When arguments signify support for one's team...
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  When arguments signify support for one's team...
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Author Topic: When arguments signify support for one's team...  (Read 509 times)
Brittain33
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« on: January 10, 2011, 11:55:19 AM »
« edited: January 10, 2011, 11:56:53 AM by brittain33 »

This list identifies a certain style of arguing that is one of my main pet peeves about the Internet. I've boldfaced the ones which are most common in my experience...

http://www.overcomingbias.com/2010/09/opinion-warning-signs.html

You find it hard to be enthusiastic for something until you know that others oppose it.
You have little interest in getting clear on what exactly is the position being argued.
Realizing that a topic is important and neglected doesn’t make you much interested.
You have little interest in digging to bigger topics behind commonly argued topics.
You are less interested in a topic when you don’t foresee being able to talk about it.
You are uncomfortable taking a position near the middle of the opinion distribution.
You are uncomfortable taking a position of high uncertainty about who is right.
You care far more about current nearby events than similar distant or past/future events.
You find it easy to conclude that those who disagree with you are insincere or stupid.
You are reluctant to change your publicly stated positions in response to new info.
You are reluctant to agree a rival’s claim, even if you had no prior opinion on the topic.
You are reluctant to take a position that raises the status of rivals.

You care more about consistency between your beliefs than about belief accuracy.
You go easy on sloppy arguments by folks on “your side.”

You have little interest in practical concrete implications of commonly argued topics.
Your opinion doesn’t much change after talking with smart folks who know more.
You are especially eager to drop names when explaining positions and arguments.
You find it hard to list weak points and counter-arguments on your positions.

You feel passionately about a topic, but haven’t sought out much evidence.
You are reluctant to not have an opinion on commonly discussed topics.
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fezzyfestoon
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« Reply #1 on: January 10, 2011, 04:06:57 PM »

Of course, but it's impossible to approach when people on both sides attack only the other for doing it.  They'll gladly point out how terrible the other side is at arguing but insist their side isn't as bad.  On top of that is the all too common behavior as though people are running for office, like the "reluctant to change your positions" one and others.  There's a lot of sloppy debating and attempts to "win" rather than true discussions of things.  A lot of people seem far more interested in proving the other side wrong rather than examining what they believe.
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Torie
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« Reply #2 on: January 10, 2011, 06:14:05 PM »

Well, I think I am somewhat guilty of one of Brittain33's bolded list of the most common sins of internet "argumenteers," but in all honesty, only one. Of which sin do I think I am guilty? Anyone care to guess?  Smiley

Great list by the way Brittain33, and a well chosen culling of those you escalated to the bold, and a great idea for a thread. You get an "A" from Torie on this one, and I am a tough grader. Tongue
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Redalgo
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« Reply #3 on: January 10, 2011, 06:24:22 PM »

I am guilty of some of these. It is usually only recognized in hindsight though, unfortunately. D:
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Gustaf
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« Reply #4 on: January 11, 2011, 04:58:07 AM »

What a Moderate Hero thread.
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fezzyfestoon
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« Reply #5 on: January 11, 2011, 10:25:22 AM »


haha yeah, just weak-minded pussies here. Tongue
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Brittain33
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« Reply #6 on: January 11, 2011, 11:32:14 AM »


What's Moderately Heroic about it?

I don't expect everyone to agree with the center, I just want people to recognize when they disagree, why they're doing so. If someone wants to say, "You're right on this issue, but my party says this, and it's not important to me, so I'm not going to fight alongside you," that's valid. It's getting self-righteous and close-minded when the only reason you support an argument is because you think you're supposed to, or you don't trust anyone who doesn't support your party, or because you're worried you'll cause harm to the issues you do care about if you concede that turns me off.
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Gustaf
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« Reply #7 on: January 11, 2011, 11:34:29 AM »


What's Moderately Heroic about it?

I don't expect everyone to agree with the center, I just want people to recognize when they disagree, why they're doing so. If someone wants to say, "You're right on this issue, but my party says this, and it's not important to me, so I'm not going to fight alongside you," that's valid. It's getting self-righteous and close-minded when the only reason you support an argument is because you're supposed to that turns me off.

I was just being sarcastic as regards hacks. I'm a moderate hero myself, so I agree with you.
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