Spineless French government ignores insolent Muslim provocation

[GMantis]

http://www.limitstogrowth.org/articles/2010/09/01/muslim-bullying-paralyzes-paris/
And I thought that France actually wanted to get tough with Muslims...

[dead0man]

Terrorism works!

[Insula Dei]

1.I'm not saying the site you linked is biased, ... but it's named 'limitstogrowth.com', and the article right before this one is called 'pedophilia isn't condemned in Afghanistan' and the one right after it is about mexican drug cartels in Arizona.

2.Yeah, those French are so weak and really seem to give in to all the unreasonable immigrants. Like, everyone knows Sarkozy was handpicked by some mullahs in Tora Bora to succeed Jacques 'Mohammed' Chirac.

[Keystone Phil]

GMantis is posting a link to a Pat Robertson video? Well, this issue sure does make strange bedfellows...

[Insula Dei]

GMantis is posting a link to a Pat Robertson video? Well, this issue sure does make strange bedfellows...

GMantis is typically bulgarian on these sort of issues. If you're surprised by this, that only goes to show you've never looked past his avatar.

[Keystone Phil]

GMantis is posting a link to a Pat Robertson video? Well, this issue sure does make strange bedfellows...

GMantis is typically bulgarian on these sort of issues. If you're surprised by this, that only goes to show you've never looked past his avatar.

...

I've had plenty of arguments with GMantis. I guess I'm just not too familiar with the "Bulgarian position" on Muslim immigrants. 

[dead0man]

Aye, me and the Mantis don't agree on much, but both of us dislike asshat terrorists, the pansies that roll over for them and the douchebags that make excuses for them.  More power to the Frenchies with the balls to go into the street eating pork and drinking wine during these acts of civil disobedience!

[Insula Dei]

Aye, me and the Mantis don't agree on much, but both of us dislike asshat terrorists, the pansies that roll over for them and the douchebags that make excuses for them.  More power to the Frenchies with the balls to go into the street eating pork and drinking wine during these acts of civil disobedience!

Oh, the things they are willing to risk when they go out and drink wine in eat pork in France! When I think about the number of bomb atttacks by radical muslims in Paris this month alone, my hearth grows cold with fear. It's clear that we in Europe should all convert to islam or face the gruesome consequences.

Seriously people, why is it American evangelicals can get away with much more severe stuff (yeah, telling someone they don't have the right to marry, to do with their bodies as they please, that their lifestyle makes them disgusting,... ranks above whatever you guys think the muslim menace is forcing on us) and never get named 'terrorists'?

[dead0man]

Seriously people, why is it American evangelicals can get away with much more severe stuff (yeah, telling someone they don't have the right to marry, to do with their bodies as they please, that their lifestyle makes them disgusting,... ranks above whatever you guys think the muslim menace is forcing on us) and never get named 'terrorists'?

When have American evangelicals (who I don't like by the way) blown up a plane killing 270?  Or put bombs on trains killing 191?  Or buses killing 52? Or the many other plots that were thankfully found out?  Or killed a guy for making a movie they didn't agree with?  And that's not mentioning the horrible things done in Russia.  Maybe you remember part of your metro getting blown up back in 1995?

Yes, killing the occasional abortion doctor or nurse is a horrible act and the murderers are certainly terrorists.  Yes, the things Christian Fundies say about gay people here in the US are quite horrible and wrong.  But they pale in comparison....hell, it's not even close and it's kind of sad this needs to be repeatedly pointed out....there is no comparison to what Muslim Fundies have done in Europe.  I'm not sure why you have a hard time seeing this.

[Keystone Phil]

to do with their bodies as they please

Ah, yes, more of that simplistic thinking from the "enlightened" area of the world...

[Insula Dei]

Seriously people, why is it American evangelicals can get away with much more severe stuff (yeah, telling someone they don't have the right to marry, to do with their bodies as they please, that their lifestyle makes them disgusting,... ranks above whatever you guys think the muslim menace is forcing on us) and never get named 'terrorists'?

When have American evangelicals (who I don't like by the way) blown up a plane killing 270?  Or put bombs on trains killing 191?  Or buses killing 52? Or the many other plots that were thankfully found out?  Or killed a guy for making a movie they didn't agree with?  And that's not mentioning the horrible things done in Russia.  Maybe you remember part of your metro getting blown up back in 1995?

Yes, killing the occasional abortion doctor or nurse is a horrible act and the murderers are certainly terrorists.  Yes, the things Christian Fundies say about gay people here in the US are quite horrible and wrong.  But they pale in comparison....hell, it's not even close and it's kind of sad this needs to be repeatedly pointed out....there is no comparison to what Muslim Fundies have done in Europe.  I'm not sure why you have a hard time seeing this.

You still seem to miss the point that the European Muslim population has zero impact on the policies of the Euopean Nations. I don't know what you imagine is going on but it for sure is no muslim take-over of Western Europe. The idea that they have is ridiculous and uninformed. It's no coincidence that the only ones here argueign that they have are a Eastern-European and 2 americans wh very clearly have never been near Paris or Amsterdam. The concept's on a par with argueing that the Manhattan Mosque is evidence of the fact that the NY legislature has been intimitated into doing as muslims want because of 9/11. If anything muslims now are a minority under attack in most of Western Europe. The atmosphere in many capitals is comparable to the 'sensible anti-semitism' that many mainstream European politicians defended in the '30s. Links like the one that started this nonsense are a symptom of a xenophobic new standard of Political correctness where everything muslims do must be connected to their evil religion.

[dead0man]

I don't think the Muslim Fundies are "taking over western Europe"....at least not under some collective conscious or any time soon.  I'm saying you often let them get away with sh**t you wouldn't let them get away with if you weren't afraid they were going to blow yet another place or thing up if you tried to stop them.  Like stopping traffic for their prayers or torching cars for sport.  I'm saying turning a blind eye to their violence and threats of violence isn't doing anyone any favors.

And it's not really fair to compare the very real Muslim issues of today with the very made up Jewish problem of the past.  Unless Jews were killing thousands of Euros and the dirty Jew controlled media has managed to bury those facts from the prying eyes of history.

[Insula Dei]

And it's not really fair to compare the very real Muslim issues of today with the very made up Jewish problem of the past.  Unless Jews were killing thousands of Euros and the dirty Jew controlled media has managed to bury those facts from the prying eyes of history.

Don't you know that the jews caused WWI? The only reason they got away with that was because the German elite was afraid to die in the trenches.

[Franzl]

Muslims in Western Europe are a poor minority under attack? Haha

[dead0man]

And it's not really fair to compare the very real Muslim issues of today with the very made up Jewish problem of the past.  Unless Jews were killing thousands of Euros and the dirty Jew controlled media has managed to bury those facts from the prying eyes of history.

Don't you know that the jews caused WWI? The only reason they got away with that was because the German elite was afraid to die in the trenches.

I don't know if it's sad or funny, but I have no idea if you are kidding or not.  I hope you are, but I fear you are not.

[Filuwaúrdjan]

He's obviously being sarcastic.

Muslims in Western Europe are a poor minority under attack? Haha

Well most Muslim communities are certainly poor, at least by the standards of Western Europe. That's basically an objective fact. And they do face a considerable amount of discrimination and have done for decades, though the reasons for that have shifted from standard racism to a more complicated form of othering.

[minionofmidas]

I don't know if it's sad or funny, but I have no idea if you are kidding or not.  I hope you are, but I fear you are not.

You have very well described my response to your, Franzl's, gmantis', or almost the entirety of the western european yellow press' attitude. Thank you.

[ag]

Muslims in Western Europe are a poor minority under attack? Haha

You live in Germany? Isn't Nazi propaganda banned there?

[ag]

GMantis is posting a link to a Pat Robertson video? Well, this issue sure does make strange bedfellows...

GMantis is typically bulgarian on these sort of issues. If you're surprised by this, that only goes to show you've never looked past his avatar.

...

I've had plenty of arguments with GMantis. I guess I'm just not too familiar with the "Bulgarian position" on Muslim immigrants. 

It's not just on Muslim migrants, it's on Muslims (Muslims in Bulgaria aren't migrants). The old Zhivkovian anti-Muslim canard.

[Insula Dei]

And it's not really fair to compare the very real Muslim issues of today with the very made up Jewish problem of the past.  Unless Jews were killing thousands of Euros and the dirty Jew controlled media has managed to bury those facts from the prying eyes of history.

Don't you know that the jews caused WWI? The only reason they got away with that was because the German elite was afraid to die in the trenches.

I don't know if it's sad or funny, but I have no idea if you are kidding or not.  I hope you are, but I fear you are not.

I hope that that's just you being slightly hyperbolic and that you were in fact able to see the sarcasm.

[Gustaf]

I basically disagree with everything posted so far. That doesn't usually happen with such a long thread.

[GMantis]

GMantis is posting a link to a Pat Robertson video? Well, this issue sure does make strange bedfellows...

Actually, I didn't know this was Pat Robertson. I don't agree with him, to put it mildly, but I still would have posted it if I knew it was him, as he wasn't the one who made the report about this.

GMantis is typically Bulgarian on these sort of issues. If you're surprised by this, that only goes to show you've never looked past his avatar.

That is true, most other Bulgarians would agree with me. First, because being ruled by Muslims for centuries doesn't exactly leave predispose to tolerance of such behavior and secondly, certain minorities are doing the same thing here.
By the way, before sneering too much on the Bulgarian attitude, the general attitude in Europe is also moving in this direction and will move even faster with behavior like this. Also, Bulgarians have managed to live mostly peacefully with our Muslims, which are much larger part of the population than in most European countries, for much longer than most of those countries had a Muslim population.

I've had plenty of arguments with GMantis. I guess I'm just not too familiar with the "Bulgarian position" on Muslim immigrants. 

There's not much Muslim immigration here, but the attitude to the Muslim immigration in Western Europe is, approximately: "How can they be such fools?!" So not different from the attitude of the American conservatives

You still seem to miss the point that the European Muslim population has zero impact on the policies of the Euopean Nations. I don't know what you imagine is going on but it for sure is no muslim take-over of Western Europe. The idea that they have is ridiculous and uninformed. It's no coincidence that the only ones here argueign that they have are a Eastern-European and 2 americans wh very clearly have never been near Paris or Amsterdam. The concept's on a par with argueing that the Manhattan Mosque is evidence of the fact that the NY legislature has been intimitated into doing as muslims want because of 9/11. If anything muslims now are a minority under attack in most of Western Europe. The atmosphere in many capitals is comparable to the 'sensible anti-semitism' that many mainstream European politicians defended in the '30s. Links like the one that started this nonsense are a symptom of a xenophobic new standard of Political correctness where everything muslims do must be connected to their evil religion.

The statement about the zero impact of Muslims is ridiculous, even if you discount the electoral districts where politicians have to court the Muslim vote. The fact that the relationship between the European countries and their Muslim population is now a constant object of political issues certainly indicates a rather significant influence on policy.
I disagree with the idea that Muslims are under attack in Western Europe. In fact, they are very privileged by World standards. Incidentally, I've lived in Germany and England for several years and my impression is that the government of those countries, at least, go out of the way to make Muslims feel welcome. And as this video shows, France is not that different.

Well most Muslim communities are certainly poor, at least by the standards of Western Europe. That's basically an objective fact. And they do face a considerable amount of discrimination and have done for decades, though the reasons for that have shifted from standard racism to a more complicated form of othering.

Yes, they've certainly been suffering a lot of positive discrimination

You have very well described my response to your, Franzl's, gmantis', or almost the entirety of the western european yellow press' attitude. Thank you.

Frankly, from someone like you I would expect a better argument. Or any argument.

It's not just on Muslim migrants, it's on Muslims (Muslims in Bulgaria aren't migrants). The old Zhivkovian anti-Muslim canard.

There is a significant difference between disapproving of the blatant violation of laws by Muslims and supporting the cruel treatment of a peaceful Muslim minority, done for idiotic reasons.

[minionofmidas]

Some stuff makes me too sick to develop a long argument.

[GMantis]

I basically disagree with everything posted so far. That doesn't usually happen with such a long thread.

You managed to disagree both with the argument that Muslims are a persecuted minority and with the argument that they are allowed to get away with too much? That would probably makes you anti-Muslim by Swedish standards, doesn't it ?

[GMantis]

Some stuff makes me too sick to develop a long argument.

Too bad that this makes you seem like you have no arguments