Colorado Springs: A Teabagger Paradise

[Хahar 🤔]

Oh, I'm sure if it's that bad in Colorado Springs they can all move to some liberal utopia like Detroit.

[dead0man]

Oh, I'm sure if it's that bad in Colorado Springs they can all move to some liberal utopia like Detroit.

See buddy, the OP started out with this.

Colorado Springs, the state's second largest city and famously a haven of conservatism, anti-tax sentiment and the other hallmarks of the "Tea Party" movement is completely out of money. Finally, the good citizens of Colorado Springs will no longer have to endure the hardship and armed robbery that is taxation and basic government services:

Our friend Guderian here decided to think of some places that are "havens of the opposite of conservatism, pro-tax sentiment and other hallmarks of whatever the hell Lief's politics are", many/most of which are and have been sh**t holes for several generations.  He then thought it would be funny to mention one in an ironic way in the thread.  Made me snicker.

[Lief 🗽]

The problem, of course, is that many of the problems Detroit faces were caused by the sort of pro-free trade, anti-worker policies that most liberals oppose.

[JSojourner]

The problem, of course, is that many of the problems Detroit faces were caused by the sort of pro-free trade, anti-worker policies that most liberals oppose.

Exact-a-mundo!

[dead0man]

Yeah, if it wasn't for free trade (like a 25% tariff on imported Japanese pickup trucks) and Reagan, Detroit would be a leftwing utopia today.


edit-not just Japanese, all imported pickup trucks

[Filuwaúrdjan]

Probably better to see Detriot as an extreme example of the damage done to American cities by various structural changes that the city government had no control over. Not that having Coleman Young as Mayor for so long helped matters much...

[Torie]

Probably better to see Detriot as an extreme example of the damage done to American cities by various structural changes that the city government had no control over. Not that having Coleman Young as Mayor for so long helped matters much...

It is kind of tough to run a city where the underclass is five times as large as the middle class, isn't it?

[Franzl]

The problem, of course, is that many of the problems Detroit faces were caused by the sort of pro-free trade, anti-worker policies that most liberals oppose.

Anti-worker policies? You mean like the $35/hour wages that are ensured by the UAW?

[opebo]

The problem, of course, is that many of the problems Detroit faces were caused by the sort of pro-free trade, anti-worker policies that most liberals oppose.

Anti-worker policies? You mean like the $35/hour wages that are ensured by the UAW?

Ensured? How can they ensure that when the government just moves the jobs to slave countries?

[dead0man]

So we're done here then?  That was easier than I expected.

[jokerman]

(like a 25% tariff on imported Japanese pickup trucks)

*yawn*

[All Along The Watchtower]

Not surprised. Colorado Springs is extremely conservative, so it makes sense that Tea Party activists thrive there.

[dead0man]

(like a 25% tariff on imported Japanese pickup trucks)

*yawn*

I have no idea what point you're trying to make is.

Somebody said "free trade" was one of the important reasons Detroit was a sh**t hole.  I mentioned that there was a 25% import tariff on half of Detroit's bread and butter.  That ain't "free trade".

[opebo]

Somebody said "free trade" was one of the important reasons Detroit was a sh**t hole.  I mentioned that there was a 25% import tariff on half of Detroit's bread and butter.  That ain't "free trade".

Your observation is accurate, but it should be noted that 25% is insignificant, was not consistently applied, and the issue is not any kind of absolutely 'free' trade, but just that the gutting of Detroit was based on moving toils elsewhere.  Whether this was done with no tariff or a 25% tariff it was done, and the result is greatly increased wealth for the elite and dire suffering for those who did the work.

[Guderian]

The problem, of course, is that many of the problems Detroit faces were caused by the sort of pro-free trade, anti-worker policies that most liberals oppose.

Anti-worker policies? You mean like the $35/hour wages that are ensured by the UAW?

Ensured? How can they ensure that when the government just moves the jobs to slave countries?

You mean slave countries like Georgia, Alabama and such? Because there's still auto industry in United States that hasn't been completely destroyed by the unions, in a most perfect example of the often used metaphor about lunatics running the asylum.

[Franzl]

Just another strange thought....if American automakers made high quality cars that people actually want to buy (Ford is becoming an exception, because they actually do)....maybe, just maybe.....things would be looking better for them.

[k-onmmunist]

Why do the Democrats hate free trade so much? It's inane, especially when nearly all modern economicists agree it is good.

[Franzl]

Why do the Democrats hate free trade so much? It's inane, especially when nearly all modern economicists agree it is good.

Of course it's a good thing, but real competition is the last thing the labor unions want.

[k-onmmunist]

Why do the Democrats hate free trade so much? It's inane, especially when nearly all modern economicists agree it is good.

Of course it's a good thing, but real competition is the last thing the labor unions want.

Hmm, I see your point. It's quite sad that they can't see how free trade would benefit them and everyone though.

[k-onmmunist]

This thread is like one massive circle jerk.

Except everyone is already dry.

Stop trolling.

Ain't trolling if it's true.

[Franzl]

Why do the Democrats hate free trade so much? It's inane, especially when nearly all modern economicists agree it is good.

Of course it's a good thing, but real competition is the last thing the labor unions want.

Hmm, I see your point. It's quite sad that they can't see how free trade would benefit them and everyone though.

That's actually something that bothers me about Giannoulias in Illinois, he seems to be going into attack mode on companies that hire people abroad.

I hope Democrats don't start advocating protectionism as an election strategy this year.

[k-onmmunist]

Why do the Democrats hate free trade so much? It's inane, especially when nearly all modern economicists agree it is good.

Of course it's a good thing, but real competition is the last thing the labor unions want.

Hmm, I see your point. It's quite sad that they can't see how free trade would benefit them and everyone though.

That's actually something that bothers me about Giannoulias in Illinois, he seems to be going into attack mode on companies that hire people abroad.

I hope Democrats don't start advocating protectionism as an election strategy this year.

The whole protectionist thing is nearly as stupid as the right-wing hatred of immigration - trade is the world's biggest business and if you cut into it, you inadvertently cut into yourself.

[Filuwaúrdjan]

Detroit (as in the area inside its formal municipal boundaries) would be a shithole even if the car manufacturing industry had been doing wonderfully over the past few decades. It is, I repeat, just an extreme example of the sort of thing that happened to most large American cities in the latter half of the twentieth century.

[k-onmmunist]

Detroit (as in the area inside its formal municipal boundaries) would be a shithole even if the car manufacturing industry had been doing wonderfully over the past few decades. It is, I repeat, just an extreme example of the sort of thing that happened to most large American cities in the latter half of the twentieth century.

To be fair, large areas of Britain have become like Detroit Lite; Coventry, where I was born, for example, has been shrinking for some time, and all the industry is gone. Such is the global division of labour.

[opebo]

The problem, of course, is that many of the problems Detroit faces were caused by the sort of pro-free trade, anti-worker policies that most liberals oppose.

Anti-worker policies? You mean like the $35/hour wages that are ensured by the UAW?

Ensured? How can they ensure that when the government just moves the jobs to slave countries?

You mean slave countries like Georgia, Alabama and such? Because there's still auto industry in United States that hasn't been completely destroyed by the unions, in a most perfect example of the often used metaphor about lunatics running the asylum.

Precisely - workers in the american south are relatively slave-like (disempowered) compared to northern workers.

The point worth noting here is that unions cannot alone increase wages if governments are lowering wages (moving work to places where workers are more enslaved).  Only the State can ultimately set wages at tolerable levels.