European Union Expansion by 2030 (user search)
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  European Union Expansion by 2030 (search mode)
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Poll
Question: Which of the following countries do you see joining the EU by the end of the next decade?
#1
Serbia
 
#2
Montenegro
 
#3
Macedonia
 
#4
Kosovo
 
#5
Albania
 
#6
Iceland
 
#7
Turkey
 
#8
Bosnia/Herzegovina
 
#9
NOTA
 
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Partisan results

Total Voters: 47

Calculate results by number of options selected
Author Topic: European Union Expansion by 2030  (Read 22278 times)
Gustaf
Moderators
Atlas Star
*****
Posts: 29,779


Political Matrix
E: 0.39, S: -0.70

« on: May 30, 2011, 03:53:21 AM »

Lol@norway and switzerland. Too good to be in "europe"

Not a case of being too good, but that it would be extremely stupid for either of them.  Norway would get screwed royally if its waters were part of the Common Fisheries Policy and its waters opened up to European trawlers.  Plus they'd have to use the same technicality that Sweden has used to avoid joining the Eurozone, that of not being a member of the ERM II for two years, as the Norwegian krone more than meets all of the other requirements that would force them to adopt the Euro.

Norway stays out for oil related reasons also, right? Further, the Swiss get to keep prying eyes away from their shady banks.
In other words, they're too good to be in "europe."

No, they're too smart to be in the EU. Nothing strange with that.

My prediction is Iceland unless they change their mind and don't want to and Croatia. Wouldn't Greece stop Macedonia?
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Gustaf
Moderators
Atlas Star
*****
Posts: 29,779


Political Matrix
E: 0.39, S: -0.70

« Reply #1 on: May 30, 2011, 05:28:59 PM »

Anyone who thinks Europe would be on the brink of war without the EU is really much too clueless to even be considered. Sorry. I can really only echo Franzl and Johan in this thread.
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Gustaf
Moderators
Atlas Star
*****
Posts: 29,779


Political Matrix
E: 0.39, S: -0.70

« Reply #2 on: May 31, 2011, 03:03:10 AM »

Anyone who thinks Europe would be on the brink of war without the EU is really much too clueless to even be considered. Sorry. I can really only echo Franzl and Johan in this thread.

Gustaf's 100% right on this...and I say that as someone that supports the EU anyway.  (Mainly out of my dislike of the nation-state itself)  Europe isn't going back to war.  (Note: this statement includes the Balkans, but I stand ready to redefine it to not include the Balkans)

The Balkans is a good example of why forcing countries into unions without popular support is not a good idea if you want peace.

After all, 95%+ of all wars in the world are civil wars. And most conflicts end when unions are broken up (Scandinavia, Balkans, Czechoslovakia, etc)
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Gustaf
Moderators
Atlas Star
*****
Posts: 29,779


Political Matrix
E: 0.39, S: -0.70

« Reply #3 on: May 31, 2011, 09:58:33 AM »

Anyone who thinks Europe would be on the brink of war without the EU is really much too clueless to even be considered. Sorry. I can really only echo Franzl and Johan in this thread.

Gustaf's 100% right on this...and I say that as someone that supports the EU anyway.  (Mainly out of my dislike of the nation-state itself)  Europe isn't going back to war.  (Note: this statement includes the Balkans, but I stand ready to redefine it to not include the Balkans)

The Balkans is a good example of why forcing countries into unions without popular support is not a good idea if you want peace.

After all, 95%+ of all wars in the world are civil wars. And most conflicts end when unions are broken up (Scandinavia, Balkans, Czechoslovakia, etc)

Are you now trying to predict that the EU will lead to a pan-european civil war? Tongue

Nope, I think the risk of war in Western Europe is very low either way. But if anything, the risk is greater with the EU, for two reasons:

1. It creates unnecessary conflicts over policy - look at the relation between Greece and Germany right now, for instance.

2. It undermines European democracy, and since democracy is the best insurance against war that is probably also negative from the perspective of peace.

Of course, the idea of European countries going to war today is pretty absurd. I do think Sweden is more likely to be dragged into some silly display of European power because of our EU membership.
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Gustaf
Moderators
Atlas Star
*****
Posts: 29,779


Political Matrix
E: 0.39, S: -0.70

« Reply #4 on: June 28, 2011, 09:51:05 AM »

I think Gustaf does not make difference between NATO and EU?


I think you missed the part where the EU is developing military capacity and wants to be a big international player. Tongue

I'm in favour of NATO membership though.
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