Minnesota

[angus]

republican is a dirty word in nyc?

It is not.  Former Mayor Ed Koch (a Democrat) also supports the re-election of the incumbent president.
http://www.thevillager.com/villager_22/whatshedoin.html

Maybe he really has a raging hard-on for GWB, or maybe he just can't stand the Dems (I certainly wouldn't hold that against him):
http://www.newsmax.com/archives/ic/2004/2/18/132439.shtml

The no spin zone version is also telling:
http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,109858,00.html

Care for a sample?

O'REILLY:  The Democrats are taking an internationalist tact.  You know that.  I mean Kerry and...

KOCH:  Isolationist.

O'REILLY:  I don't think it's isolationist so much.  They want a consensus before they act overseas.

KOCH:  Let me just say the people who are against Bush -- I mean they're running for president, these people, so they have to be critical, but I believe that the people who are against Bush and the major sector of the Democrats who favor Kerry and the others do it because they hate Bush.  It has...

O'REILLY:  No, they...

KOCH:  I mean it's like they hated Reagan.  I didn't vote for Reagan, and I didn't vote for Bush, but the lack of respect for the country, for the presidency -- it offends me.

O'REILLY:  It offends me, too.  The lack of respect for the Office of the Presidency...

KOCH:  Yes.

O'REILLY:  ... calling him a liar and all this other stuff.

KOCH:  I think it's an outrage.

[CTguy]

Give me a break...  since you are all about anecdotal evidence.  I challenge you to walk down any street in NYC and see how many anti-Bush posters, graffiti or flyers you find.  I could almost guarantee that there is no street in Manhattan that doesn't have some kind of anti-republican literature somewhere.  Not even Wall Street.  

If you think that because some former Mayor that was more popular on the people's court than he was as mayor's, opinion is relevant then you're dead wrong.  Like I said, Bush won't get 20% of the vote in New York City even though he will try to exploit 9-11 hard.  

What is Bush going to run on in NYC?  The fact that he hates gays and people who have abortions or the fact that NYC has a 10% unemployment rate?

[GOPhound]

Give me a break...  since you are all about anecdotal evidence.  I challenge you to walk down any street in NYC and see how many anti-Bush posters, graffiti or flyers you find.  I could almost guarantee that there is no street in Manhattan that doesn't have some kind of anti-republican literature somewhere.  Not even Wall Street.  

If you think that because some former Mayor that was more popular on the people's court than he was as mayor's, opinion is relevant then you're dead wrong.  Like I said, Bush won't get 20% of the vote in New York City even though he will try to exploit 9-11 hard.  

What is Bush going to run on in NYC?  The fact that he hates gays and people who have abortions or the fact that NYC has a 10% unemployment rate?

Now wait a minute here.  I've worked in NYC for a while now and see it differently.  First, how can you assert that Koch wasn't popular?  To be elected to 3 straight terms, someone had to like the guy.

Also, yes NYC is anti-Bush and anti-GOP, but no more so than any other big city I've been to.  I rarely see any anti-Bush posters or graffiti on the streets, I think you are exaggerating about that.  I see an occasional negative poster in the subways but that's about it.   By the way, not all of NYC is liberal.  Republicans still do well in Staten Island.

As for Bloomberg, he wasn't elected because of a backlash of Hispanic voters against Green.  These traditional Democratic voters just stayed home, they weren't out voting for Bloomberg in droves.  Bloomberg's campaign really took off when he started airing commercials in which Giuiliani endorsed him.  Without those ads Mark Green would be mayor today.

[MN-Troy]

Give me a break...  since you are all about anecdotal evidence.  I challenge you to walk down any street in NYC and see how many anti-Bush posters, graffiti or flyers you find.  I could almost guarantee that there is no street in Manhattan that doesn't have some kind of anti-republican literature somewhere.  Not even Wall Street.  

If you think that because some former Mayor that was more popular on the people's court than he was as mayor's, opinion is relevant then you're dead wrong.  Like I said, Bush won't get 20% of the vote in New York City even though he will try to exploit 9-11 hard.  

What is Bush going to run on in NYC?  The fact that he hates gays and people who have abortions or the fact that NYC has a 10% unemployment rate?

President Bush has probably conceded New York to the Democrats in 2004 because of his poor showing in upstate New York. Unless polls state otherwise, Bush will spend his money in a state that he more of a chance to pick up.

[Beefalow and the Consumer]

Without those ads Mark Green would be mayor today.

A good thing, too, since we need him as congressman .

http://www.house.gov/markgreen/

[angus]

Go Packers!  Do you expect Mark Green to be a serious US senate contender in '06?  This is exactly what we ought to be saying:  "My deepest sympathies and condolences go out to the Spanish people during this time of great tragedy.  As Americans, we know all too well the pain and sorrow that accompany these ruthless acts of terror, and we stand in solidarity with Spain as they seek those responsible."

No one is suggesting that the GOP should spend money trying to gain the 31 votes from New York.  I just consider Ed Koch one of my personal heroes lately and I wanted to share the good news.

[ilikeverin]

...down-to-earth, church-going Midwestern voter....

Oh dear.  We have a problem.

That was in the past.  Now, we have the Twin Cities of Minneapolis and Saint Paul... pretty much the deciders of the election.  It may come as a surprise, but we're actually cultured.

Kerry may not resound with church-goers here... but Bush doesn't either.  Most Minnesotans are Lutherans, IMO.  We're not as religious as Bush.  Religion isn't a factor.

[ElCidGOP]

CTguy seems to be full of hatred.  Even in the darkest days of the Clinton presidency, I never hated him.  Also, just because you are for a constitutional amendment banning gay marriage doesn't mean you hate gays.  I am for the amendment, but I don't hate gays, and I don't think GWB does either.  Same with women who have abortions.  

Give me a break...  since you are all about anecdotal evidence.  I challenge you to walk down any street in NYC and see how many anti-Bush posters, graffiti or flyers you find.  I could almost guarantee that there is no street in Manhattan that doesn't have some kind of anti-republican literature somewhere.  Not even Wall Street.  

If you think that because some former Mayor that was more popular on the people's court than he was as mayor's, opinion is relevant then you're dead wrong.  Like I said, Bush won't get 20% of the vote in New York City even though he will try to exploit 9-11 hard.  

What is Bush going to run on in NYC?  The fact that he hates gays and people who have abortions or the fact that NYC has a 10% unemployment rate?

[12th Doctor]

CTguy seems to be full of hatred.  

You noticed this, too.

[angus]

Look, I started that.  On behalf of only myself I do not think you're full of hatred; just letting off steam over all the bs thought-police emotional brutality of the new authoritarian Left.  Don't go away or invite me to.  Or others.  An who may follow my poor example of immediately attacking all Democrats.  This was a civil forum, as has been pointed out, but on stomping grounds such as Minnesota, people sometimes get nasty.  Expect more negativity as the months progress.

[12th Doctor]

Look, I started that.  On behalf of only myself I do not think you're full of hatred; just letting off steam over all the bs thought-police emotional brutality of the new authoritarian Left.  Don't go away or invite me to.  Or others.  An who may follow my poor example of immediately attacking all Democrats.  This was a civil forum, as has been pointed out, but on stomping grounds such as Minnesota, people sometimes get nasty.  Expect more negativity as the months progress.

I'll admit that I've gotten angry beyond what I should have over the past month, but I just get p*ssed off over all of the double standards.  For one thing, I hate it when the Dems accuse Bush of being negative because it is clear to any fair-minded person that the Dems have been going negative on Bush for the past three months.  When we try to fight fire with fire, they just jump on us and call us names.  That's the way it is when conservatives express there opinions on most issues and I get sick and tired of it.  

CTguy has almost raised it to a whole new level with his rants and when I try to fight back he (like his DNC counter-parts) accusses me of going negative.  I'm all for honest debate, but I don't see much of it going on at the moment.

Note:  there are some forum members on both sides who are commited ot fair-mindedness and that deserves to be pointed out.

[dazzleman]

Look, I started that.  On behalf of only myself I do not think you're full of hatred; just letting off steam over all the bs thought-police emotional brutality of the new authoritarian Left.  Don't go away or invite me to.  Or others.  An who may follow my poor example of immediately attacking all Democrats.  This was a civil forum, as has been pointed out, but on stomping grounds such as Minnesota, people sometimes get nasty.  Expect more negativity as the months progress.

I'll admit that I've gotten angry beyond what I should have over the past month, but I just get p*ssed off over all of the double standards.  For one thing, I hate it when the Dems accuse Bush of being negative because it is clear to any fair-minded person that the Dems have been going negative on Bush for the past three months.  When we try to fight fire with fire, they just jump on us and call us names.  That's the way it is when conservatives express there opinions on most issues and I get sick and tired of it.  

CTguy has almost raised it to a whole new level with his rants and when I try to fight back he (like his DNC counter-parts) accusses me of going negative.  I'm all for honest debate, but I don't see much of it going on at the moment.

Note:  there are some forum members on both sides who are commited ot fair-mindedness and that deserves to be pointed out.

When you're dealing with liberals, everything is a double standard.

I have found in real life, and seen here too, that some liberals are among the most mean-spirited, bigoted and intolerant people around.  And yet they think it's OK, because supposedly they do it all in the name of tolerance, kindness and condemnation of bigotry.

Northeastern liberals in particular tend to be very condescending, confident of their superiority over other people, and openly bigoted against southerners and people who have any type of religious faith.

Northeastern liberals are particularly noxious on the race issue.  Because of the traditionally town-based school districts in the northeast, as opposed to county-wide school districts down south, the northeast has the greatest degree of racial separation among students of any section of the country. [I don't use the word "segregation" because I don't want to add to politcally correct corruption of the language -- Segregation is racial separation imposed by the government, not individual choices.]  

The same is true for the towns and cities of the northeast, particularly the New York and Boston metropolitan areas.  There is a deeply entrenched separation of the races that could not be any greater if it were imposed by law.

And believe me, these liberals would be screaming bloody murder if anybody tried to merge these separate school districts in order to bring about greater integration.  There was an attempt by black groups to do this in Connecticut, and it got ZERO support.  Rich liberals would support it if involved integrating blacks with working class whites, but they would fight it tooth and nail if it involved them.

This is what happened in liberal Boston.  Federal courts ordered busing in the city, basically between poor blacks and poor whites.  Liberals in the suburbs supported it, while the whites in the city were incensed and reacted with violence.  New York City, another liberal bastion, never integrated its public schools because the fear of violence was so great that it scared off the integrationists.  To this day, NYC has a neighborhood based school system at the elementary level, and that is as it should be, in my opinion.  But it means that schools in certain sections are lily-white, while others are entirely black or latino.  And believe me, the NYC liberals mean to keep it that way if it involves their children.

So all the liberal pontificating about tolerance, and against bigotry, ring pretty hollow to me.

[Gustaf]

Look, I started that.  On behalf of only myself I do not think you're full of hatred; just letting off steam over all the bs thought-police emotional brutality of the new authoritarian Left.  Don't go away or invite me to.  Or others.  An who may follow my poor example of immediately attacking all Democrats.  This was a civil forum, as has been pointed out, but on stomping grounds such as Minnesota, people sometimes get nasty.  Expect more negativity as the months progress.

Angus, I just wanted to tell you that I forwarded your apologies to Michael, and he accepted them and also apoligized for his overreaction and asked me to forward that. Just so you know...

[I spent the winter writing songs about getting better]

CTguy seems to be full of hatred.  Even in the darkest days of the Clinton presidency, I never hated him.  Also, just because you are for a constitutional amendment banning gay marriage doesn't mean you hate gays.  I am for the amendment, but I don't hate gays, and I don't think GWB does either.  Same with women who have abortions.  

sorry, but if you support amending into the Constitution permanent second class status for gays, I don't see how can say you don't hate them. Besides, I doubt anyone who supports such an amendment would have many gay friends, simply because no gay would hang around them.In my opinion, anyone who supports the Hate Amendment is a homophobe, end of story. You sound like "I'm not racist, I just think races should remain seperate and interracial mixing is against nature, blah blah blah..."

aside from that, anyone who thinks Bush has a snowball's chance in hell of winning New York should lay off the drugs since whatever they're on is so strong they probably would be dead by the election

[angus]

Look, I started that.  On behalf of only myself I do not think you're full of hatred; just letting off steam over all the bs thought-police emotional brutality of the new authoritarian Left.  Don't go away or invite me to.  Or others.  An who may follow my poor example of immediately attacking all Democrats.  This was a civil forum, as has been pointed out, but on stomping grounds such as Minnesota, people sometimes get nasty.  Expect more negativity as the months progress.

Angus, I just wanted to tell you that I forwarded your apologies to Michael, and he accepted them and also apoligized for his overreaction and asked me to forward that. Just so you know...

Spread the love, man.  

[Gustaf]

Look, I started that.  On behalf of only myself I do not think you're full of hatred; just letting off steam over all the bs thought-police emotional brutality of the new authoritarian Left.  Don't go away or invite me to.  Or others.  An who may follow my poor example of immediately attacking all Democrats.  This was a civil forum, as has been pointed out, but on stomping grounds such as Minnesota, people sometimes get nasty.  Expect more negativity as the months progress.

Angus, I just wanted to tell you that I forwarded your apologies to Michael, and he accepted them and also apoligized for his overreaction and asked me to forward that. Just so you know...

Spread the love, man.  

Always, always...

[CTguy]

CTguy seems to be full of hatred.  Even in the darkest days of the Clinton presidency, I never hated him.  Also, just because you are for a constitutional amendment banning gay marriage doesn't mean you hate gays.  I am for the amendment, but I don't hate gays, and I don't think GWB does either.  Same with women who have abortions.  

sorry, but if you support amending into the Constitution permanent second class status for gays, I don't see how can say you don't hate them. Besides, I doubt anyone who supports such an amendment would have many gay friends, simply because no gay would hang around them.In my opinion, anyone who supports the Hate Amendment is a homophobe, end of story. You sound like "I'm not racist, I just think races should remain seperate and interracial mixing is against nature, blah blah blah..."

aside from that, anyone who thinks Bush has a snowball's chance in hell of winning New York should lay off the drugs since whatever they're on is so strong they probably would be dead by the election

Exactly, these conservatives are trying to pity themselves saying liberals are the true evil ones and blah blah blah...  but give me a break, they are the ones that support discrimination in the law.

These are the same people who 40 years ago would have been fighting tooth and nail to keep schools segregated...  yes in the SOUTH where it was politically correct to support segregation... yet they pretend like it's a northern phenomenon.

[12th Doctor]

Look, I started that.  On behalf of only myself I do not think you're full of hatred; just letting off steam over all the bs thought-police emotional brutality of the new authoritarian Left.  Don't go away or invite me to.  Or others.  An who may follow my poor example of immediately attacking all Democrats.  This was a civil forum, as has been pointed out, but on stomping grounds such as Minnesota, people sometimes get nasty.  Expect more negativity as the months progress.

I'll admit that I've gotten angry beyond what I should have over the past month, but I just get p*ssed off over all of the double standards.  For one thing, I hate it when the Dems accuse Bush of being negative because it is clear to any fair-minded person that the Dems have been going negative on Bush for the past three months.  When we try to fight fire with fire, they just jump on us and call us names.  That's the way it is when conservatives express there opinions on most issues and I get sick and tired of it.  

CTguy has almost raised it to a whole new level with his rants and when I try to fight back he (like his DNC counter-parts) accusses me of going negative.  I'm all for honest debate, but I don't see much of it going on at the moment.

Note:  there are some forum members on both sides who are commited ot fair-mindedness and that deserves to be pointed out.

When you're dealing with liberals, everything is a double standard.

I have found in real life, and seen here too, that some liberals are among the most mean-spirited, bigoted and intolerant people around.  And yet they think it's OK, because supposedly they do it all in the name of tolerance, kindness and condemnation of bigotry.

Northeastern liberals in particular tend to be very condescending, confident of their superiority over other people, and openly bigoted against southerners and people who have any type of religious faith.

Northeastern liberals are particularly noxious on the race issue.  Because of the traditionally town-based school districts in the northeast, as opposed to county-wide school districts down south, the northeast has the greatest degree of racial separation among students of any section of the country. [I don't use the word "segregation" because I don't want to add to politcally correct corruption of the language -- Segregation is racial separation imposed by the government, not individual choices.]  

The same is true for the towns and cities of the northeast, particularly the New York and Boston metropolitan areas.  There is a deeply entrenched separation of the races that could not be any greater if it were imposed by law.

And believe me, these liberals would be screaming bloody murder if anybody tried to merge these separate school districts in order to bring about greater integration.  There was an attempt by black groups to do this in Connecticut, and it got ZERO support.  Rich liberals would support it if involved integrating blacks with working class whites, but they would fight it tooth and nail if it involved them.

This is what happened in liberal Boston.  Federal courts ordered busing in the city, basically between poor blacks and poor whites.  Liberals in the suburbs supported it, while the whites in the city were incensed and reacted with violence.  New York City, another liberal bastion, never integrated its public schools because the fear of violence was so great that it scared off the integrationists.  To this day, NYC has a neighborhood based school system at the elementary level, and that is as it should be, in my opinion.  But it means that schools in certain sections are lily-white, while others are entirely black or latino.  And believe me, the NYC liberals mean to keep it that way if it involves their children.

So all the liberal pontificating about tolerance, and against bigotry, ring pretty hollow to me.

Mega Dittos on that.  

[12th Doctor]

CTguy seems to be full of hatred.  Even in the darkest days of the Clinton presidency, I never hated him.  Also, just because you are for a constitutional amendment banning gay marriage doesn't mean you hate gays.  I am for the amendment, but I don't hate gays, and I don't think GWB does either.  Same with women who have abortions.  

sorry, but if you support amending into the Constitution permanent second class status for gays, I don't see how can say you don't hate them. Besides, I doubt anyone who supports such an amendment would have many gay friends, simply because no gay would hang around them.In my opinion, anyone who supports the Hate Amendment is a homophobe, end of story. You sound like "I'm not racist, I just think races should remain seperate and interracial mixing is against nature, blah blah blah..."

aside from that, anyone who thinks Bush has a snowball's chance in hell of winning New York should lay off the drugs since whatever they're on is so strong they probably would be dead by the election

Exactly, these conservatives are trying to pity themselves saying liberals are the true evil ones and blah blah blah...  but give me a break, they are the ones that support discrimination in the law.

These are the same people who 40 years ago would have been fighting tooth and nail to keep schools segregated...  yes in the SOUTH where it was politically correct to support segregation... yet they pretend like it's a northern phenomenon.

Do you know anything about the modern south?  The modern south, especially places like Georgia, North Carolina and Virginia is probably one of the most tollerant places when it comes to race in the country.

Do oyu know where Klan membership is the largest?  It's not in the south.  It's in places like Pa, Mich, and New York.

whoe cares about 40 years ago, we were talking about 40 years ago, we were talking about today.

And by the way, your right, I'm such a rampid racist, that's why almost half my friends are non-caucasian.

[agcatter]

Speaking of 30 or 40 years ago, one of the ugliest spots in the nation with regard to desegregation of schools was good old liberal Boston, Mass.  However, please don't let your "facts" get in the way of your good story.

CT, you might want to review your history before you start mouthing off about the racist South.

[I spent the winter writing songs about getting better]

I'm against desegregation of schools for no reason other than desegregation. To explain, I don't think white kids on one side of the city should be forced to go to a school 30 minutes away in a black neighborhood just to desegregate that school, or vice-versa. They should simply go to whatever school is the closest. It's way too much of an inconvenience to the kids, it's simply not fair to force kids to get up 30 minutes earlier and make it a lot more difficult to participate in extra-curriculars because of something that's not their fault. quit screaming racism, the bottom line is that forced busing is not the answer.

[Filuwaúrdjan]

The SPLC like pointing out that there are more Cross Burnings in Pennsylvania than Alabama.

Virginia elected a black Governer in 1989, BTW

[Gustaf]

The SPLC like pointing out that there are more Cross Burnings in Pennsylvania than Alabama.

Virginia elected a black Governer in 1989, BTW

How many times more? Considering that PA has 3 times Alabama's population, I mean...and a larger percentage of whites