair market costs rather than having sin taxes that are quite arbitrary and undefined.

[tpfkaw]

I see you included marijuana, which is legal for medicinal purposes in many states and likely will be in Connecticut soon.

A non-sequitur, marijuana is legal for all purposes everywhere in Atlasia.

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With or without good faith, you can't vote without swearing in...



I agree with Napoleon about that section, btw.

[Napoleon]

I swore in a few days I ago, I thought. I just copied sbane.
Thanks for letting me know the legal status of marijuana has been changed. I still contend that we should not be deciding which specific products should or should not be taxed, though I would be fine with general sales tax exemptions for necessities such as food. I would offer my own amendment but I lack the legal expertise in drafting statute free of loopholes or legal ambiguities.

[Grumpier Than Thou]

Who are we to decide what is or isn't a health hazard?
I see you included marijuana, which is legal for medicinal purposes in many states and likely will be in Connecticut soon. It makes no sense to have prescribed medications legislated as a health hazard, itself a vague term with no restrictions on application. Is a mountain bike or an automobile a health hazard that we will be taxing? I can't in good faith vote in favor of a tax system that is discriminatory against the poorest among us and those who are in need of medical assistance. Consequently, I think that our tax codes should be aimed at helping these people rise up and/or have the ability to get their medications at fair market costs rather than having sin taxes that are quite arbitrary and undefined.

Marijuana is already legal recreationally...

[Sbane]

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I would like to propose an amendment. First of all I think we need to add an exemption to the flat tax to help the poorest amongst us. I would prefer a progressive tax, with few brackets, but this is still better than the bill as currently written. I would also like to disagree with Jake's point that extra brackets are what make tax filing a chore. The brackets are a minor inconvenience, but it is the scores of different deductions out there that really gets people frustrated since you have to figure out your eligibility for each deduction. That is what makes tax filing confusing and time consuming for most people. Although there are a bunch of these deduction at the federal level, I don't think they exist at our regional level. If they do, I would be in support of a real tax simplification bill where all such deductions are repealed.

Furthermore, there is no need to ban sales and property taxes. Property taxes are what really concern me, since they are a local matter and the main source of revenue for our municipalities. Will the region now be supplying all of our municipalities with tax revenue?

I also struck out provision 7 as my edit of provision 1 would violate it. I don't think it is fair for someone who earns $20k a year, and somehow puts a roof over his head and food on his plate, to pay the same tax rate as someone who makes $100k. Yes, confiscatory tax rates should be avoided and are nothing but rank class warfare. But at the other end, you have to be practical and realize not everyone can pay the same amount of taxes as everybody else. I do believe my exemption for the first $15k of income is a common sense measure to help the poor, and is most certainly not class warfare.

I should also add that income tax revenue tends to be quite volatile, as opposed to sales tax revenue. I don't think it would be a good idea to get rid of the sales tax entirely.

[Grumpier Than Thou]

I'm sorry Sbane, but I'm not going to accept that amendment. Looks like we have to vote on it. Mr. Speaker, may we please begin a vote on the amendment?

[Sbane]

Could you clarify something for me, Jake? When you say no other taxes will be established other than the income tax, do you mean by the region or are you going to force the municipalities to do the same? Where do you suppose municipalities will get their money? How will the schools be paid for?

[Grumpier Than Thou]

Could you clarify something for me, Jake? When you say no other taxes will be established other than the income tax, do you mean by the region or are you going to force the municipalities to do the same? Where do you suppose municipalities will get their money? How will the schools be paid for?

Just for the region, the municipalities will conduct their own ways of taxation.

As for schools, I personally support school choice but I would never propose or support legislation to defund public schools.

[Sbane]

Could you clarify something for me, Jake? When you say no other taxes will be established other than the income tax, do you mean by the region or are you going to force the municipalities to do the same? Where do you suppose municipalities will get their money? How will the schools be paid for?

Just for the region, the municipalities will conduct their own ways of taxation.

As for schools, I personally support school choice but I would never propose or support legislation to defund public schools.

All right, that is good to hear. I still think we shouldn't get rid of sales taxes, so I will be voting for my amendment.

[Grumpier Than Thou]

Could you clarify something for me, Jake? When you say no other taxes will be established other than the income tax, do you mean by the region or are you going to force the municipalities to do the same? Where do you suppose municipalities will get their money? How will the schools be paid for?

Just for the region, the municipalities will conduct their own ways of taxation.

As for schools, I personally support school choice but I would never propose or support legislation to defund public schools.

All right, that is good to hear. I still think we shouldn't get rid of sales taxes, so I will be voting for my amendment.

Sales taxes are useless, it's paying another few dollars and cents when money's already tight.