The Odyssey of Revolution and Democracy in France (user search)
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  The Odyssey of Revolution and Democracy in France (search mode)
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Author Topic: The Odyssey of Revolution and Democracy in France  (Read 4251 times)
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Hashemite
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« on: December 15, 2011, 12:44:11 PM »

I think I'll echo what Fab said, with the exception that perceiving "rural France" as some uniform entity as deeply conservative (which is not what Fab meant, I'm sure) is wrong: the Montagnard vote in 1849 was quite rural, the biggest opposition to the 1851 coup came from rural areas, there were plenty of 'radical' rural areas (though perhaps not 'radical' in a Marxist sense).

My other main point when I read this paper is that I did not really have a feel in your introduction of sorts what your thesis was, and it only became clearer in the last paragraph(s). One thing which came to my head when reading it and which Fab pointed out well is this:

France has had a problem to adopt real democracy, even when it adopted a republican form of power, even when it ruled a Declaration of Human Rights (from the top and practically used against "the enemies of Liberty", whereas it was a theoretically perfect text).
Philippe Auguste, Louis XI, Louis XIV still live in a way in our political system and ideas since the French Revolution...

In a way, after 1750, France said it changed fundamentally its regime, whereas it only modified the formal way its power is organized...

There is an inherent contradiction in a country which prides itself in chopping the head of a monarch but continues to exercise deference in reference to powerful figures: nobility are still often referred to with their title (Monsieur le Comte, Monsieur le Vicomte etc), there is deep respect in conservative milieus of authority figures to the point where it is ridiculous (some people we knew were all up in arms when we referred to "Mr. Chirac" as "Jacques" or even "Chirac").
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Hashemite
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« Reply #1 on: December 19, 2011, 10:27:23 AM »

the biggest opposition to the 1851 coup came from rural areas, there were plenty of 'radical' rural areas (though perhaps not 'radical' in a Marxist sense).

Could you elaborate on that, Hash? I'm interested to know about it.
My excuse for treating France as a homogenous whole: the class I'm taking is very Paris-centric.  A weak statement, sure, but I have to work within the intellectual confines of the readings and perspectives provided me. Tongue 

On what part?

A lot of the resistance to the December 2, 1851 was concentrated in rural areas such as the Basses-Alpes, Hautes-Alpes, Diois, Baronnies, parts of Allier, the Var, parts of the SW (Gers) and parts of the Languedoc (Beziers). Opposition in urban areas was quickly crushed and not as significant. The only canton to vote No in the plebiscite was Vernoux, which was a rural Protestant canton in the Ardeche.

As for radical (non-Marxist) area, a lot of the places of small property but also places like the Var, Drome, Herault, Limousin, Allier, Cher, Indre and so forth. The map of the 1849 elections is a pretty good guide to rural left-wing areas which would continue to be that way until the 1890s at least and in some cases until the 1970s.
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