We are better than this - Restore Atlasia!

[Swedish Rainbow Capitalist Cheese]

- When I first joined Atlasia in the summer of '09 it was a game of excitment. When I discovered the place I imediatly decided to register even though I still was far from having obtained the number of posts required for being allowed to join the fun. I was politly rejected, and told to come back when I had made 50 or more posts. It took me a few days before I achived that requirment but I returned just in time to be part of a very competive presidential election. A centre-right coalition headed by the strong Regional Protection Party was seriously threatening the left-wing dominans and fell just short of conquring the White House. Debates were being had, candidates had their own campaign threads were people actually asked them serious questions about policy and they gave serious answers. It was a time of great fun. Which party I was going to join was never in doubt. At the time there were three clear strong ideological parties, and out of those three the Democratic Alliance with it's common-sense centrism, pragmatism, and social liberalism was the perfect fit for me.

- Sure, there were storm clouds on the sky. An increasing number of zomby voters were being reqruited and used by both sides to secure their electoral success, and two regions were very polarized and uncompetive. But most things were fine, and three of the regions was in fact very diverse and very competive. In the Mideast, the region I choose to settle down in, the local assembly could in one day be governed completly by liberals, and have a conservative majority the next. The Senate was extraordinarly active, including at the time some of Atlasia's finest senators through history, debating and passing legislation 24/7. Even the old gaurd who'd been part of the game for years said this was a truly golden age for Atlasia.

- It's not a long time between now and then. Yet Atlasia is radicly different than it used to be during that golden age. The decline, the corruption happened so gradually it's almost hard to remember what exactly went down, but it all began with DWTL. His behaivior as leader of the RPP soon alienated the moderate Democratic Alliance and drove them to the left thereby ending the successful coalition that for a short moment actually threatened the old establishment. His terror and dominans over his own party eventually resulted in a civil war on thr right, and his fall gave birth to yet another danger in the rise of Hamilton. For a tyrant rarly falls without another one taking it's place.

- But I shall not digress, for I do actually have a point to make. DWTL's and Hamilton's actions left Atlasia scared. The centre-right coalition could never be rebuilt because of the huge amounts of bad blood between moderates, conservatives, and libertairians their actions had created. Their plans to maximize their power by tricky electoral tactics are the reason we today see uncompetitiv regions dominated by a single party. This in a combination with other factors, such as elections and campaigns, becoming more of an unimportant formality rather than the exciting races we used to see.

- Not long ago I decided the decline had become too serious. All fun I used to see in the game was gone, and I decided to give up on the place. But Atlasia deserves a second chance, and I know that we could return to the old days, because we are better than this. And that's why I've decided to start project Restore Atlasia. I want to discuss what went wrong and how we can undo it. I want to campaign to make those necessary changes to bring back the fun, excitment and compititivness to the game. And I want to make sure the elections once again become the main event in Atlasia. And if you, like I, feel like we need to change Atlasia back to the better, you should join me.

- Swedish Cheese, Private Citizen, Active again       

 

 

 

[Fmr. Pres. Duke]

Here here! To the gallows!

[California8429]

Well said.

Though I was only a youngling during the glory ages of intense elections and debate, I rarely posted, though I did watch.

[ilikeverin]

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We did?

[bgwah]

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We did?

Nah... the old guard was too prideful to admit that Bgwah and DWTL of all people brought Atlasia back.



Anyway, interesting post, SC. But the right now seems weakened. As controversial as DWTL, Hamilton, and Libertas were, they brought energy to the right. That is sorely missing right now. I know my friends in the UDL like to lecture me about competition, but I think a disorganized and unenthusiastic center & right-wing is probably much worse for this game than a lot of people realize. But there isn't much we on the left can do about that...

[Southern Senator North Carolina Yankee]

The two big problems is that there are people who want and insist on having it their own way 100% of the time (DWTL, Hammy and few others), you have a left with very little remaining items to pass absent amnesia of what has been done already, and finally a right that is afraid to organize and push for conservative ideas for fear of being labeled a joke and driven off.

You have one conservative party with a cloud of unethical behavior it just can't seem to escape even with time and a bunch of people who lack the ability to operate in a strategic fashion. You have another conserative party that is cynical and pessimistic about the future. On the left you have two liberal parties now. One of which is the party of bgwah, and the other is the party that isn't. 

There are no issues on which to drive the politics and as the UDL has showed, just forming a new party is not going to spice up Atlasia and effect any marginal improvement in the activity side of things.

[Southern Senator North Carolina Yankee]

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We did?

Nah... the old guard was too prideful to admit that Bgwah and DWTL of all people brought Atlasia back.



Anyway, interesting post, SC. But the right now seems weakened. As controversial as DWTL, Hamilton, and Libertas were, they brought energy to the right. That is sorely missing right now. I know my friends in the UDL like to lecture me about competition, but I think a disorganized and unenthusiastic center & right-wing is probably much worse for this game than a lot of people realize. But there isn't much we on the left can do about that...

Yea, this game needs an ideological give an take. As much as our "old guard" members would like to think otherwise, you won't keep this game active and interesting without a somewhat polarized ideological political scene because the vast majority of posters are Americans. This is why I think some of the "old guard" essentially wanted a permenently smaller game of 60 to 70 voters tops with some kind of parlimentary or gov't focused simulation.

[tmthforu94]

The second I read the title, I thought of this...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jU7fhIO7DG0

[Swedish Rainbow Capitalist Cheese]

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Ah yes, I do not disagree. DWTL was a big part in the success of the RPP at that time, and a big part in the fact that Atlasia was so intresting. As it has been said "the same traits that raise them up will bring them down" so I think it's fair to say DWTL was both a reason for the rise of the centre-right opposition, but also one of the main reasons for its fall.

And yes I belive the fact that the right is so devided and unenthused is a major part in the decline of Atlasia. We need someone who can make the right excited again, who can unite us, but without becoming so controversial, so prideful, he'll alianate everyone and cause us to break up once we're united again. Then we could really start to see compititive elections again.

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I'd dare say that it's not only on the right we see a lack of enthusiasm, but on the left as well because they really have nothing to fight for anymore. If we could manage to unite the right, create competetive elections, and actually gain enough power to push through some conservative/libretairian agenda, it wouldn't only give us on the right more meaning to fight, but the other side as well, and then we'd actually have a game that was exciting. 

I believe both you and Bgwah are spot on.

 

[PD and J]

You're a year and a half late and about ten voters short.

Your memories of summer 2009 are actually quite far off from what actually was happening.  If I recall, I was recruited to this game by North Carolina Yankee in July for one main reason--because it was necessary. Does no one remember June 2009? The RPP/DA combined still lost to the JCP despite taking 3 or 4 JCP members during the process.  The RPP won a single Senate seat outright int hat election and had no at-large seats. MasterJedi tied for the second time in a row and only avoided a run-off he was sure to lose because EarlAW (SoFA at the time) realized that if he sent MJ to a run-off then Lief couldn't be declared the victor right off the bat, essentially. Gustaf's and barnes' votes aside, it is ridiculous that the center-left to the far-right has to unite behind one ticket to even come close to winning. The right and left should be competitive with each other, and the explicit center should be able to split evenly.

But this is the problem--there is no elasticity in this game allowed. Right-wing candidates move to the left, left-wing voters solidify like never before (October 2010). In any normal "country", what constitutes right and what constitutes left adapts to fit the political environment, hence why both Democrats and Republicans have shifted right in only a two-year period.
I was around. I know what it was like. Swedish, in my first encounter with you, you labeled me a "moderate hero". Maybe I was and am. But whatever. I was a productive Atlasian who brought a great legislative record to the Northeast and was instrumental in making that region both competitive and active (and anyone with a quarter of a brain would know that the two go hand-in-hand).  What we did in the Northeast was undone because a handful of spoiled left-wing twats decided that winning elections with only a slim majority meant one-party domination, and some of them decided to move to the Pacific (and yes, that is the same Pacific that pushed me out as soon as I tried to constructively bring some competition to elections). I

These lefties would vote for Friz over Torie today. Hell, people kept voting for Bacon King after he decided he didn't even want to be a Senator. Unless the right has the numbers to compete with the left, there is nothing that will change in this game to make it work.

Personalities are all that matter in this game. The left doesn't care that bgwah can post sex fantasies about Bono and Nazis, or that Kalwejt can throw an immature fit every couple weeks and exhibit extreme bipolar symptoms without provocation. They don't care that BRTD is relentless in his personal attacks and harassment of forum members he has even the slightest of disagreements with.

DWTL was a moron, a poor leader, and bad at his job. No sh**t, that's why me, PiT and Tmth conspired to get rid of him but no one else had the balls to take him on.

As for myself and Libertas, at least we were good at our Atlasian jobs. It's just that we would never be judged on that because certain people on this forum don't want people here who disagree. And Duke loves that he is popular now and is able to be a total asshole because of it, but it wasn't too long ago he was getting shat on the same as most on the right were. June 09 special election? LOL. And he was always one of BRTD's victims too. Shame on you, Duke.

This game is no better off without myself or Libertas than it would be without bgwah or Marokai or Antonio or Tmth or PiT or Lief or Snowguy or anyone else, really. At least Fritz understand that this game needs people to function.

Does no one else care that the left can literally split itself and half and still shoot straight to the top-two spots? Or that the RPP has existed for over two years and still has never won a national election?

Atlasia is like this because the left made it this way. I want to blame it on DWTL's inability to lead the RPP, but I can't. There was no right-wing before the RPP. The JCP candidate has won nine of the last ten Presidential elections. The JCP-endorsed candidate has won every special Senate election since bgwah became President a.k.a. before we even knew that Obama would win Indiana and North Carolina. The Left in Atlasia has done all it can to demonize anyone who isn't one of them. Look at the horrible things you guys said about people like Duke when he was new, or Tmth when he was first appointed Senator and new, or Dallasfan when he joined and tried to just be a part of this game. I was thought to be Ogis, and instantly suspected. When I wanted to participate more, I was ridiculed by some.

The right can put up their best personalities and move as close to center-left as possible without being a carbon copy of the JCP/UDL. They will lose. Why do you think I was running for Governor against AndrewCT? He was a passive executive and didn't want to energize debate on political positions, but rather form a consensus. I wanted to be an active and strong executive that would push my own policies and have allies and opponents in the legislature. A functioning, realistic type of government that would allow voters to pick sides. But people like Libertas and dallasfan and Morgan, they were just "useless zombie-trolls". Senator who doesn't do sh**t for 21 straight days? Well, 15 first preferences and re-election was the least he deserved.

Kinda sickening to think about actually. I mean, in the real world we would all vote to re-elect Senators who spent 1/5+ of their term doing absolutely nothing, right?

The figures on the right only become controversial because whenever the left does something similar no one sees anything wrong with it. Realisticidealist went from Ogis' troll squad to JCP Senator to one of the more respected forumites. officepark didn't get to braek through from that so easily. Any one wondering why?

The right needs more voters on their side, or more leftists have to start voting for righties. You need both sides. It's the conflict that drives elections, elections that drive government, and government that drives the conflict. When was the last time that any kind of right-wing policy was enacted at the federal level? Yep.

P.S. those who think posting PMs and private conversations and the like, as a means of hurting the reputations of others in a humiliating and public manner, should be ashamed of themselves.

[tpfkaw]

Hamilton?

No sh!t!

[Kaine for Senate '18]

Hamilton?

No sh!t!

Yeah, I was just about to edit that post.  Wow.

[PD and J]

We need someone who can make the right excited again, who can unite us, but without becoming so controversial, so prideful, he'll alianate everyone and cause us to break up once we're united again. Then we could really start to see compititive elections again.

You do realize that is EXACTLY what I did/attempted?

And do you know why it didn't work?

Because others are too prideful! And when one says hmm... maybe afleitch is right, we should focus on a center-right policy more than regions all that PiT/tmth/me were met with is reactionary screams and yells from the likes of the DWTL/NCY squadron.

The right needs numbers to match the left. The right needs a center that is actually a center and not just a (to use Duke's words) group of people who have only egos separating them from the left.

And then, whenever a right-leaning member signs up they are immediately a troll or zombie. You did it to me. you did it to dallas. you did it to a lot of people.

There's no reason Junkie should have lost to Do-nothing King.

[bgwah]

m
And then, whenever a right-leaning member signs up they are imediately a troll or zombie.

A lot of that stems from the fact that there was this one guy, Hamilton I think was his name, who had like six or seven accounts registered...

[PD and J]

m
And then, whenever a right-leaning member signs up they are imediately a troll or zombie.

A lot of that stems from the fact that there was this one guy, Hamilton I think was his name, who had like six or seven accounts registered...

Um, after I was banned over complete bullsh**t, yeah.

There was once this one guy bgwah, who called himself Jesus. I think he also called himself Apostle and Rev. matthew, among others.



Xahar, leader of the UDl, also had other accounts.

So did DWTL.

And those claims were around before I was even around. I was a victim of them by some.

[bgwah]

m
And then, whenever a right-leaning member signs up they are imediately a troll or zombie.

A lot of that stems from the fact that there was this one guy, Hamilton I think was his name, who had like six or seven accounts registered...

Um, after I was banned over complete bullsh**t, yeah.

There was once this one guy bgwah, who called himself Jesus. I think he also called himself Apostle and Rev. matthew, among others.



Xahar, leader of the UDl, also had other accounts.

So did DWTL.

And those claims were around before I was even around. I was a victim of them by some.

I'm pretty sure none of those accounts ever voted. They were friends, yes, but I've only ever had one account here.

[PD and J]

m
And then, whenever a right-leaning member signs up they are imediately a troll or zombie.

A lot of that stems from the fact that there was this one guy, Hamilton I think was his name, who had like six or seven accounts registered...

Um, after I was banned over complete bullsh**t, yeah.

There was once this one guy bgwah, who called himself Jesus. I think he also called himself Apostle and Rev. matthew, among others.



Xahar, leader of the UDl, also had other accounts.

So did DWTL.

And those claims were around before I was even around. I was a victim of them by some.

I'm pretty sure none of those accounts ever voted. They were friends, yes, but I've only ever had one account here.

Neither did mine til I was unjustly (at least at the time) banned.

[Marokai Backbeat]

Your memories of summer 2009 are actually quite far off from what actually was happening.  If I recall, I was recruited to this game by North Carolina Yankee in July for one main reason--because it was necessary. Does no one remember June 2009? The RPP/DA combined still lost to the JCP despite taking 3 or 4 JCP members during the process.

By a single vote. Besides, you seriously mischaracterize how things were around that time. The JCP had literally just become powerful enough at that point to stand after the SDP-JCP merging less than two months prior, on it's own, against two other parties. It didn't have that ability before. People seem to forget that Bgwah got elected because initially, Meeker being his running mate, was a member of the RPP. They got elected both times because of the initial unity ticket that they were. Bgwah was seen as.. well.. Bgwah, but he's not some sort of socialist mastermind of the left, he's just sorta goofy, politically.

Acting like the JCP was a monstrous power before this is insane. Ebowed and Keystone Phil managed to get elected because they ran on a ticket together. Before that, the major party was the NLC, this ridiculous collection of left-wingers and right-wingers that essentially become more of a government party instead of something coherent. How exactly was that fun?

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You may have noticed that I didn't preference Bacon King, and it was because of that reason. It's not the "left" that gives him so much props. He's the AHDuke of the JCP, the candidate they bring out whenever they want someone both the left and right likes. Sure, primarily the support probably came from the JCP, but the JCP ain't the all encompassing term for the "left" that they used to be.

Besides, that brings me to...

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SPC. Dude, your party lifted SPC to roughly around 20% of the vote when he ran for President. SPC is notorious for having long and completely unexplained spells of inactivity and during the campaign he publicly declared his refusal to publish a political platform. Where exactly do you get off, here? The Populares are high and mighty how, exactly? You decry the left-wing's inactivity and terrible candidates by trying to beat us using the exact same tactics you seem to hate but still you want to claim the moral highground?

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I've mentioned this before, but the Right struggles to win because your candidates are hardly inspiring. SPC was a joke that proudly exclaimed he wouldn't publish a platform. RosettaStoned refused to have any sort of debate with PS and I and immediately after the campaign, set up this "sore losers caucus" where they whined about it for a few days. PiT was the candidate in October last year, after previously losing an election. He was already damaged goods at that point! You couldn't find anyone else?

Afleitch managed to be the lone winner... and then had one of the most inactive and dreadful administrations in recent Atlasian history. The same sort of attacks were laid on AndrewCT during his campaign, as his time in the governor's office in the Northeast weren't a bastion of activity, if you catch my drift.

You put forward terrible candidates and then wonder why you lose. You can play the victim as you like, but Lief's two terms were good and active and legislatively some of the most productive ever. PS and I managed to get a new Constitution. The first thing Fritz did before he even took office was petition Dave to get the new regional government child board. Right-wing candidates don't lose solely because they're right-wing candidates, they lose because they've usually been horrible candidates, or when they did win, performed exactly as the left accused them of being.

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Dallasfan was great, but Morgan, following my previous statements about terrible candidates, pretty much falls precisely in line. As Governor, he seemed nothing but perplexed about what he could or should be doing. Libertas spent part of his time trying to circumvent the Constitution by holding multiple offices and trying to piss all over the Court when they told him to stop being a douche. I don't see your all-star lineup here, yet.

Oh, and you want to know who you can thank for the Northeast actually doing anything at all with their assembly and so on? Barnes. Left-winger. You're welcome.

[PD and J]

Your memories of summer 2009 are actually quite far off from what actually was happening.  If I recall, I was recruited to this game by North Carolina Yankee in July for one main reason--because it was necessary. Does no one remember June 2009? The RPP/DA combined still lost to the JCP despite taking 3 or 4 JCP members during the process.

By a single vote. Besides, you seriously mischaracterize how things were around that time. The JCP had literally just become powerful enough at that point to stand after the SDP-JCP merging less than two months prior, on it's own, against two other parties. It didn't have that ability before. People seem to forget that Bgwah got elected because initially, Meeker being his running mate, was a member of the RPP. They got elected both times because of the initial unity ticket that they were. Bgwah was seen as.. well.. Bgwah, but he's not some sort of socialist mastermind of the left, he's just sorta goofy, politically.

Acting like the JCP was a monstrous power before this is insane. Ebowed and Keystone Phil managed to get elected because they ran on a ticket together. Before that, the major party was the NLC, this ridiculous collection of left-wingers and right-wingers that essentially become more of a government party instead of something coherent. How exactly was that fun?

I'm not mischaracterizing a damn thing, Marokai! You took one of the most partisan and ideological JCP tickets in June 2009, against a coalition of DA+RPP+a lot of Indys and a handful of JCPers. It should've been a blow out. Lief vs. North Carolina Yankee or Marokai vs. Dallasfan65 should be elections where no candidate is favored right off the bat in a neutral environment. The NLC couldn't hold itself together and the disagreements were stronger. It's way different than what the JCP dominance brought.

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You may have noticed that I didn't preference Bacon King, and it was because of that reason. It's not the "left" that gives him so much props. He's the AHDuke of the JCP, the candidate they bring out whenever they want someone both the left and right likes. Sure, primarily the support probably came from the JCP, but the JCP ain't the all encompassing term for the "left" that they used to be.[/quote]

Well, good for you. But unfortunately you are you and not the entire left-wing mass that continues to dominate. And AHDuke was not respected by the left or center until he actually got elected and voted lock-step with them on a lot of issues. It's good that you didn't vote for someone who clearly doesn't care about the office they hold, but others should feel the same.

You did defend the sh**t out of him last month, though. Hm.

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SPC. Dude, your party lifted SPC to roughly around 20% of the vote when he ran for President. SPC is notorious for having long and completely unexplained spells of inactivity and during the campaign he publicly declared his refusal to publish a political platform. Where exactly do you get off, here? The Populares are high and mighty how, exactly? You decry the left-wing's inactivity and terrible candidates by trying to beat us using the exact same tactics you seem to hate but still you want to claim the moral highground?[/quote][/quote]

The SPC ticket was, ironically, a ticket put up solely to make sure that it wasn't a 100% Bacon King election. And that's the thing-- no one else wanted to run because they knew they would lose. That afleitch had enough time spent on the forum to win the popularity contest didn't really matter. I'd have pushed for a BK endorsement at that time until he decided to demagouge against certain posters.

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I've mentioned this before, but the Right struggles to win because your candidates are hardly inspiring. SPC was a joke that proudly exclaimed he wouldn't publish a platform. RosettaStoned refused to have any sort of debate with PS and I and immediately after the campaign, set up this "sore losers caucus" where they whined about it for a few days. PiT was the candidate in October last year, after previously losing an election. He was already damaged goods at that point! You couldn't find anyone else?

Afleitch managed to be the lone winner... and then had one of the most inactive and dreadful administrations in recent Atlasian history. The same sort of attacks were laid on AndrewCT during his campaign, as his time in the governor's office in the Northeast weren't a bastion of activity, if you catch my drift.

You put forward terrible candidates and then wonder why you lose. You can play the victim as you like, but Lief's two terms were good and active and legislatively some of the most productive ever. PS and I managed to get a new Constitution. The first thing Fritz did before he even took office was petition Dave to get the new regional government child board. Right-wing candidates don't lose solely because they're right-wing candidates, they lose because they've usually been horrible candidates, or when they did win, performed exactly as the left accused them of being.[/quote]

Yeah, you can complain about the Right candidates all you want. It's not my fault that the POP was a new party and ran it's own tickets twice in a row when they had no chance. Why did the JCP run Eraserhead against Dallasfan? Just to have a candidate! The same reason Republicans and Democrats can run candidates in elections they obviously have no chance in. And afleitch shouldn't even be considered a right-wing President, and he did suck, I will give you that. He didn't even bother voting in the midterm that caused his own party to collapse. What type of conservative or right-leaning agenda or legislation came out of afleitch's administration? Internal affairs managed by a socialist? Hashemite in charge of foreign policy? Please.

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Dallasfan was great, but Morgan, following my previous statements about terrible candidates, pretty much falls precisely in line. As Governor, he seemed nothing but perplexed about what he could or should be doing. Libertas spent part of his time trying to circumvent the Constitution by holding multiple offices and trying to piss all over the Court when they told him to stop being a douche. I don't see your all-star lineup here, yet.

Oh, and you want to know who you can thank for the Northeast actually doing anything at all with their assembly and so on? Barnes. Left-winger. You're welcome.
[/quote][/quote]

You called Dallasfan "kind of stupid". You did it. For No reason. So I would kindly suggest that you GTFOH calling him great and kissing ass when you tried to push him out of the game. I brought right wingers to the game and helped them get active. That's something I did, enjoyed doing, and felt was a good thing. I want people to have fun playing this game and like President Fritz, I think having more people is better for our elections. More choices. More personalities. It's great.

Morgan presided over a very active Assembly and worked amidst controversies that went to your Court. I think he was much more active and able as Governor than AndrewCT or Rowan, who couldn't even open a voting booth. I ran against those types of right-wingers because it was the right thing to do. No one ran against MaxQue for his do-nothing Senate seat (and this isn't meant to be a below the belt punch to you, Marokai, but he was  a sucky ass Senator. You know it.).

Barnes? Lol. Maybe but the Northeast Assembly only barely had the votes to pass and wouldn't have before I moved there. The reason the Northeast Assembly worked is because we had enthusiastic right, left and center members who were civil, respectful, and able to do our jobs. I was glad to have received support from all parties in that election, but that was a truly miraculous time period for the Northeast and I knew it wouldn't last because some people were just too immature. perhaps I was myself. But I don't aim to cause needless problems. There's enough already. And they maybe could be solved.

[Psychic Octopus]

Welcome back (to both Hamilton and Swedish Cheese).

[Swedish Rainbow Capitalist Cheese]

Speaking of the devil...

Glad to see you're still keeping yourself updated about the doings of Atlasia, Ham. At least you haven't lost intrest in the game I see.

I'm wondering who's memories are far off. When you first joined you were adored by quite a big group of people who saw a lot of potential in you. You were praised by the RPP as a future star, the DA was discussing how we best could get you to join us, and even moderate JCP members complimented you. I never saw you as moderate hero, actually I saw your views and your intrest in the game as quite similar to my own, and if you remember I endorsed you for your race. Quite frankly you used to be quite well-liked around here.

As I said, '09 was not perfect, and the one-party concentration of the Pacific and the South were one of the problem areas. However I don't see your loss in a region where everyone knew you didn't have a chance justifies you consentrating your entire party in one region so that you could create a similar one-party region for yourself. I don't believe it for a second that you just intended for it to be competive, and that you'd have stopped importing Populares members once you had a 50-50 region.

And stop trying to make yourself seem like a victim who was just bullied by all the evil lefties on here. There are several posters who've advocated more righ-wing positions than you who have not as you say moved to the left, and who are still well liked and respected by a huge majority of the members. Inks, Yankee, Pit... the difference is those guys are not lying jerks. So you can drop the "I'm-so-good-and-only-wanted-the-games-best" act, everyone here knows what you're really like. My memory is perfectly fine, so I do remember when you though Afleitch was Franzl VP candidate and promised him you wouldn't tell anyone, and the same night RPP:ers were asking me if it was true Afleitch was Franzl's VP candidate. You were a lying rat then and you are now.

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And that's exactly what I'm saying, so Hamilton we agree on the premise. It's just your methods to achive conflict that's rotten to the core, your actions that alianated the centrists from supporting your party as well as several conservatives.

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Afraid people will find out you lie and talk sh**t about them behind their backs? People aren't idiots Ham, they already know that.

  



 

[PD and J]

Speaking of the devil...

Glad to see you're still keeping yourself updated about the doings of Atlasia, Ham. At least you haven't lost intrest in the game I see.

Wrong.

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No, I was attacked pretty viciously by a lot of people. And those were the exact words you defined me with, I could find the quote. I was off to a controversial start for making a statement that Stalin was worse than Hitler because he brought about more death. I don't know where you were.

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Importing Populares? Lol! Libertas, dallasfan, han, paul718, sg0508, NHmagic, Lahbas, Winfield, Mint, Zarn... Thse people live in those states! The only party doing the importing was the DA, out of the Northeast and into the Mideast. You can make all the baseless claims you want, but the Northeast was never going to be a one party region as big as it is. A one-party region would contradict every single thing that I pushed for in this game for over a year.

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Clearly not well-liked enough to keep Inks' Senate seat or make President PiT.

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I'm not putting on any act. I don't see how someone telling me or hinting that that was true is at all relevant. I'm no more a lying rat than anyone else who has posted in this thread so far.

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And that's exactly what I'm saying, so Hamilton we agree on the premise. It's just your methods to achive conflict that's rotten to the core, your actions that alianated the centrists from supporting your party as well as several conservatives. [/quote]

Actions such as? I never recruited off-site like your ex-boyfriend Tmth did (does, suppose, but PresBruno isn't registered yet). Claims can be thrown around towards me, but they aren't true and I will be able to defend myself.

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Afraid people will find out you lie and talk sh**t about them behind their backs? People aren't idiots Ham, they already know that.

  
[/quote]

I have no desire to lie or sh**t talk anyone.

I don't PM.

That statement had nothing to do with me and last time PMs caused a crisis it still didn't affect me. If PiT took some strategic advice, that was his decision. I still think it was a good idea and see nothing wrong with it. Back-room deals are a part of politics anyways. If you are against them, vote against people that engage on them. Just don't do it to conservatives if you don't do it to social democrats.

[#CriminalizeSobriety]

I must say there is some credence to what has been said in this thread.

As somebody who experienced this first hand, there is an inherent bias against newbies, especially those on the Right. When I first signed up for Atlasia, I had done nothing except endorse one or two candidates, cast a vote for Mint - and all of a sudden I was implicated as...

- A zombie
- Somebody who didn't care about Atlasia
- Just here to cause trouble

etc...

Not to mention, when I testified otherwise - that I did infact have an interest for the game, it was assumed that Hamilton merely PMed me to post in that thread.

And it wasn't just the JCP doing this; several members in the RPP did aswell.

[California8429]

How could you possibly have no interest in the game when you hover around this game 24/7 for a year after being banned and continue to IM people?

[PD and J]

Talking to people that choose to I'm me or invite me isn't relevant to my interest in this game, even if it comes up in conversations.  I like to discuss politics with people.