The Wisconsin Cheese Showdown

[Grumpier Than Uncle Joe]

Got my layoff notice today.

[Nichlemn]

There is plenty of public choice literature about the phenomenon of rent-seeking.

There's public choice writings on almost everything, but most of us choose not to take that lunacy seriously.

Nice argument.

You must be logged in to read this quote.

That's their purpose, yes. That doesn't say anything about whether they are "needed" or "good". After all, a cartel can be formed for similar purposes and I bet you don't approve of cartels. The reason I distinguish between private and public unions is that the government is generally seen as a much stronger force for social justice than business, presumably making it more likely that they will compensate "fairly" irrespective of union status.

[Filuwaúrdjan]

There is plenty of public choice literature about the phenomenon of rent-seeking.

There's public choice writings on almost everything, but most of us choose not to take that lunacy seriously.

Nice argument.

I would write similar things about (for example), post-modernism, woolly leftish theories of all kinds, the cruder kinds of 'Marxism', most contemporary sociological theories and all forms of evolutionary reductionist bollocks. And have, actually.

You must be logged in to read this quote.

What do you mean by 'needed' and what do you mean by 'good'? As a Socialist, I would argue that they are a good thing for the workforce and are thus 'needed'. People with different views might disagree.

You must be logged in to read this quote.

It's not just a matter of 'compensation', but in any case experience would tend to disagree with your assertion, at least up to a point. Public sector concerns are inevitably large and bureaucratic (not a criticism as it isn't possible to run certain things in any other way) making negotiation between an individual worker and management a joke.

[opebo]

The reason I distinguish between private and public unions is that the government is generally seen as a much stronger force for social justice than business, presumably making it more likely that they will compensate "fairly" irrespective of union status.

That may be the general belief, but obviously 'business' can only be as oppressive as the State empowers it to be - the whole public/private dichotomy is a false one.  In a capitalist system, to expect the state to for some reason to be less rapacious than its clients is a pipe dream.

[Badger]

Got my layoff notice today.

[TheDeadFlagBlues]

Good news for Ohioans (from PPP):

Do you approve or disapprove of John Kasich's job performance?
Approve 35%
Disapprove 54%
Not sure 11%

More results here (http://www.publicpolicypolling.com/pdf/PPP_Release_OH_0315513.pdf )showing doomsday news for Republicans. Lesson: don't mess with unions in states with a big working class/union tradition.

[Lief 🗽]

Wow. That's worse than Walker.

[opebo]

ore results here (http://www.publicpolicypolling.com/pdf/PPP_Release_OH_0315513.pdf )showing doomsday news for Republicans. Lesson: don't mess with unions in states with a big working class/union tradition.

Could you post some of these results or another non-pdf link?  I can't open pdfs on the computer I'm using.

[Dgov]

Wow. That's worse than Walker.

Which is why it doesn't pass the smell test for me.  Numbers that bad basically require you to have a significant portion of your base abandon you, and i don't really buy that.

[Smash255]

Wow. That's worse than Walker.

Which is why it doesn't pass the smell test for me.  Numbers that bad basically require you to have a significant portion of your base abandon you, and i don't really buy that.

It is a few weeks later than the Walker poll.  I would think at this point Walker's #'s have dropped from where they were then.

The party breakout of the poll was the same as the 08 exit polls (Dems +8) as opposed to the midterms which was even, so that may explain a bit.

[Lief 🗽]

This should help Sherrod Brown's chances. He's exactly the type of candidate to benefit from a populist, pro-union backlash.

[krazen1211]

Wow. That's worse than Walker.

Which is why it doesn't pass the smell test for me.  Numbers that bad basically require you to have a significant portion of your base abandon you, and i don't really buy that.

The poll has a very large sample of Democrats and liberals far beyond the actual Ohio electorate, especially in a midterm year.

[Landslide Lyndon]

Wow. That's worse than Walker.

Which is why it doesn't pass the smell test for me.  Numbers that bad basically require you to have a significant portion of your base abandon you, and i don't really buy that.

It is a few weeks later than the Walker poll.  I would think at this point Walker's #'s have dropped from where they were then.

The party breakout of the poll was the same as the 08 exit polls (Dems +8) as opposed to the midterms which was even, so that may explain a bit.

Even with 2010 numbers, Kasich must have a "healthy" -10 approval.

[they don't love you like i love you]

Just breaking that a judge has blocked the law.

[Brittain33]

I suppose it's the open meetings provision? The Senate will pass it again under proper rules, but that keeps it in the news even longer, which is only good news for the recalls.

[Grumpier Than Uncle Joe]

Most likely open meeting provisions, b33, but the pubs knew that anyway....the drama of doing it like they did served their purpose, but as you note....they'll just pass it again anyway.  I bet some of the pubs view the extra drama it as good news, in spite of any potential recall petitions.

[Landslide Lyndon]

Most likely open meeting provisions, b33, but the pubs knew that anyway....the drama of doing it like they did served their purpose, but as you note....they'll just pass it again anyway.  I bet some of the pubs view the extra drama it as good news, in spite of any potential recall petitions.

Huh? Being in the news about breaking the rules while passing an unpopular bill is somehow beneficial for Republicans? I doubt even Walker himself wouldn't spin it like that.

http://tpmdc.talkingpointsmemo.com/2011/03/judge-blocks-wisconsins-union-busting-bill-on-procedural-grounds.php

A state judge in Wisconsin has just issued a temporary restraining order blocking Gov. Scott Walker's (R-WI) newly-passed law curtailing public employee unions, on the grounds that the GOP-controlled legislature appeared to have violated state public notice requirements when quickly passing the bill last week.

"It seems to me the public policy behind effective enforcement of the open meeting law is so strong that it does outweigh the interest, at least at this time, which may exist in favor of sustaining the validity of the (law)," wrote Judge Maryann Sumi, the Milwaukee Journal Sentinel reports.

A key thing to note here is that this is a procedural objection, and not a constitutional finding based on the content of the law itself. As such, even if the bill's opponents secure a permanent injunction in further litigation -- and then prevail in any appeals to higher courts -- the Republican-controlled could still theoretically get together and pass the bill again.

But of course, that would involve having the legislature convene again, protesters swarming the Capitol again, and a very tough vote occurring in a rerun. Even if the Republicans were willing to do that, it would only give further political fuel to the Dems.

[Grumpier Than Uncle Joe]

Most likely open meeting provisions, b33, but the pubs knew that anyway....the drama of doing it like they did served their purpose, but as you note....they'll just pass it again anyway.  I bet some of the pubs view the extra drama it as good news, in spite of any potential recall petitions.

Huh? Being in the news about breaking the rules while passing an unpopular bill is somehow beneficial for Republicans? I doubt even Walker himself wouldn't spin it like that.

The pubs knew exactly what was going to happen by doing this in the middle of the night.....so why did they do it if all it could do was hurt them?

[Brittain33]

The pubs knew exactly what was going to happen by doing this in the middle of the night.....so why did they do it if all it could do was hurt them?

I wonder. I don't think the senators counted on this happening, I really don't.

[Landslide Lyndon]

Most likely open meeting provisions, b33, but the pubs knew that anyway....the drama of doing it like they did served their purpose, but as you note....they'll just pass it again anyway.  I bet some of the pubs view the extra drama it as good news, in spite of any potential recall petitions.

Huh? Being in the news about breaking the rules while passing an unpopular bill is somehow beneficial for Republicans? I doubt even Walker himself wouldn't spin it like that.

The pubs knew exactly what was going to happen by doing this in the middle of the night.....so why did they do it if all it could do was hurt them?

Because they panicked? Certainly they didn't expect to become a national spectacle and having as their leader a certified moron like Walker didn't help their cause.

[The Dowager Mod]

Most likely open meeting provisions, b33, but the pubs knew that anyway....the drama of doing it like they did served their purpose, but as you note....they'll just pass it again anyway.  I bet some of the pubs view the extra drama it as good news, in spite of any potential recall petitions.

Huh? Being in the news about breaking the rules while passing an unpopular bill is somehow beneficial for Republicans? I doubt even Walker himself wouldn't spin it like that.

The pubs knew exactly what was going to happen by doing this in the middle of the night.....so why did they do it if all it could do was hurt them?

They were desperate.

[The Dowager Mod]

We have more than enough signatures to recall Kapanke from La Crosse and we are very close with Darling from River Hills.

[Capitan Zapp Brannigan]

Have they gotten enough for Hopper yet?

Either way, great news for the recall efforts. It will be interesting to see if any of the Dem senators get recalled.

Who do you think will win the Supreme Court election TexasGurl?

[The Dowager Mod]

Kloppenburg in a close one.

[Grumpier Than Uncle Joe]

Meritorious, TG, but will it stop the law from taking effect or being overturned?