UK General Discussion

[doktorb]

Political Scrapbook have dug up a photo of Danny Alexander at a party with a pro-€ pressure group from just before the Greek election! Even when they're not being Tories, the LibDems are crap.

http://politicalscrapbook.net/2012/06/danny-alexander-britain-in-europe-party/

Politician has friends outside of politics SHOCK

[doktorb]

Someone mind explaining to me how Ed Balls is supposed to have helped rig LIBOR eventhough he was Education Secretary at the time?

Because Labour were responsible for everything that went wrong in the last 13 years?

Can't help but feel sorry for Ed Balls, he gets such a bad wrap.

He was City Minister

Ed Balls is a smug, self-satisfied class warrior AND he's partly responsible for the policies which dragged this country into the longest, deepest recession in peace times, so yes, he's responsible.

[doktorb]

I'd leave the party rather than join in with Ed Balls.  As City Minister, he was the architect of the longest, deepest recession this country has suffered in peace times. He's a disaster.  A LibDem-Lab pact with him any where near it would be a catastrophe.

[doktorb]

If this coalition's a "Ronseal Deal", I must assume that 'the tin' isn't the manifesto of The Conservative Party or the Liberal Democrats then.

No, it's the Coalition Agreement.

[doktorb]

If this coalition's a "Ronseal Deal", I must assume that 'the tin' isn't the manifesto of The Conservative Party or the Liberal Democrats then.

No, it's the Coalition Agreement.

"Does what it says on the tin." What parts of the coalition agreement did they tell the electorate about again?

All of it. It was published in hard copy and on-line forms upon its signing. It  couldn't be made available before it was written, after all.

[doktorb]

If this coalition's a "Ronseal Deal", I must assume that 'the tin' isn't the manifesto of The Conservative Party or the Liberal Democrats then.

No, it's the Coalition Agreement.

"Does what it says on the tin." What parts of the coalition agreement did they tell the electorate about again?

All of it. It was published in hard copy and on-line forms upon its signing. It  couldn't be made available before it was written, after all.

Sorry, I guess I'll have to clarify what I meant to make it a bit more obvious, when were the electorate given a chance to democratically elect a government based on such a coalition agreement?

There was no such option. But there was no such option for a "rainbow alliance" which was also on the cards (without a majority) or a minority Conservative government or anything else concrete for that matter. Nobody knew until the votes were counted what was going to happen

And I tell you what did happen. Gordon Brown demanding to stay as PM, Ed Balls turning up to the meeting without so much as a note-pad and Liam Byrne writing a note saying "There's no money left, we've spent it all"

So I know who I prefer in power, that's for sure.

[doktorb]

If this coalition's a "Ronseal Deal", I must assume that 'the tin' isn't the manifesto of The Conservative Party or the Liberal Democrats then.

No, it's the Coalition Agreement.

"Does what it says on the tin." What parts of the coalition agreement did they tell the electorate about again?

All of it. It was published in hard copy and on-line forms upon its signing. It  couldn't be made available before it was written, after all.

Sorry, I guess I'll have to clarify what I meant to make it a bit more obvious, when were the electorate given a chance to democratically elect a government based on such a coalition agreement?

There was no such option. But there was no such option for a "rainbow alliance" which was also on the cards (without a majority) or a minority Conservative government or anything else concrete for that matter. Nobody knew until the votes were counted what was going to happen.

Minority Tory was an option. And a better one at that.

You don't know it would have been. I can't say with absolute certainty, though given our successes in reigning in some of the Conservative fringe elements, I can guess.

More generally, I'm bemused that people (not just you, though you're suggesting this) are still seething over the Coalition's formation, as though it was some kind of duplicitous fraud.

[doktorb]

More generally, I'm bemused that people (not just you, though you're suggesting this) are still seething over the Coalition's formation, as though it was some kind of duplicitous fraud.

Because Labour, in negotiations treated the Lib Dems like sh-t. And they can't admit that.

Well we know that, as I said, Brown demanded to remain PM  and Balls refused to take the talks seriously.

[doktorb]

If this coalition's a "Ronseal Deal", I must assume that 'the tin' isn't the manifesto of The Conservative Party or the Liberal Democrats then.

No, it's the Coalition Agreement.

"Does what it says on the tin." What parts of the coalition agreement did they tell the electorate about again?

All of it. It was published in hard copy and on-line forms upon its signing. It  couldn't be made available before it was written, after all.

Sorry, I guess I'll have to clarify what I meant to make it a bit more obvious, when were the electorate given a chance to democratically elect a government based on such a coalition agreement?

There was no such option. But there was no such option for a "rainbow alliance" which was also on the cards (without a majority) or a minority Conservative government or anything else concrete for that matter. Nobody knew until the votes were counted what was going to happen.

Minority Tory was an option. And a better one at that.

You don't know it would have been. I can't say with absolute certainty, though given our successes in reigning in some of the Conservative fringe elements, I can guess.

Aha, right yeah.

Well like I said, we'll never know, there'll be one of those £9.99 "What If..." books for sale on this very question come 2015.

But we know what the Conservative backbenchers are desperate for, and it's thanks to the more liberal David Cameron and our influence that they're not getting their way.

I'm happy with the Coalition and our role in it. Leaving the Conservatives on their own has been done before and it's best that history doesn't repeat itself too often on those terms.

[doktorb]

Liam Byrne writing a note saying "There's no money left, we've spent it all"

I don't know why Coalition apologists make such a big deal out of an obvious (though admittedly not very original or funny) joke.

Because there's a lot of truth in that jest. Biggest, longest recession in peace time, record deficit, record borrowing. It may have been funny to him but not to the rest of us!

[doktorb]

Liam Byrne writing a note saying "There's no money left, we've spent it all"

I don't know why Coalition apologists make such a big deal out of an obvious (though admittedly not very original or funny) joke.

Because there's a lot of truth in that jest. Biggest, longest recession in peace time, record deficit, record borrowing. It may have been funny to him but not to the rest of us!

All of it Labour's fault, clearly.

Liam Byrne writing a note saying "There's no money left, we've spent it all"

I don't know why Coalition apologists make such a big deal out of an obvious (though admittedly not very original or funny) joke.

Because there's a lot of truth in that jest. Biggest, longest recession in peace time, record deficit, record borrowing. It may have been funny to him but not to the rest of us!

All of it Labour's fault, clearly.

Absolutely. When countries such as Australia and Canada went over road-humps, thanks to Gordon Brown's love-in with light touch regulation, we went into a ditch.

[doktorb]

"GDP was estimated to have decreased by 0.3% in Q4 2012 compared with Q3 2012.
Output of the production industries was estimated to have decreased by 1.8% in Q4 2012 compared with Q3 2012, following an increase of 0.7% between Q2 2012 and Q3 2012.
Construction sector output was estimated to have increased by 0.3% in Q4 2012 compared with Q3 2012, following a decrease of 2.5% between Q2 2012 and Q3 2012.
Output of the service industries was estimated to have been flat in Q4 2012 compared with Q3 2012, following an increase of 1.2% between Q2 2012 and Q3 2012.
GDP was estimated to have been flat in Q4 2012, when compared with Q4 2011.
GDP is estimated to have been flat between 2011 and 2012. Users are, however, reminded that this figure is subject to revision in the second estimate of GDP when all quarters of 2012 are open for revision."

[doktorb]

Iraq has cast a shadow, and a precedent.  All MPs are deeply wary of the Iraq vote and what happened thereafter. Most members of the public who give a damn are wary too

Not allowing the Commons to vote would have brought back all the worst memories of Blair and dodgy dossiers.

[doktorb]

Ian Swales (Redcar)

Ha, did not know this.

What didn't you know?