Kerry states heavily subsidize Bush states

[A18]

Did you even bother to read what he posted?

[○∙◄☻¥tπ[╪AV┼cVê└]

The only real surprises there are VA and MD.  They are two of the wealthiest states in the Union, yet both get back much more than they pay in.  I guess it has something to do with bordering DC.

The study includes all spending, including things like salaries and social security benefits.  Virginia and Maryland get the benefit of federal worker salaries, as well as supplies bought from local companies.  Florida and Arizona get the benefit of Social Security benefits sent to retirees.  Other states get benefits because the federal government owns a large part of the state.

It is pretty parochial to consider spending to preserve the Grand Canyon or Yellowstone as subsidizing Arizona or Wyoming, or sending the SS check or Medicare of someone who worked in Ohio or New York for 45 years as being as subsidy of Florida, or that spending by armed forces in their base areas is a subsidy of the states where the bases are located.

Spin spin spin

It's not spin, it is the truth.  I'm sorry if idiots like you and Wakie are so blinded by partisanship that you cannot except the obvious truth, even when it is undebatable.

What obvious truth?
The north-east has lots of old people, and they're still screwed.
NYC and SF have a high cost of living and they're still screwed.
NYC has a lot of minorities, and it's still screwed.
Only a tiny share of federal spending goes to the national parks, anyways.

[○∙◄☻¥tπ[╪AV┼cVê└]

Did you even bother to read what he posted?

That doesn't chance the fact that blue states are screwed. All the blue state military bases were closed, but guess what the blue states would still be screwed even without the military spending.

You guys are desperately trying to spin that NJ gets back 57 cents on the dollar. There's no way you can spin that away.

[12th Doctor]

The Kerry states send more money to the feds than they get back. The Bush states are welfare states. Something on the order of $200 billion a year is transfered.

Bush won 13 of the biggest 14 welfare states.
Kerry won 12 of the 14 most screwed states.

http://www.taxfoundation.org/taxingspending.html

Wow!  This is only the billionth time I have heard this one.

#1  If you look at where the vast majority of military bases are concentrated, then you have found the key to this riddle.

#2 If you look where the remainder ends up, it is clear that it ends up going to minority communities who vote heavily Democratic.

I blew this myth to pieces in Sociology 101.

You blew what myth to pieces? The statistics don't lie.

Okay, maybe you are an idiot, maybe you are just trying to piss people off.

#1 Statistics can lie, but that is not the point.

#2 How the statistics are interprited is the real issue here.  As I said it is obvious that a vast majority of the military bases are located in the south because of the weather.  Thus, most of the government funding that we are talking about goes there.

Secondly, Most of the National Parks in the country are located in places like Wyoming, Tennessee, Arizona, Missouri, etc.

Thirdly, most of the remainder is money that is given to minorities like the Hispanics in TX, Arizona, Florida and New Mexico and blacks in Alabama, Mississippi and Georgia.

So, the statistics don't lie, but your analysis of them is superficial, politically motivated and just down right assinine.

[12th Doctor]

Did you even bother to read what he posted?

That doesn't chance the fact that blue states are screwed. All the blue state military bases were closed, but guess what the blue states would still be screwed even without the military spending.

You guys are desperately trying to spin that NJ gets back 57 cents on the dollar. There's no way you can spin that away.

There is nothing in New Jersey.  No national parks.  Is Fort Dix even there anymore?  Most of Northern New Jersey is afluent suburbs.

The reason why most of the military bases were closed in the north is that most northern congressmen wanted them out and the military was happy to oblige because the weather in the south is far more condusive to all-year opperations.

[○∙◄☻¥tπ[╪AV┼cVê└]

The Kerry states send more money to the feds than they get back. The Bush states are welfare states. Something on the order of $200 billion a year is transfered.

Bush won 13 of the biggest 14 welfare states.
Kerry won 12 of the 14 most screwed states.

http://www.taxfoundation.org/taxingspending.html

Wow!  This is only the billionth time I have heard this one.

#1  If you look at where the vast majority of military bases are concentrated, then you have found the key to this riddle.

#2 If you look where the remainder ends up, it is clear that it ends up going to minority communities who vote heavily Democratic.

I blew this myth to pieces in Sociology 101.

You blew what myth to pieces? The statistics don't lie.

Okay, maybe you are an idiot, maybe you are just trying to piss people off.

#1 Statistics can lie, but that is not the point.

#2 How the statistics are interprited is the real issue here.  As I said it is obvious that a vast majority of the military bases are located in the south because of the weather.  Thus, most of the government funding that we are talking about goes there.

Secondly, Most of the National Parks in the country are located in places like Wyoming, Tennessee, Arizona, Missouri, etc.

Thirdly, most of the remainder is money that is given to minorities like the Hispanics in TX, Arizona, Florida and New Mexico.

So, the statistics don't lie, but your analysis of them is superficial, politically motivated and just down right assinine.

1. National parks aren't responsible for a large fraction of the $2+ trillion deficit.
2. Some National parks are in blue sttes
3. A lot of the military bases in blue states were closed in recent years
4. Military bases are most likely not even the majority of military spending
5. NYC has a ton of minorities, but that doesn't stop it from being screwed

The fact is, Kerry states subsidize Bush states by about $200 billion a year. We want our money back.

[12th Doctor]

The Kerry states send more money to the feds than they get back. The Bush states are welfare states. Something on the order of $200 billion a year is transfered.

Bush won 13 of the biggest 14 welfare states.
Kerry won 12 of the 14 most screwed states.

http://www.taxfoundation.org/taxingspending.html

Wow!  This is only the billionth time I have heard this one.

#1  If you look at where the vast majority of military bases are concentrated, then you have found the key to this riddle.

#2 If you look where the remainder ends up, it is clear that it ends up going to minority communities who vote heavily Democratic.

I blew this myth to pieces in Sociology 101.

You blew what myth to pieces? The statistics don't lie.

Okay, maybe you are an idiot, maybe you are just trying to piss people off.

#1 Statistics can lie, but that is not the point.

#2 How the statistics are interprited is the real issue here.  As I said it is obvious that a vast majority of the military bases are located in the south because of the weather.  Thus, most of the government funding that we are talking about goes there.

Secondly, Most of the National Parks in the country are located in places like Wyoming, Tennessee, Arizona, Missouri, etc.

Thirdly, most of the remainder is money that is given to minorities like the Hispanics in TX, Arizona, Florida and New Mexico.

So, the statistics don't lie, but your analysis of them is superficial, politically motivated and just down right assinine.

1. National parks aren't responsible for a large fraction of the $2+ trillion deficit.
2. Some National parks are in blue sttes
3. A lot of the military bases in blue states were closed in recent years
4. Military bases are most likely not even the majority of military spending
5. NYC has a ton of minorities, but that doesn't stop it from being screwed

The fact is, Kerry states subsidize Bush states by about $200 billion a year. We want our money back.

All this spending goes to programs and causes that Democrats campion, except the military, which they dispise.

In Mississippi, the money goes to minorities and to projects to clean the Mississippi River.

In New Mexico, the money goes to Air Force Bases and Hispanic communities and efforts to clean the Rio Grande and protect vast Indian Reservations and national parks.

In West Virginia, it goes to environmental efforts and to helping families of Mine workers.  Blame Bob Byrd for that.

In Alaska, ever heard of ANWAR?

Not only that, but combined, Red States have over four times the length of Federal Highways to maintain than they do in Blue states.

If you want your money back, fine.  Stop spending money on all of these programs that you claim to hold so near and dear then and fire Bob Byrd.

While your at it, take your asses out of the Union and join Canada.

[○∙◄☻¥tπ[╪AV┼cVê└]

The Kerry states send more money to the feds than they get back. The Bush states are welfare states. Something on the order of $200 billion a year is transfered.

Bush won 13 of the biggest 14 welfare states.
Kerry won 12 of the 14 most screwed states.

http://www.taxfoundation.org/taxingspending.html

Wow!  This is only the billionth time I have heard this one.

#1  If you look at where the vast majority of military bases are concentrated, then you have found the key to this riddle.

#2 If you look where the remainder ends up, it is clear that it ends up going to minority communities who vote heavily Democratic.

I blew this myth to pieces in Sociology 101.

You blew what myth to pieces? The statistics don't lie.

Okay, maybe you are an idiot, maybe you are just trying to piss people off.

#1 Statistics can lie, but that is not the point.

#2 How the statistics are interprited is the real issue here.  As I said it is obvious that a vast majority of the military bases are located in the south because of the weather.  Thus, most of the government funding that we are talking about goes there.

Secondly, Most of the National Parks in the country are located in places like Wyoming, Tennessee, Arizona, Missouri, etc.

Thirdly, most of the remainder is money that is given to minorities like the Hispanics in TX, Arizona, Florida and New Mexico.

So, the statistics don't lie, but your analysis of them is superficial, politically motivated and just down right assinine.

1. National parks aren't responsible for a large fraction of the $2+ trillion deficit.
2. Some National parks are in blue sttes
3. A lot of the military bases in blue states were closed in recent years
4. Military bases are most likely not even the majority of military spending
5. NYC has a ton of minorities, but that doesn't stop it from being screwed

The fact is, Kerry states subsidize Bush states by about $200 billion a year. We want our money back.

All this spending goes to programs and causes that Democrats campion, except the military, which they dispise.

In Mississippi, the money goes to minorities and to projects to clean the Mississippi River.

In New Mexico, the money goes to Air Force Bases and Hispanic communities and efforts to clean the Rio Grande and protect vast Indian Reservations and national parks.

In West Virginia, it goes to environmental efforts and to helping families of Mine workers.  Blame Bob Byrd for that.

In Alaska, ever heard of ANWAR?

Not only that, but combined, Red States have over four times the length of Federal Highways to maintain than they do in Blue states.

If you want your money back, fine.  Stop spending money on all of these programs that you claim to hold so near and dear then and fire Bob Byrd.

While your at it, take your asses out of the Union and join Canada.

Umm, no, the money goes to red state corporation, and lazy red staters. Most of New York's wilderness is state owned, not federally owned. Blue states are forced to do at the state level what the feds won't do for them - even though they'll do it for the welfare red states. The time has come to cut off the bigotted welfare states from our hard earned money.

[12th Doctor]

The Kerry states send more money to the feds than they get back. The Bush states are welfare states. Something on the order of $200 billion a year is transfered.

Bush won 13 of the biggest 14 welfare states.
Kerry won 12 of the 14 most screwed states.

http://www.taxfoundation.org/taxingspending.html

Wow!  This is only the billionth time I have heard this one.

#1  If you look at where the vast majority of military bases are concentrated, then you have found the key to this riddle.

#2 If you look where the remainder ends up, it is clear that it ends up going to minority communities who vote heavily Democratic.

I blew this myth to pieces in Sociology 101.

You blew what myth to pieces? The statistics don't lie.

Okay, maybe you are an idiot, maybe you are just trying to piss people off.

#1 Statistics can lie, but that is not the point.

#2 How the statistics are interprited is the real issue here.  As I said it is obvious that a vast majority of the military bases are located in the south because of the weather.  Thus, most of the government funding that we are talking about goes there.

Secondly, Most of the National Parks in the country are located in places like Wyoming, Tennessee, Arizona, Missouri, etc.

Thirdly, most of the remainder is money that is given to minorities like the Hispanics in TX, Arizona, Florida and New Mexico.

So, the statistics don't lie, but your analysis of them is superficial, politically motivated and just down right assinine.

1. National parks aren't responsible for a large fraction of the $2+ trillion deficit.
2. Some National parks are in blue sttes
3. A lot of the military bases in blue states were closed in recent years
4. Military bases are most likely not even the majority of military spending
5. NYC has a ton of minorities, but that doesn't stop it from being screwed

The fact is, Kerry states subsidize Bush states by about $200 billion a year. We want our money back.

All this spending goes to programs and causes that Democrats campion, except the military, which they dispise.

In Mississippi, the money goes to minorities and to projects to clean the Mississippi River.

In New Mexico, the money goes to Air Force Bases and Hispanic communities and efforts to clean the Rio Grande and protect vast Indian Reservations and national parks.

In West Virginia, it goes to environmental efforts and to helping families of Mine workers.  Blame Bob Byrd for that.

In Alaska, ever heard of ANWAR?

Not only that, but combined, Red States have over four times the length of Federal Highways to maintain than they do in Blue states.

If you want your money back, fine.  Stop spending money on all of these programs that you claim to hold so near and dear then and fire Bob Byrd.

While your at it, take your asses out of the Union and join Canada.

Umm, no, the money goes to red state corporation, and lazy red staters. Most of New York's wilderness is state owned, not federally owned. Blue states are forced to do at the state level what the feds won't do for them - even though they'll do it for the welfare red states. The time has come to cut off the bigotted welfare states from our hard earned money.

Most of the State owned forests in the East have always been stated owned, whereas in the West the Federal government bought up the land for presevation.

As for coorperations, where is the proof?  What is a Red state corperation anyway?  Almost all of the big Fortune 500's are located in Blue states.

Who are these lazy Red staters?  Minorities?  Most of the White trash I know are hard-core Democrat voters anyway who live in districts that have Democrat congressmen, like John Murtha, Bob Byrd, etc.

So I would really like to know, where are you going with this?
I fail to see your point.  That is, of course, assumning that you have one

[Mikem]

So tax rich people to pay poor ones, but keep rich money in rich states, unless they are blue. 

Wealth distribution, make up your minds democrats.  You cant have it both ways.  You are all for helping poor people, unless they vote for Bush, in which case, give us our money back!!!

[○∙◄☻¥tπ[╪AV┼cVê└]

So tax rich people to pay poor ones, but keep rich money in rich states, unless they are blue. 

Wealth distribution, make up your minds democrats.  You cant have it both ways.  You are all for helping poor people, unless they vote for Bush, in which case, give us our money back!!!

The federal government does not take into account cost of living. You aren't really richer if you make $15,000 in SF vs. $14,000 in North Dakota.

[TeePee4Prez]

Who are these lazy Red staters?  Minorities?  Most of the White trash I know are hard-core Democrat voters anyway who live in districts that have Democrat congressmen, like John Murtha, Bob Byrd, etc.

Whoa!  White trash as hardcore Democrats?  Hehe, in Northeast Philadelphia it's the Republicans that foam at the mouth over John Street and are scared to death of an African American moving on their block.  Are they white trash?  Well, some of them yes.  They are highly critical over Section 8 yet don't care for their own properties.  They say things like "Affirmative Action has hurt me" or "The stupid liberal elitists are taking my money."  Interesting what are cross-section we have here soulty.

[12th Doctor]

Who are these lazy Red staters?  Minorities?  Most of the White trash I know are hard-core Democrat voters anyway who live in districts that have Democrat congressmen, like John Murtha, Bob Byrd, etc.

Whoa!  White trash as hardcore Democrats?  Hehe, in Northeast Philadelphia it's the Republicans that foam at the mouth over John Street and are scared to death of an African American moving on their block.  Are they white trash?  Well, some of them yes.  They are highly critical over Section 8 yet don't care for their own properties.  They say things like "Affirmative Action has hurt me" or "The stupid liberal elitists are taking my money."  Interesting what are cross-section we have here soulty.

Do they work?  Do they try to take care of their families?  If they do then they aren't trash.  You say that they are against Section 8.  I assume, therefore, that they don't get anything out of it, which drives to the heart of what we are talking about.  Sure, the money goes there, but who does it go too?

Wait...

Forgot this part...

Where I am from, there is no minority vs white divide.  Therefore, the main battle is between those on government programs and those who are not.  I come from the Dark Blue area of PA, so you can guess that only a handful of people are on governement benifits and they vote over-whealmingly for the Democrats.  I know, my house is surrounded by housing projects, as I told you when we spoke on the phone.

[○∙◄☻¥tπ[╪AV┼cVê└]

Who are these lazy Red staters?  Minorities?  Most of the White trash I know are hard-core Democrat voters anyway who live in districts that have Democrat congressmen, like John Murtha, Bob Byrd, etc.

Whoa!  White trash as hardcore Democrats?  Hehe, in Northeast Philadelphia it's the Republicans that foam at the mouth over John Street and are scared to death of an African American moving on their block.  Are they white trash?  Well, some of them yes.  They are highly critical over Section 8 yet don't care for their own properties.  They say things like "Affirmative Action has hurt me" or "The stupid liberal elitists are taking my money."  Interesting what are cross-section we have here soulty.

Do they work?  Do they try to take care of their families?  If they do then they aren't trash.  You say that they are against Section 8.  I assume, therefore, that they don't get anything out of it, which drives to the heart of what we are talking about.  Sure, the money goes there, but who does it go too?

Wait...

Forgot this part...

Where I am from, there is no minority vs white divide.  Therefore, the main battle is between those on government programs and those who are not.  I come from the Dark Blue area of PA, so you can guess that only a handful of people are on governement benifits and they vote over-whealmingly for the Democrats.  I know, my house is surrounded by housing projects, as I told you when we spoke on the phone.

There's plenty of welfare for various rural interests. Don't tell me that the only type of welfare is for black single mothers living in the Bronx.

[Mikem]

So tax rich people to pay poor ones, but keep rich money in rich states, unless they are blue. 

Wealth distribution, make up your minds democrats.  You cant have it both ways.  You are all for helping poor people, unless they vote for Bush, in which case, give us our money back!!!

The federal government does not take into account cost of living. You aren't really richer if you make $15,000 in SF vs. $14,000 in North Dakota.

What does cost of living have to do with what I said at all...

I am talking about a philisophical dichotomy.

You are saying (democrats), we need to tax rich people because they make too much money and we need to give it to poor people.  BUT it is wrong to take from rich states and give to poor states.  So it is ok when we are stealing money from a rich republican miser, and giving to a welfare mother, but not if we take it from the wealthy state of New York to pay for poor white people in the rural Tennesee.  Totally hypocritical.

Rich people should keep their money as long as they dont vote for Bush, in which case they should give it to poor democrats.  That is what you are saying. 

Also I have a feeling that a lot of the people and corporations actually making the vast sum of the money in those blue states, although small in numbers, are Republicans.  Wall street has had a track record of liking a red whitehouse, as have large corporations, where most of the money is made.  Unfortunatley, since these people are located in vast urban areas, their votes are outnumbered 10:1 by the poor depressed city-folk, making the state blue.  I dont know about new york, but this is the case as I have observed it in Chicago.  Most rich people live outside the city, they produce much of the economic benefit, but they are only a small portion of the population, so their votes are lost in the wind.

[12th Doctor]

Who are these lazy Red staters?  Minorities?  Most of the White trash I know are hard-core Democrat voters anyway who live in districts that have Democrat congressmen, like John Murtha, Bob Byrd, etc.

Whoa!  White trash as hardcore Democrats?  Hehe, in Northeast Philadelphia it's the Republicans that foam at the mouth over John Street and are scared to death of an African American moving on their block.  Are they white trash?  Well, some of them yes.  They are highly critical over Section 8 yet don't care for their own properties.  They say things like "Affirmative Action has hurt me" or "The stupid liberal elitists are taking my money."  Interesting what are cross-section we have here soulty.

Do they work?  Do they try to take care of their families?  If they do then they aren't trash.  You say that they are against Section 8.  I assume, therefore, that they don't get anything out of it, which drives to the heart of what we are talking about.  Sure, the money goes there, but who does it go too?

Wait...

Forgot this part...

Where I am from, there is no minority vs white divide.  Therefore, the main battle is between those on government programs and those who are not.  I come from the Dark Blue area of PA, so you can guess that only a handful of people are on governement benifits and they vote over-whealmingly for the Democrats.  I know, my house is surrounded by housing projects, as I told you when we spoke on the phone.

There's plenty of welfare for various rural interests. Don't tell me that the only type of welfare is for black single mothers living in the Bronx.

Are you even trying to listen to me?  Are you just doing this to piss me off?  Read, what I said dammit.

[??????????]

JFRAUD,

Who closed the military bases in the north? I remember them mostly being closed from 94-98. Who was in charge then? And if you are against tax redistribution are you for cutting social programs and cutting taxes? Are you really sure you should be wearing a red avatar?

[○∙◄☻¥tπ[╪AV┼cVê└]

JFRAUD,

Who closed the military bases in the north? I remember them mostly being closed from 94-98. Who was in charge then? And if you are against tax redistribution are you for cutting social programs and cutting taxes? Are you really sure you should be wearing a red avatar?

Someone named StatesRights is telling me it's ok that the Kerry states are forced to give $200 billion a year to the Bush states?

The irony.

[J. J.]

JFRAUD,

Who closed the military bases in the north? I remember them mostly being closed from 94-98. Who was in charge then? And if you are against tax redistribution are you for cutting social programs and cutting taxes? Are you really sure you should be wearing a red avatar?

Someone named StatesRights is telling me it's ok that the Kerry states are forced to give $200 billion a year to the Bush states?

The irony.

Jfraud, what he IS is that most of the Bush states have military bases, where guess what, the government spends a lot of money, are in Bush states.

[Filuwaúrdjan]

In West Virginia, it goes to environmental efforts and to helping families of Mine workers.  Blame Bob Byrd for that.

The word is "Praise" not "Blame"

[12th Doctor]

In West Virginia, it goes to environmental efforts and to helping families of Mine workers.  Blame Bob Byrd for that.

The word is "Praise" not "Blame"

I'm using his words Al, not mine.

[Filuwaúrdjan]

In West Virginia, it goes to environmental efforts and to helping families of Mine workers.  Blame Bob Byrd for that.

The word is "Praise" not "Blame"

I'm using his words Al, not mine.

Well he's a heartless jerk then

[Democratic Hawk]

The Kerry states send more money to the feds than they get back. The Bush states are welfare states. Something on the order of $200 billion a year is transfered.

Bush won 13 of the biggest 14 welfare states.
Kerry won 12 of the 14 most screwed states.

http://www.taxfoundation.org/taxingspending.html

Do the "blue" states tend to have a higher per capita GDP than "red" states? I know states like Connecticut are wealthy and states like Mississippi are, comparatively, poor

Dave

[??????????]

JFRAUD,

Who closed the military bases in the north? I remember them mostly being closed from 94-98. Who was in charge then? And if you are against tax redistribution are you for cutting social programs and cutting taxes? Are you really sure you should be wearing a red avatar?

Someone named StatesRights is telling me it's ok that the Kerry states are forced to give $200 billion a year to the Bush states?

The irony.

JFraud

No, I'm not saying its "ok". I am against the regressive Income tax system we currently have. But I bet you wouldn't stand against repealing or giving a major overhaul to the Mafia IRS.

[Keystone Phil]

Who are these lazy Red staters?  Minorities?  Most of the White trash I know are hard-core Democrat voters anyway who live in districts that have Democrat congressmen, like John Murtha, Bob Byrd, etc.

Whoa!  White trash as hardcore Democrats?  Hehe, in Northeast Philadelphia it's the Republicans that foam at the mouth over John Street and are scared to death of an African American moving on their block.  Are they white trash? 

Whoa! Wait one minute...you just described many NE Philly Dems right there. I'm not on this board saying who's white trash and who isn't but I will point out that what you posted pertains to a good amout of Dems up here, IrishDem.