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  Northeast Assembly Thread (search mode)
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Author Topic: Northeast Assembly Thread  (Read 329015 times)
cinyc
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« on: September 29, 2009, 12:57:26 am »
« edited: September 29, 2009, 01:00:47 am by cinyc »

Shouldn't we be passing enabling legislation before selecting a Speaker? 
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Here's what Representative Kalwejt's proposed President pro tempore amendment said (I've replaced "President pro tempore" with "Speaker" and cleaned up some of the language):

Northeast Assembly Speaker Act

1. The Northeast Assembly shall elect a Speaker from among its members at the start of each new Northeast Assembly term.
2. The Speaker shall assume the role of presiding officer of the Northeast Assembly whenever the Lieutenant Governor publicly confirms he will be absent from the Northeast Assembly or the Lieutenant Governor otherwise publicly designates the Speaker to this role for a specified period.
3. The Speaker shall serve until the end of the Northeast Assembly term, unless the Speaker is removed or resigns from the office of the Speaker.
4. The Speaker may be removed from office by a majority vote of all members of the Northeast Assembly.
5. If the office of the Speaker is vacant for any reason, the Northeast Assembly shall elect a new Speaker from among its members as soon as possible.
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Question: Do we want the Speaker to be elected by a clear majority or is a plurality vote okay?  Or do we want some sort of proportional voting?
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cinyc
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« Reply #1 on: September 29, 2009, 01:29:24 am »


I think so too.  If we all think so, the law should read:

Northeast Assembly Speaker Act

1. The Northeast Assembly shall elect a Speaker from among its members by a majority vote of all members of the Northeast Assembly at the start of each new Northeast Assembly term.
2. The Speaker shall assume the role of presiding officer of the Northeast Assembly whenever the Lieutenant Governor publicly confirms he will be absent from the Northeast Assembly or the Lieutenant Governor otherwise publicly designates the Speaker to this role for a specified period.
3. The Speaker shall serve until the end of the Northeast Assembly term, unless the Speaker is removed or resigns from the office of the Speaker.
4. The Speaker may be removed from office by a majority vote of all members of the Northeast Assembly.
5. If the office of the Speaker becomes vacant for any reason, the Northeast Assembly shall elect a new Speaker from among its members by a majority vote of all members of the Northeast Assembly as soon as possible.
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cinyc
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« Reply #2 on: September 29, 2009, 12:19:44 pm »


Plus, someone elected with only a plurality could easily be removed by a majority at any time - unless we require removal by a supermajority like 2/3rds or 3/4ths.
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cinyc
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« Reply #3 on: September 29, 2009, 02:06:02 pm »

Northeast Assembly Speaker Act: Aye
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cinyc
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« Reply #4 on: September 29, 2009, 04:22:50 pm »
« Edited: September 30, 2009, 01:12:48 am by cinyc »

I've skimmed the Senate's complex rules regarding debate and voting procedures - the often-amended OSPR.   Yikes! 

I don't think a regional Assembly needs a Standing Order that is quite that complex.  In fact, I can't find any equivalent resolution passed by the Mideast Assembly.  Nevertheless, I think we should enact some sort of Standing Order on Assembly Procedure (SOAP), though - at a minimum, limiting the number of bills that can be on the floor at one time (1? 2? 3?), the order in which they shall be taken up (chronologically in the order proposed?  Lt. Governor's discretion?), and specifying a period for debate (72 hours?) and a voting period (24 hours?).   Otherwise, there may be chaos going forward.

Edit:  Whoops!  I meant to add this as a new response, not edit this post.  The original post basically said I'd look into what the Senate's procedural rules say on this matter.
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cinyc
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« Reply #5 on: September 29, 2009, 04:29:57 pm »

Votes open for a minimum of 24 hours.
Ability to change vote only until the final tally.


Except for emergency action, perhaps?  The Senate seems to have a rule allowing shorter votes for emergency bills.
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cinyc
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« Reply #6 on: September 30, 2009, 12:10:00 am »

Aye on Smid for Speaker.
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cinyc
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« Reply #7 on: September 30, 2009, 01:11:48 am »

I've skimmed the Senate's complex rules regarding debate and voting procedures - the often-amended OSPR.   Yikes! 

I don't think a regional Assembly needs a Standing Order that is quite that complex.  In fact, I can't find any equivalent resolution passed by the Mideast Assembly.  Nevertheless, I think we should enact some sort of Standing Order on Assembly Procedure (SOAP), though - at a minimum, limiting the number of bills that can be on the floor at one time (1? 2? 3?), the order in which they shall be taken up (chronologically in the order proposed?  Lt. Governor's discretion?), and specifying a period for debate (72 hours?) and a voting period (24 hours?).   Otherwise, there may be chaos going forward.
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cinyc
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« Reply #8 on: September 30, 2009, 10:27:05 am »


I'll draft something when I get a chance, hopefully later today.
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cinyc
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« Reply #9 on: September 30, 2009, 02:08:01 pm »
« Edited: September 30, 2009, 02:12:09 pm by cinyc »

Here's my first draft:

Standing Order on Assembly Procedure

1. Proposed Legislation Thread
(a) The Lt. Governor shall open a new Northeast Assembly proposed legislation thread at the start of each Northeast Assembly term.
(b) Representatives shall post the full text of any proposed legislation in a response to the Northeast Assembly proposed legislation thread for the current term.  Each response shall contain only one piece of proposed legislation. 
(c) Nothing shall be posted to the Northeast Assembly proposed legislation thread except proposed legislation.

2. Movement of Legislation to the Northeast Assembly Floor
(a) Except as provided in subsection (c), the Lt. Governor shall introduce legislation from the Northeast Assembly proposed legislation thread on the Northeast Assembly floor in chronological order, starting with the earliest piece of proposed legislation, except that the Lt. Governor shall not introduce more than two (2) pieces of legislation from the same Representative before introducing legislation from other Representatives that has been proposed before the date such third piece of proposed legislation would have otherwise been brought to the Northeast Assembly floor.
(b) Only one piece of legislation shall be placed on the Northeast Assembly floor at a time.
(c)  Any Representative may make a motion to suspend section 2(a) of this Standing Order to move a piece proposed legislation to the top of the queue.  The motion shall be immediately put to a vote on the Northeast Assembly floor.  Such vote shall be open for 24 hours.  If the motion passes by a vote of the majority of all Representatives (with abstentions and absences counted as nay votes), the Lt. Governor shall move such piece of proposed legislation to the Northeast Assembly floor immediately after any legislation then currently on the Northeast Assembly floor is voted upon or tabled.

3. Legislative Debates and Voting
(a) Except as otherwise provided in subsection (h), all proposed legislation shall be open for debate until seventy-two (72) hours after the Lt. Governor introduces it to the Northeast Assembly floor.
(b) During debate, Representatives may suggest amendments to proposed legislation.  If the sponsor of the proposed legislation publicly deems the amendment friendly, no vote on the amendment shall be required.  If the sponsor of the proposed legislation does not publicly deem the amendment friendly, a vote on the amendment shall be taken at the end of the debate period.
(c) The sponsor of a proposed amendment may remove it from the Assembly floor by tabling it at any time before the end of the debate period.
(d) A vote will be held on all proposed amendments not deemed friendly at the end of the debate period.  Such vote shall be open for twenty-four (24) hours.  An amendment shall pass  if a majority of Representatives vote in favor of it (with abstentions and absences not counted as votes).
(e)  The sponsor of a piece of proposed legislation may remove it from the Assembly floor by tabling it at any time before a final vote is taken on the proposed legislation.
(f) A final vote the proposed legislation shall take place immediately after the Lt. Governor certifies the vote on any proposed amendments (or, if there are no such amendments, at the end of the debate period).  Such vote shall be open for twenty-four (24) hours.  A piece of proposed legislation shall pass if a majority of Representatives vote in favor of it (with abstentions and absences not counted as votes).
(g) The Lt. Governor shall certify the results of any vote within twenty-four (24) hours of the end of the voting period.
(h) Any Representative may make a motion to suspend sections 3(a), 3(d) or 3(f) of this Standing Order to increase or decrease the time of the debate or voting period.  The motion shall be immediately put to a vote on the Northeast Assembly floor.  Such vote shall be open for 24 hours.  If the motion passes by a vote of the majority of all Representatives (with abstentions and absences counted as nay votes), the relevant period shall be changed.

4. Terminology
(a) All legislation regarding the rules of the Northeast Assembly shall be called Standing Orders.
(b) All proposed legislation that requires the signature of the Governor shall be called a Bill until signed and thereafter an Act.
(c) The Lt. Governor shall maintain a public list of Standing Orders, unsuccessful bills actually voted upon, and Acts in the Atlasia Wiki for the Northeast, with a link to the text of such legislation.
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cinyc
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« Reply #10 on: September 30, 2009, 02:30:36 pm »
« Edited: September 30, 2009, 02:40:42 pm by cinyc »

No one answered or addressed my question the first time, so allow me to repeat it (with some rephrasing): Are citizens still able to propose legislation with signatories, or are we now just a mini-fed?

That's one of the two things I'm checking into - what the final amendment said on that and veto overrides.  Both would need to be built into the queue somehow.  I suspect we'd take up overrides immediately after a bill is vetoed, regardless of whether anything else is on the floor and we'd put citizen legislation to the top of the queue.
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Edit: 2 citizens may propose legislation for the Assembly to take up, as may the Governor.  Both have to be added to the queue somehow.  Proposal: Governor waits like everyone else, citizens get bills put to the top of the queue after current business is voted upon.  We'd have to have separate procedures for amendments, since nothing would be friendly unless we let the Governor and/or those citizens participate when their legislation is on the floor.

On veto overrides, it appears that if we vote for a piece of legislation a second time, the Governor's veto is ineffective (See Article IV(xi)).   That's not so great for the governor's powers, but I propose we take up veto overrides immediately simultaneously with any other legislation on the floor.
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cinyc
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« Reply #11 on: September 30, 2009, 02:57:24 pm »
« Edited: September 30, 2009, 03:13:27 pm by cinyc »

Second Draft (new language in red)

Standing Order on Assembly Procedure

1. Proposed Legislation Thread
(a) The Lt. Governor shall open a new Northeast Assembly proposed legislation thread at the start of each Northeast Assembly term.
(b) Representatives, the Governor and any concerned Northeast citizen shall post the full text of any proposed legislation in a response to the Northeast Assembly proposed legislation thread for the current term.  Each response shall contain only one piece of proposed legislation. 
(c) Nothing shall be posted to the Northeast Assembly proposed legislation thread except proposed legislation or a Northeast citizen's signature for proposed citizen legislation.

2. Movement of Legislation to the Northeast Assembly Floor
(a) Except as provided in subsections (c) , (d) and (e), the Lt. Governor shall introduce legislation from the Northeast Assembly proposed legislation thread on the Northeast Assembly floor in chronological order, starting with the earliest piece of proposed legislation, except that the Lt. Governor shall not introduce more than two (2) pieces of legislation from the same Representative, initial sponsoring citizen, or the Governor before introducing legislation from other Representatives or the Governor that has been proposed before the date such third piece of proposed legislation would have otherwise been brought to the Northeast Assembly floor.
(b) Except as provided in subsection (e), only one piece of legislation shall be placed on the Northeast Assembly floor at a time.
(c)  Any Representative may make a motion to suspend section 2(a) of this Standing Order to move a piece proposed legislation to the top of the queue.  The motion shall be immediately put to a vote on the Northeast Assembly floor.  Such vote shall be open for 24 hours.  If the motion passes by a vote of the majority of all Representatives (with abstentions and absences counted as nay votes), the Lt. Governor shall move such piece of proposed legislation to the Northeast Assembly floor immediately after any legislation then currently on the Northeast Assembly floor is voted upon or tabled.
(d) Except as provided in subsection (a), the Lt. Governor shall place legislation successfully proposed by citizens on the Northeast Assembly floor immediately after any current legislation then on the Northeast Assembly floor is finally voted upon or tabled.
(e) The Lt. Governor shall place any legislation that is vetoed by the Governor on the Northeast Assembly floor immediately after such veto.  Veto override votes may occur while other legislation is on the Northeast Assembly floor.


3. Legislative Debates and Voting
(a) Except as otherwise provided in subsection (h), all proposed legislation other than veto override votes shall be open for debate until seventy-two (72) hours after the Lt. Governor introduces it to the Northeast Assembly floor.
(b) During debate, Representatives may suggest amendments to proposed legislation.  If the sponsor of the proposed legislation publicly deems the amendment friendly, no vote on the amendment shall be required.  If the sponsor of the proposed legislation does not publicly deem the amendment friendly, a vote on the amendment shall be taken at the end of the debate period.
(c) The sponsor of a proposed amendment may remove it from the Assembly floor by tabling it at any time before the end of the debate period.
(d) A vote will be held on all proposed amendments not deemed friendly at the end of the debate period.  Such vote shall be open for twenty-four (24) hours.  An amendment shall pass  if a majority of Representatives vote in favor of it (with abstentions and absences not counted as votes).
(e)  The sponsor of a piece of proposed legislation may remove it from the Assembly floor by tabling it at any time before a final vote is taken on the proposed legislation.
(f) A final vote on the proposed legislation shall take place immediately after the Lt. Governor certifies the vote on any proposed amendments (or, if there are no such amendments, at the end of the debate period).  A final vote on veto overrides shall take place immediately after the Lt. Governor places it on the Northeast Assembly floor.  Such votes shall be open for twenty-four (24) hours.  A piece of proposed legislation or veto override shall pass if a majority of Representatives vote in favor of it (with abstentions and absences not counted as votes).
(g) The Lt. Governor shall certify the results of any vote within twenty-four (24) hours of the end of the voting period.
(h) Any Representative may make a motion to suspend sections 3(a), 3(d) or 3(f) of this Standing Order to increase or decrease the time of the debate or voting period.  The motion shall be immediately put to a vote on the Northeast Assembly floor.  Such vote shall be open for twenty-four (24) hours.  If the motion passes by a vote of the majority of all Representatives (with abstentions and absences counted as nay votes), the relevant period shall be changed.

4. Terminology
(a) All legislation regarding the rules of the Northeast Assembly shall be called Standing Orders.
(b) All proposed legislation that requires the signature of the Governor shall be called a Bill until signed and thereafter an Act.
(c) The Lt. Governor shall maintain a public list of Standing Orders, unsuccessful bills actually voted upon, and Acts in the Atlasia Wiki for the Northeast, with a link to the text of such legislation.
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cinyc
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« Reply #12 on: September 30, 2009, 03:01:43 pm »

Why should the Lieutenant Governor be the only one to officially introduce pieces of legislation ? This should be done by any representative whenever he wants.

Under Section 15 of the Constitutional Amendment creating this Assembly, the Lt. Governor runs the Assembly floor.  Therefore, he should move legislation from the proposed legislation thread to the Assembly floor.   

That's all I meant by introduces, though it might not be the right term.  The person who initially sponsors a bill in the proposed legislation thread would have all say on amendments and the like, not the Lt. Governor.
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cinyc
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« Reply #13 on: September 30, 2009, 03:15:12 pm »
« Edited: September 30, 2009, 03:22:16 pm by cinyc »

Why should the Lieutenant Governor be the only one to officially introduce pieces of legislation ? This should be done by any representative whenever he wants.

Under Section 15 of the Constitutional Amendment creating this Assembly, the Lt. Governor runs the Assembly floor.  Therefore, he should move legislation from the proposed legislation thread to the Assembly floor.   

That's all I meant by introduces, though it might not be the right term.  The person who initially sponsors a bill in the proposed legislation thread would have all say on amendments and the like, not the Lt. Governor.

Well, I think I know this Amendment, since I wrote most of it. Wink
What I meant is just that LG certifies the vote results, just as did the CJO previously. I understand you point, but you should replace the verb "introduce" by something different, to make clear that Lt Gov hasn't any "right of veto" on this (I obviously don't fear anything from Barnes Smiley but yu never know).

Is "move" better than "introduce" or is there some other verb you have in mind?  I can't think of another one.  Maybe "place"?
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cinyc
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« Reply #14 on: September 30, 2009, 10:57:24 pm »

Cinyc - exceptionally well done on these Standing Orders! Sensational work!

How about "invites the sponsor to move or moves if the sponsor is a concerned citizen or the Governor" rather than "introduces"? That leaves the Lt Gov in charge of ordering the introduction of Bills to the House, but leaves him/her bound by the SOAP - preventing them from potentially vetoing a Bill by refusing to introduce it?

What happens if a sponsor is absent and doesn't move it ASAP?  Should we have a time limit before the Lt. Gov moves on to the next bill?  Or should we just let the Lt. Gov place it on the floor?
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cinyc
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« Reply #15 on: October 01, 2009, 01:09:41 am »
« Edited: October 01, 2009, 01:13:34 am by cinyc »

Cinyc - exceptionally well done on these Standing Orders! Sensational work!

How about "invites the sponsor to move or moves if the sponsor is a concerned citizen or the Governor" rather than "introduces"? That leaves the Lt Gov in charge of ordering the introduction of Bills to the House, but leaves him/her bound by the SOAP - preventing them from potentially vetoing a Bill by refusing to introduce it?

We could just write that someone who introduces a bill shall do it in both the threads immediately. Could it work ? Wink

I don't think we should have tons of legislation on the floor at the same time, which may happen if we let Representatives just propose legislation in both threads.  Having more than one bill open for discussion would clutter up the Assembly thread and make things confusing.    Unlike the Atlasian Senate, we have only one Assembly thread to conduct all floor business.   The nature of the Atlas Fantasy Elections sub-board doesn't lend itself to a regional legislature having more than one or two threads - things would get lost to the second or third page of the sub-board if Representatives don't comment on it for a day or so.

I'd prefer that the President of the Senate (i.e. the Lt. Governor unless designated to the Speaker) move items from the proposed legislation thread on the Assembly floor whenever a bill is passed or tabled.  This is similar to what the President Pro Tempore does in the Senate - which seems to work fine there.  We can make sure the Lt. Governor has no discretion over which items to place on the floor by using a proper phrasing like "place on the Northeast Assembly floor" or "place on the Northeast Assembly floor on behalf (and stating the name) of the sponsor", and specifying the order in which items must be placed on the floor (which Section 2 of my proposed bill already does).  Or perhaps by just adding a sentence stating that the Lt. Governor has no power to change the order in which items are placed on the floor.
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cinyc
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« Reply #16 on: October 01, 2009, 01:22:00 am »

Why have a second thread? If legislation is proposed the Speaker of President can place it on a queue with links that can be reposted intermittently with the pending order of business. That way things are kept orderly, but you don't clog the entire board. Between the Mideast and Northeast legislatures, along with member offices, you are looking at 11 threads! No reason to add another.

The reason for a separate proposed legislation thread is so that everyone knows where to find all proposed NE legislation and can easily figure out what should be up next should the Lt. Governor/Speaker try to play games with the agenda.  Links are only as good as the person who maintains them, and proposing legislation in the NE Assembly floor thread would clutter this thread and could lead to confusion as to which bill is actually being debated at any given time.

We're not asking for much.
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cinyc
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« Reply #17 on: October 01, 2009, 12:42:09 pm »
« Edited: October 01, 2009, 12:50:48 pm by cinyc »

Third Draft (new language from the first draft in red)

Standing Order on Assembly Procedure

1. Proposed Legislation Thread
(a) The Lt. Governor shall open a new Northeast Assembly proposed legislation thread at the start of each Northeast Assembly term.
(b) Representatives, the Governor and any concerned Northeast citizen shall post the full text of any proposed legislation in a response to the Northeast Assembly proposed legislation thread for the current term.  Each response shall contain only one piece of proposed legislation. 
(c) Nothing shall be posted to the Northeast Assembly proposed legislation thread except proposed legislation or a Northeast citizen's signature for proposed citizen legislation.

2. Movement of Legislation to the Northeast Assembly Floor
(a) Except as provided in subsections (c) , (d), (e) and (f), the Lt. Governor shall place legislation from the Northeast Assembly proposed legislation thread on the Northeast Assembly floor (on behalf and stating the name of the sponsor) in chronological order, starting with the earliest piece of proposed legislation, except that the Lt. Governor shall not place more than two (2) pieces of legislation from the same Representative, initial sponsoring citizen, or the Governor before placing legislation from other Representatives or the Governor that has been proposed before the date such third piece of proposed legislation would have otherwise been brought to the Northeast Assembly floor.
(b) Except as provided in subsection (e) and (f), only one piece of legislation shall be placed on the Northeast Assembly floor at a time.
(c)  Any Representative may make a motion to suspend section 2(a) of this Standing Order to move a piece proposed legislation to the top of the queue.  The motion shall be immediately put to a vote on the Northeast Assembly floor.  Such vote shall be open for 24 hours.  If the motion passes by a vote of the majority of all Representatives (with abstentions and absences counted as nay votes), the Lt. Governor shall place such piece of proposed legislation on the Northeast Assembly floor immediately after any legislation then currently on the Northeast Assembly floor is voted upon or tabled.
(d) Any Representative may make a motion to suspend section 2(b) of this Standing Order to place more than one piece of legislation on the Northeast Assembly floor at any given time.  The motion shall be immediately put to a vote on the Northeast Assembly floor.  Such vote shall be open for 24 hours.  If the motion passes by a vote of the majority of all Representatives (with abstentions and absences counted as nay votes), the Lt. Governor shall place such additional pieces of proposed legislation on the Northeast Assembly floor immediately at the end of the voting period.
(e) Except as provided in subsection (a), the Lt. Governor shall place legislation successfully proposed by citizens on the Northeast Assembly floor immediately after any current legislation then on the Northeast Assembly floor is finally voted upon or tabled.
(f) The Lt. Governor shall place any legislation that is vetoed by the Governor on the Northeast Assembly floor immediately after such veto.  Veto override votes may occur while other legislation is on the Northeast Assembly floor.
(g) Nothing in this Section 2 shall allow the Lt. Governor to do anything but place proposed legislation on the Northeast Assembly floor on behalf of the sponsor of such legislation.


3. Legislative Debates and Voting
(a) Except as otherwise provided in subsection (h), all proposed legislation other than veto override votes shall be open for debate until seventy-two (72) hours after the Lt. Governor places it on the Northeast Assembly floor.
(b) During debate, Representatives may suggest amendments to proposed legislation.  If the sponsor of the proposed legislation publicly deems the amendment friendly, no vote on the amendment shall be required.  If the sponsor of the proposed legislation does not publicly deem the amendment friendly, a vote on the amendment shall be taken at the end of the debate period.
(c) The sponsor of a proposed amendment may remove it from the Assembly floor by tabling it at any time before the end of the debate period.
(d) A vote will be held on all proposed amendments not deemed friendly at the end of the debate period.  Such vote shall be open for twenty-four (24) hours.  An amendment shall pass  if a majority of Representatives vote in favor of it (with abstentions and absences not counted as votes).
(e)  The sponsor of a piece of proposed legislation may remove it from the Assembly floor by tabling it at any time before a final vote is taken on the proposed legislation.
(f) A final vote on the proposed legislation shall take place immediately after the Lt. Governor certifies the vote on any proposed amendments (or, if there are no such amendments, at the end of the debate period).  A final vote on veto overrides shall take place immediately after the Lt. Governor places it on the Northeast Assembly floor.  Such votes shall be open for twenty-four (24) hours.  A piece of proposed legislation or veto override shall pass if a majority of Representatives vote in favor of it (with abstentions and absences not counted as votes).
(g) The Lt. Governor shall certify the results of any vote within twenty-four (24) hours of the end of the voting period.
(h) Any Representative may make a motion to suspend sections 3(a), 3(d) or 3(f) of this Standing Order to increase or decrease the time of the debate or voting period.  The motion shall be immediately put to a vote on the Northeast Assembly floor.  Such vote shall be open for twenty-four (24) hours.  If the motion passes by a vote of the majority of all Representatives (with abstentions and absences counted as nay votes), the relevant period shall be changed.

4. Terminology
(a) All legislation regarding the rules of the Northeast Assembly shall be called Standing Orders.
(b) All proposed legislation that requires the signature of the Governor shall be called a Bill until signed and thereafter an Act.
(c) The Lt. Governor shall maintain a public list of Standing Orders, unsuccessful bills actually voted upon, and Acts in the Atlasia Wiki for the Northeast, with a link to the text of such legislation.
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cinyc
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« Reply #18 on: October 01, 2009, 12:47:16 pm »

I think my Third Draft of the SOAP is complete enough to be put to a vote should the Speaker deem it possible at this time.

The two main changes from the second draft were to change "introduce" to "place" and add a section allowing Representatives to make a motion to place more than one piece of proposed legislation on the Senate floor at any given time.  I've also added a subsection making it clear that the only power the Lt. Governor has is to place items on the floor.
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cinyc
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« Reply #19 on: October 01, 2009, 02:09:20 pm »

Aye
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cinyc
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« Reply #20 on: October 02, 2009, 12:03:20 pm »

I can't support this bill without a right for parents with religious objections to opt out of all or a portion of this class.  Not every family with strong religious convictions can afford to send their children to private schools.  They should not be punished by having their children forced to sit through classes that teach methods of birth control other than abstinence.

As an aside, Rep. Smid is Mr. President right now.  He could open up the proposed legislation thread if he wishes, since the Lt. Governor has temporarily devolved his power to him.
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cinyc
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« Reply #21 on: October 02, 2009, 03:07:13 pm »

With five ayes, zero nays, and one no vote, I hereby certify that the Standing Order on Assembly Procedure has passed.

Sorry about begin gone, but I will also be gone most of Saturday (taking a trip to Warm Springs), but after that I should be around. Smiley

Can you please open the Northeast Assembly Proposed Legislation thread? 

Thanks.
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cinyc
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« Reply #22 on: October 02, 2009, 04:00:54 pm »

I can't support this bill without a right for parents with religious objections to opt out of all or a portion of this class.  Not every family with strong religious convictions can afford to send their children to private schools.  They should not be punished by having their children forced to sit through classes that teach methods of birth control other than abstinence.

Anyone has the right to keep their opinion and beliefs, but anyone should be given the information to make their choice. Parents haven't the right to keep their children in ignocance for religious reasons.

Agreed. We exempted private schools but there is no reason people with strong religious convictions should be objecting to this. I mean, they obviously created the kid in the first place so they're having sex. Their kids also need to know how to approach sex safely and intelligently.

Christian teaching on birth control and sex outside of marriage differs from what you'd propose students be required to be lectured about in school.  Parents should have the ultimate authority on their childrens' moral education, not the state.  Therefore, I simply can't support this bill.
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cinyc
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« Reply #23 on: October 02, 2009, 04:48:06 pm »

I move to amend the bill as follows (even though it will be viewed as unfriendly and be put to a vote):

Freedom of Conscience Amendment

Section B(1) shall be amended as follows:
1.  Except as provided in subsection B(6), completion of at least one semester of sexual health is required for all high school students in order to graduate.

A new Section B(6) shall be added:
6.  Before the beginning of the relevant semester, every school shall send a permission slip to parents or guardians of children who would otherwise be enrolled in sexual health class.  A parent or guardian shall be entitled to remove their child from all or any portion of a sexual health class, specifically including any portion of that class teaching methods of contraception, masturbation or homosexuality.   No school shall take any action against a student whose parent opts out of enrolling their child in all or any portion of a sexual health class, nor shall that student's grade, grade-point average, or ability to graduate be affected.
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cinyc
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« Reply #24 on: October 02, 2009, 05:18:08 pm »

I move to amend the bill as follows (even though it will be viewed as unfriendly and be put to a vote):

Freedom of Conscience Amendment

Section B(1) shall be amended as follows:
1.  Except as provided in subsection B(6), completion of at least one semester of sexual health is required for all high school students in order to graduate.

A new Section B(6) shall be added:
6.  Before the beginning of the relevant semester, every school shall send a permission slip to parents or guardians of children who would otherwise be enrolled in sexual health class.  A parent or guardian shall be entitled to remove their child from all or any portion of a sexual health class, specifically including any portion of that class teaching methods of contraception, masturbation or homosexuality.   No school shall take any action against a student whose parent opts out of enrolling their child in all or any portion of a sexual health class, nor shall that student's grade, grade-point average, or ability to graduate be affected.

I know that this amendment will not have enough support to pass but go ahead and vote.
Under the SOAP (which this bill may or may not be subject to), we vote on all unfriendly amendments at the end of the 72-hour debate period.

Am I correct that this and the homosexuality amendment are the two unfriendly ones and everything else proposed so far was accepted?

On the merits my amendment - I don't think the law is constitutional without it.  I believe it violates the Atlasian and Northeast Constitution's prohibitions on enacting laws prohibiting the free exercise of religion in its current form.
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