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Author Topic: Greece 2012  (Read 184443 times)
Leftbehind
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« Reply #75 on: February 09, 2012, 05:24:10 pm »

Presumably XA's resurfaced as a consequence of LAOS propping up the government/alienating its support.

It appears DIMAR's gradually replacing PASOK - one of the biggest benefits of PR, in my opinion, is how it allows voters that opportunity without a second thought.
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Antonio V
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« Reply #76 on: February 09, 2012, 05:49:45 pm »

one of the biggest benefits of PR, in my opinion, is how it allows voters that opportunity without a second thought.

Very true.
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« Reply #77 on: February 11, 2012, 05:41:38 am »

Unfortunately, this fake PR means that ND is guaranteed to win the next election.
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« Reply #78 on: February 11, 2012, 05:49:24 am »

Why did PASOK collapse so heavily over the winter? One would have thought that not being solely in charge of government would have taken some pressure off them.
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« Reply #79 on: February 11, 2012, 05:52:01 am »

On the other hand, now that PASOK isn't solely in charge of government, I can't think of any reason for anyone to cast a vote for them.
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Filuwaúrdjan
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« Reply #80 on: February 11, 2012, 07:54:42 am »

^^^

Again, PASOK does not have roots.
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Leftbehind
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« Reply #81 on: February 11, 2012, 10:13:16 am »

Unfortunately, this fake PR means that ND is guaranteed to win the next election.

Yeah, the Greek 'modification', makes that frustratingly true. But then again it'd be even worse under FPTP.
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« Reply #82 on: February 11, 2012, 04:37:35 pm »

Unfortunately, this fake PR means that ND is guaranteed to win the next election.

"Guaranteed" is too strong of a word. I think people are underestimating just how unpopular this next round of austerity measures will be. Cutting the minimum wage tends to be viewed as sacrilege and the people will know who is responsible. DIMAR is skyrocketing in the polls, PASOK will probably cease to exist at this rate, the KKE appear to have a ceiling at around ten percent etc.
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Harry Hayfield
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« Reply #83 on: February 12, 2012, 06:49:35 pm »

(Source: YAHOO News)
Greek coalition government expels 43 deputies, over dissent in crucial debt vote

Can anyone tell me what the tallies are at the moment (or is that impossible)?
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« Reply #84 on: February 12, 2012, 07:48:33 pm »

(Source: YAHOO News)
Greek coalition government expels 43 deputies, over dissent in crucial debt vote

Can anyone tell me what the tallies are at the moment (or is that impossible)?

PASOK 132
ND 62
KKE 21
LAOS 14
Left Coalition 9
Independents 62(!)
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« Reply #85 on: February 13, 2012, 04:07:38 am »

It's worth noting that not quite all of the independents are really independents, since new parliamentary groups cannot be created until after the next election.
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« Reply #86 on: February 13, 2012, 05:04:19 am »

(Source: YAHOO News)
Greek coalition government expels 43 deputies, over dissent in crucial debt vote

Can anyone tell me what the tallies are at the moment (or is that impossible)?

PASOK 132
ND 62
KKE 21
LAOS 14
Left Coalition 9
Independents 62(!)

Has there been this much disloyalty anywhere in the history of partisan parliaments, ever?
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« Reply #87 on: February 13, 2012, 07:33:24 am »

(Source: YAHOO News)
Greek coalition government expels 43 deputies, over dissent in crucial debt vote

Can anyone tell me what the tallies are at the moment (or is that impossible)?

PASOK 132
ND 62
KKE 21
LAOS 14
Left Coalition 9
Independents 62(!)

Has there been this much disloyalty anywhere in the history of partisan parliaments, ever?

I can think of a few US examples where the majority of backbenchers opposed the party leadership, but then in the US the party whips aren't nearly as strong as in other countries - there's no procedure to expel people from the party.  If David Duke wants to be a Republican or Lyndon LaRouche a Democrat, they can't do anything about it, nor can they remove them as candidates if they win the primary.
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« Reply #88 on: February 13, 2012, 12:22:15 pm »

Interesting to note that two of the expelled were Nazis who supported the bill (one of them being the old transport minister).
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« Reply #89 on: February 17, 2012, 10:40:20 am »

VPRC (Feb 10th-13th) Changes from 2009 in italics
New Democracy 27.5 (-3) (-6)
Democratic Left 16% (+3)
Communist 14 (+1.5) (+6.5)
Radical Left 13.5 (+1) (+8.9)
PASOK 11 (-1) (-32.9)
LAOS 4.5 (-1.5) (-1.1)
Greens 3.5 (+0.5)
Golden Dawn 2.5 (nc)
Democratic Alliance 2 (-0.5)
Citizens Chariot 2 (-0.5)
Anticapitalist Left 1 (nc)

No majority for the ND. I actually think DIMAR could just about win this...

And that landslide in 2009 seems so long ago.
« Last Edit: February 17, 2012, 10:51:19 am by There's a lot of reasons not to elect Mitt »Logged
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« Reply #90 on: February 17, 2012, 10:44:07 am »

Will they find a way to postpone the elections again, in the name of "stability" ?
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Hash
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« Reply #91 on: February 17, 2012, 11:31:32 am »

This is going to be a great election. Hopefully the KKE can lead the Revolution after this.
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« Reply #92 on: February 17, 2012, 12:02:11 pm »

This is going to be a great election. Hopefully the KKE can lead the Revolution after this.

In their deep souls KKE leaders know that they are wrong, that their model would neve work. That's way they refuse any coalition with other parties.
i just fear leftist populims at government, but what can they do without possibility of public expenditure?
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« Reply #93 on: February 17, 2012, 12:04:21 pm »

This is going to be a great election. Hopefully the KKE can lead the Revolution after this.

In their deep souls KKE leaders know that they are wrong, that their model would neve work. That's way they refuse any coalition with other parties.
i just fear leftist populims at government, but what can they do without possibility of public expenditure?

Do you seriously think my support for the KKE is unironic?
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« Reply #94 on: February 17, 2012, 08:50:21 pm »

These are the same food, with different flavor. Last poll added.






As you can see, gentleman, the whole left voting intention varied, but didn't change at all. PASOK's voters are being sucked by DIMAR and, to a lesser extent, SYRIZA. The right seem to be on a  shrink trend, but the bleed is focused on LAOS.
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« Reply #95 on: February 18, 2012, 01:39:35 am »

Struggling Greeks losing belief in the state, Paul Mason, BBC
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« Reply #96 on: February 18, 2012, 02:34:25 am »

Wow the Communists could actually stand a chance of winning.
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« Reply #97 on: February 18, 2012, 09:48:30 am »

Wow the Communists could actually stand a chance of winning.

Not actually, no. The KKE is Stalinist and thus has a fairly limited base. I doubt they could do better than 14%. Which would still be their best result.
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Filuwaúrdjan
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« Reply #98 on: February 18, 2012, 12:30:52 pm »


Mason's been good on Greece from the start.
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« Reply #99 on: February 18, 2012, 02:31:40 pm »

I heard a Greek commentator on euronews 2 days ago (and people invited by euronews use to be worth listening), saying that the political scene was really upside down, that nobody had no clue about the way it could evolve and that things could change in one day. So, given that it remains 2 months, I guess most predictions/polls wouldn't be tell much outside of confirming a messy situation. Ah well, that's the most I reminded from what he said, it was in the night, in English and I was barely half awaken, Tongue.

I'd stick to my personal feeling so far, that, maybe the situation will be very wavy, but that in then end people would accept EU 'diktat' (fancy to use this word for something mainly directed by Germany). That being said, who knows...
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