Barack the neocon
       |           

Welcome, Guest. Please login or register.
Did you miss your activation email?
March 28, 2024, 12:08:22 PM
News: Election Simulator 2.0 Released. Senate/Gubernatorial maps, proportional electoral votes, and more - Read more

  Talk Elections
  General Politics
  U.S. General Discussion (Moderators: The Dowager Mod, Chancellor Tanterterg)
  Barack the neocon
« previous next »
Pages: [1]
Author Topic: Barack the neocon  (Read 2551 times)
Torie
Moderators
Atlas Legend
*****
Posts: 46,057
Ukraine


Political Matrix
E: -3.48, S: -4.70

Show only this user's posts in this thread
« on: September 06, 2010, 10:32:04 AM »

In my opinion, the term "neocon" has lost its usefulness, and should be retired to the ash heap of history. The thought occurred to me when reading this rather pedestrian and un-arresting article, that takes a few Obama phrases about lofty American intentions, and assumes that it really has some meaning as to specific policies that the neocon's embraced in international affairs back when. I don't think so. Just because you are not isolationist, does not make you a neocon. Beyond that, each foreign policy issue is unique, and yes, yet another instance where grand unified theories are just not very helpful.

What do you think?
Logged
Vepres
Junior Chimp
*****
Posts: 8,032
United States
Show only this user's posts in this thread
« Reply #1 on: September 06, 2010, 01:03:28 PM »

The term has been morphed to mean "somebody whose foreign policy views are more hawkish than mine". It really doesn't have much real meaning anymore, having merely becoming a pejorative.
Logged
Beet
Atlas Star
*****
Posts: 28,803


Show only this user's posts in this thread
« Reply #2 on: September 06, 2010, 03:50:54 PM »

Obama was a student of Leo Strauss?
Logged
Torie
Moderators
Atlas Legend
*****
Posts: 46,057
Ukraine


Political Matrix
E: -3.48, S: -4.70

Show only this user's posts in this thread
« Reply #3 on: September 06, 2010, 04:17:43 PM »

Obama was a student of Leo Strauss?

Leo was dead, so I doubt it, unless it was in a seance mode. Cropsy, his acolyte maybe, whom I had as a professor.
Logged
Obnoxiously Slutty Girly Girl
Libertas
Atlas Icon
*****
Posts: 14,899
Finland


Show only this user's posts in this thread
« Reply #4 on: September 07, 2010, 06:30:29 PM »


Barack Obama has been a neocon since at least the time he began running for president, probably going back to 2004.

Most of the people who want to "retire" the term "neocon" are themselves neocons-in-denial.
Logged
Kaine for Senate '18
benconstine
Atlas Superstar
*****
Posts: 30,329
United States


Show only this user's posts in this thread
« Reply #5 on: September 07, 2010, 06:37:17 PM »

The term has been morphed to mean "somebody whose foreign policy views are more hawkish than mine". It really doesn't have much real meaning anymore, having merely becoming a pejorative.

Exactly.  It's pathetic; the term used to actually mean something, representing a good, legitimate ideology.  Now it's just describing someone liberals/wackjob libertarians don't like.
Logged
SvenssonRS
YaBB God
*****
Posts: 3,519
United States


Political Matrix
E: 8.39, S: -4.35

Show only this user's posts in this thread
« Reply #6 on: September 07, 2010, 06:41:51 PM »

Most of the people who want to "retire" the term "neocon" are themselves neocons-in-denial.

Untrue. Personally, I think it's lost all significant meaning in use, since literally everyone throws it around to describe people they don't like. It's not even a viable way to describe those with insane foreign policy views any more.
Logged
Obnoxiously Slutty Girly Girl
Libertas
Atlas Icon
*****
Posts: 14,899
Finland


Show only this user's posts in this thread
« Reply #7 on: September 07, 2010, 06:44:35 PM »

The term has been morphed to mean "somebody whose foreign policy views are more hawkish than mine". It really doesn't have much real meaning anymore, having merely becoming a pejorative.

Exactly.  It's pathetic; the term used to actually mean something, representing a good, legitimate ideology.  Now it's just describing someone liberals/wackjob libertarians don't like.

LOL

Oh, and another example of what I described earlier.
Logged
SvenssonRS
YaBB God
*****
Posts: 3,519
United States


Political Matrix
E: 8.39, S: -4.35

Show only this user's posts in this thread
« Reply #8 on: September 07, 2010, 06:45:40 PM »

The term has been morphed to mean "somebody whose foreign policy views are more hawkish than mine". It really doesn't have much real meaning anymore, having merely becoming a pejorative.

Exactly.  It's pathetic; the term used to actually mean something, representing a good, legitimate ideology.  Now it's just describing someone liberals/wackjob libertarians don't like.

LOL

Oh, and another example of what I described earlier.

Of course he'd call insane foreign policy a good idea. Ignore him.
Logged
Free Palestine
FallenMorgan
Junior Chimp
*****
Posts: 8,022
United States
Political Matrix
E: -10.00, S: -10.00

Show only this user's posts in this thread
« Reply #9 on: September 07, 2010, 06:48:12 PM »

The term has been morphed to mean "somebody whose foreign policy views are more hawkish than mine". It really doesn't have much real meaning anymore, having merely becoming a pejorative.

Exactly.  It's pathetic; the term used to actually mean something, representing a good, legitimate ideology.  Now it's just describing someone liberals/wackjob libertarians don't like.

Are you implying that the only people with a "legitimate ideology" support an interventionist foreign policy?  Because if so, you've reached the pinnacle of arrogant hackery right there.
Logged
Oswald Acted Alone, You Kook
The Obamanation
Junior Chimp
*****
Posts: 8,853
United States


Show only this user's posts in this thread
« Reply #10 on: September 07, 2010, 07:07:25 PM »

Most of the people who want to "retire" the term "neocon" are themselves neocons-in-denial.

Untrue. Personally, I think it's lost all significant meaning in use, since literally everyone throws it around to describe people they don't like. It's not even a viable way to describe those with insane foreign policy views any more.

Kind of like "fascist".
Logged
Obnoxiously Slutty Girly Girl
Libertas
Atlas Icon
*****
Posts: 14,899
Finland


Show only this user's posts in this thread
« Reply #11 on: September 07, 2010, 07:08:44 PM »

The term has been morphed to mean "somebody whose foreign policy views are more hawkish than mine". It really doesn't have much real meaning anymore, having merely becoming a pejorative.

Exactly.  It's pathetic; the term used to actually mean something, representing a good, legitimate ideology.  Now it's just describing someone liberals/wackjob libertarians don't like.

Are you implying that the only people with a "legitimate ideology" support an interventionist foreign policy?  Because if so, you've reached the pinnacle of arrogant hackery right there.

Of course, didn't you get Ben's memo? If you don't support nuking all those dirty Moslems, you are an isolationist appeaser who loves Hitler.
Logged
Kaine for Senate '18
benconstine
Atlas Superstar
*****
Posts: 30,329
United States


Show only this user's posts in this thread
« Reply #12 on: September 07, 2010, 08:35:24 PM »

Are you implying that the only people with a "legitimate ideology" support an interventionist foreign policy?  Because if so, you've reached the pinnacle of arrogant hackery right there.

Not at all.  I'm saying that neoconservativism is a legitimate ideology.
Logged
Free Palestine
FallenMorgan
Junior Chimp
*****
Posts: 8,022
United States
Political Matrix
E: -10.00, S: -10.00

Show only this user's posts in this thread
« Reply #13 on: September 07, 2010, 08:42:54 PM »

Are you implying that the only people with a "legitimate ideology" support an interventionist foreign policy?  Because if so, you've reached the pinnacle of arrogant hackery right there.

Not at all.  I'm saying that neoconservativism is a legitimate ideology.

Fair enough.
Logged
tpfkaw
wormyguy
Junior Chimp
*****
Posts: 9,118
United States


Political Matrix
E: -0.58, S: 1.65

Show only this user's posts in this thread
« Reply #14 on: September 07, 2010, 08:56:05 PM »

Are you implying that the only people with a "legitimate ideology" support an interventionist foreign policy?  Because if so, you've reached the pinnacle of arrogant hackery right there.

Not at all.  I'm saying that neoconservativism is a legitimate ideology.

I'm not exactly sure what an "illegitimate" ideology would entail.  Neoconism is an idiotic ideology.  An idiotic, legitimate, idiotic ideology.
Logged
Beet
Atlas Star
*****
Posts: 28,803


Show only this user's posts in this thread
« Reply #15 on: September 07, 2010, 09:02:57 PM »

The definition of a neoconservative is a Marxist who thought that the Great Society was too left-wing.

There, debated settled. Please refer back to this post for all future debates and queries regarding that term. Wink
Logged
Torie
Moderators
Atlas Legend
*****
Posts: 46,057
Ukraine


Political Matrix
E: -3.48, S: -4.70

Show only this user's posts in this thread
« Reply #16 on: September 07, 2010, 09:21:17 PM »

I seem to have opened a Pandora's Box here. Tongue
Logged
Free Palestine
FallenMorgan
Junior Chimp
*****
Posts: 8,022
United States
Political Matrix
E: -10.00, S: -10.00

Show only this user's posts in this thread
« Reply #17 on: September 07, 2010, 09:41:53 PM »

Are you implying that the only people with a "legitimate ideology" support an interventionist foreign policy?  Because if so, you've reached the pinnacle of arrogant hackery right there.

Not at all.  I'm saying that neoconservativism is a legitimate ideology.

I'm not exactly sure what an "illegitimate" ideology would entail.  Neoconism is an idiotic ideology.  An idiotic, legitimate, idiotic ideology.

Careful now.  Supporting a non-interventionist foreign policy is tantamount to worshiping Hitler.
Logged
tpfkaw
wormyguy
Junior Chimp
*****
Posts: 9,118
United States


Political Matrix
E: -0.58, S: 1.65

Show only this user's posts in this thread
« Reply #18 on: September 07, 2010, 10:11:22 PM »

Are you implying that the only people with a "legitimate ideology" support an interventionist foreign policy?  Because if so, you've reached the pinnacle of arrogant hackery right there.

Not at all.  I'm saying that neoconservativism is a legitimate ideology.

I'm not exactly sure what an "illegitimate" ideology would entail.  Neoconism is an idiotic ideology.  An idiotic, legitimate, idiotic ideology.

Careful now.  Supporting a non-interventionist foreign policy is tantamount to worshiping Hitler.

I wouldn't go that far.  You're probably just too embarrassed to admit you masturbate to pictures of Neville Chamberlain.



Sexylicious.
Logged
Pages: [1]  
« previous next »
Jump to:  


Login with username, password and session length

Terms of Service - DMCA Agent and Policy - Privacy Policy and Cookies

Powered by SMF 1.1.21 | SMF © 2015, Simple Machines

Page created in 0.043 seconds with 12 queries.