2012 NDP leadership convention

[Holmes]

Run from the center and bring people to the right is what the Conservatives have been doing, and it has succeeded. Even if they screw up their mandate (as they seem to have been doing, little by little), they'll have had >4 years to do whatever they want.

[Peter the Lefty]

Run from the center and bring people to the right is what the Conservatives have been doing, and it has succeeded. Even if they screw up their mandate (as they seem to have been doing, little by little), they'll have had >4 years to do whatever they want.

Yes, but Mulcair has me afraid that he'll run from the center/center-left and govern from the center/center- right, as Blair did, and it's obvious that he wants to emulate Blair's thinking even though he may try to deny it.  I do wish Nash were a bit more charismatic and maybe even a bit more moderate (for electability purposes), but she's the best of them in my opinion.  Cullen is also great, and if only he would drop his whole Liberal/Green joint-nomination co-operation idea, then he would be my #1 candidate, but looking at his website, it's clear that it's one of the main center-pieces of his platform, so I doubt he'd drop it. 

[Hatman 🍁]

If Mulcair tried to emulate Blair, there would be an inquisition, and he'd be toast in the party.

[RogueBeaver]

Have fun guys: Dumont will moderate your Sunday debate.

http://fr.canoe.ca/infos/quebeccanada/archives/2012/03/20120301-060651.html

[RogueBeaver]

Tell me there isn't an ABM movement. No way in hell would he have ever accepted anything from us, or the Grits for that matter. (Though the latter had more to do with a poisonous relationship between he and Dion)

http://www.thestar.com/news/canada/politics/article/1139549--tim-harper-did-money-or-principle-drive-thomas-mulcair-from-the-conservative-fold

[Hatman 🍁]

Have fun guys: Dumont will moderate your Sunday debate.

http://fr.canoe.ca/infos/quebeccanada/archives/2012/03/20120301-060651.html

What?

[Holmes]

Quoi?

[lilTommy]

Have fun guys: Dumont will moderate your Sunday debate.

http://fr.canoe.ca/infos/quebeccanada/archives/2012/03/20120301-060651.html

What?

Well wasn't that a surprise... i can see the logic Chantal Vallerand has put out there, plus if the party had chosen a more sovereigntist moderator well theres some fodder for the Tories. And looks like its working at getting attention stired up for one of the last (wait last?) debates. Hes suppose to be neutral and impartial and so far i have been impressed with all the moderators at that and at forcing the candidates to give up more details and be more concrete.

[MaxQue]

¿Qué?

Seriously, the article is saying than they chose him as he is high-profile and can raise attention in Québec. As much we dislike him, he a very intelligent and educated man.

[Хahar 🤔]

Couldn't they get someone from Radio-Canada or something?

[RogueBeaver]

All I can say is that the candidates better be prepared for some aggressive questioning.

[Peter the Lefty]

There's now a website made by an anonymous group called the "Progressive New Democrats" called "Know Mulcair."  It does point out some very good points, but they are a bit clueless on the whole political scenario in Quebec.  They do raise some good points, though.  He may have resigned as Environment Minister on principle over the whole privatization of public conservation lands thing, but that begs the question of why he didn't resign on principle over:
A. The Charest government's denial of child and disability care workers the right to strike with Bills 7 and 8, which declared them not to be employees but "independent entrepreneurs."  They were passed by the provincial government (meaning, logically, that Mulcair must have voted for them)
B. The government's imposition of wage freezes on its public servants, in violation of their collective bargaining rights, through it's passage of Bill 43 (meaning, again, that Mulcair must have voted for it.)
C. Its moves to cut $103 million from post-secondary education financial aid, which it only gave up on after weeks of protests and strikes.
D. Its modification of the Quebec Labour code to allow the contracting-out of public sector jobs by removing the requirement of the employer to recognize the employee's union and maintain the salaries and work conditions of any affected workers.  

It also points out that he has publicly equated anti-Zionism with anti-Semitism via a link commenting on his "ardent supporter of Israel in all situations and all circumstances" quote.  He also opposes any sanctions against Israel, and managed to dampen down the NDP's criticism of Operation Cast Lead.  Makes it hard to think that it isn't just about his riding's heavy Jewish population, but it becomes clear that he really believes it.  He also hasn't ever donated to the party, as it points out, even though he donated to the QLP before resigning.  

And the rumors about his flirtation with joining the federal Torries are also heating up again.  He claims he rejected their invitation because of their stand on the environment, particularly Kyoto (hmmm...nothing about their corporate giveaways, their cuts to arts and culture, social programs, or, idk, just their CONSERVATIVE, RIGHT-WING IDEOLOGY.)  Sources close to the talks say that Kyoto wasn't mentioned (though their reliability is questionable.)  They say it was because he was he wanted a cabinet seat, and a $150,000 salary.  Keep in mind, it's probably just the Conservatives trying to smear him because they're afraid of him, but it makes you wonder...why would he negotiate with them in the first place?  Why would he even consider joining them, let alone negotiate with them over joining (he does openly mention a particular moment in the talks when a senior Conservative brought up his support for Kyoto, in an article about it.)  He did acknowledge that he talked to them (and the Liberals and Greens).  

Please, New Democrats, this man is a neoliberal slimebucket who will make the NDP no different from New Labour, the Schröderite SPD, or worse, modern day PASOK.  Don't vote for him.  He has done two things "on principle:" resign from the Charest government over the privatization thing, and pull out of the Conservative negotiations over Kyoto (if his side of the story is correct.)  This would mean that he only acts on principle on environmental matters, and is not committed to the NDP's other values.  

[RogueBeaver]

You didn't read what Hatman said?

[Peter the Lefty]

You didn't read what Hatman said?

I did.  But wouldn't it hurt the party's image?  They shouldn't have to go through the whole process of it, getting into power and back-stabbing their leader.  (I meant to post this with that).  Sorry for the way I ranted before, I kinda lost it there lol.  Just...the leader of a party should subscribe to the party's ideology, and not have to conform to it in order to keep the party's leadership. 

[RogueBeaver]

None of those things you mention will hurt him in a general election. Most likely they won't prevent him from being elected 3 weeks from tomorrow.

[Peter the Lefty]

None of those things you mention will hurt him in a general election. Most likely they won't prevent him from being elected 3 weeks from tomorrow.

I hope they do.  If the NDP still has any commitment to labour rights, they should.  I'm amazed that so many labour figures have endorsed him. 

[RogueBeaver]

Maybe they're being pragmatic. Of course the NDP's still committed to labour rights, don't be ridiculous.

[RogueBeaver]

Dewar profile. Linguistic issues and Quebec judgment aside, I don't think he has the killer instinct. An absolute necessity when facing off against Harper. Do any of the Dippers here concur about Dewar's alleged "poor communications skills?" I don't know enough about him to make my own judgment.

http://www.thestar.com/news/canada/politics/article/1140244--ndp-leadership-ottawa-mp-paul-dewar-learned-politics-from-being-a-teacher

Dewar interview.

http://www2.macleans.ca/2012/03/02/qa-paul-dewar/

[Hatman 🍁]

This race would be a lot like the Republican Primaries if it had the same format. I can see Mulcair being the Romney type - the moderate frontrunner, while the others jockey around as flavours of the month, as negative ads keep attacking the last one. Perhaps first with Topp, and then Dewar, and perhaps Nash?

[RogueBeaver]

This race would be a lot like the Republican Primaries if it had the same format. I can see Mulcair being the Romney type - the moderate frontrunner, while the others jockey around as flavours of the month, as negative ads keep attacking the last one. Perhaps first with Topp, and then Dewar, and perhaps Nash?

Agreed. What's your take on the Dewar stuff I posted?

[Hatman 🍁]

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Geez. It's not often that I can understand every single word of a paragraph in French. That can't be good for Paul, can it?

If it wasn't for his lack of French, Paul would be a great candidate. I'm tempted to keep him in my #2 spot.

[RogueBeaver]

That's the French equivalent of Dion's English. Harper's is the baseline.

[Hatman 🍁]

That's the French equivalent of Dion's English. Harper's is the baseline.

I can usually understand most of what Harper says in French. That's why I know it's bad.

[DL]

None of those things you mention will hurt him in a general election. Most likely they won't prevent him from being elected 3 weeks from tomorrow.

I hope they do.  If the NDP still has any commitment to labour rights, they should.  I'm amazed that so many labour figures have endorsed him. 

Mulcair announced more labour support today and also unveiled his labour policies and they strike me as being very progressive and pro-labour and have all sorts of provisions for banning replacement workers and making it easier for peoiple to join unions. What's not to like?

[MaxQue]

None of those things you mention will hurt him in a general election. Most likely they won't prevent him from being elected 3 weeks from tomorrow.

I hope they do.  If the NDP still has any commitment to labour rights, they should.  I'm amazed that so many labour figures have endorsed him. 

I see than Topp smearing machin is well-oiled.
I refuse to let Topp destroy the party by creating division for its own partisan gain.