Welcome, Guest. Please login or register.
Did you miss your activation email?
June 18, 2019, 07:43:00 pm
News: 2020 Presidential Predictions (General) are now active.

  Atlas Forum
  General Politics
  International General Discussion (Moderators: Gustaf, afleitch, Hash, Both Sides™)
  The Great Nordic Thread
« previous next »
Pages: 1 ... 15 16 17 18 19 [20] 21 22 23 24 25 ... 46 Print
Poll
Question: Will Iceland and Norway ever join the EU?
#1Iceland, but not Norway  
#2Norway, but not Iceland  
#3Both  
#4None of them  
Show Pie Chart
Partisan results

Total Voters: 153

Author Topic: The Great Nordic Thread  (Read 151719 times)
Secret Cavern Survivor
Antonio V
YaBB God
*****
Posts: 49,961
United States


Political Matrix
E: -7.87, S: -3.83

P P
Show only this user's posts in this thread
« Reply #475 on: March 23, 2015, 03:43:01 pm »

The Danish SDs should be euthanized.
Logged
politicus
YaBB God
*****
Posts: 10,202
Denmark


Show only this user's posts in this thread
« Reply #476 on: March 23, 2015, 03:48:22 pm »

Actually the DPP has been capable of much worse:

Img


"Denmarks future - Your country - Your choice"

Img


Roughly: "Follow (the) custom, or flee (the) country" (old proverb)

Last one from 2007 and the first one older. Their current propaganda is much more toned down.
Logged
The Lord Marbury
EvilSpaceAlien
Sr. Member
****
Posts: 386
Sweden


Political Matrix
E: -6.06, S: -5.91

Show only this user's posts in this thread
« Reply #477 on: March 24, 2015, 08:00:42 am »

The Swedish Left Party in Malmø counter the Danish SD immigration campaign and the "If you come to Denmark, you will have to work" poster with "In Malmø you are welcome", but this will likely be a benefit for SD since Malmø (rightly or wrongly) is considered a symbol of failed integration by most Danes with big ghettos, threats against Jews and high crime etc.

Img


Img



Yeah the Danish S campaign has gotten some attention in Sweden lately. The Social Democratic Student's League decided to respond to it with this:
Img

"If you come to Sweden, you are welcome.
Millions of people are fleeing from war, oppression, genocide and terror. The Social Democratic Student's League will always stand up for the right of asylum, people's equal value and international solidarity. Always. Unconditionally."
-Talla Alkurdi, President of the Social Democratic Student's League

Stefan Löfven also commented on the matter after being asked by a reporter and said the following:
Quote
-It's not like some people from certain countries don't want to work. I believe that every adult individual wants a job because that's how you develop your life. For us it's an asset to have people who come from different countries and it's up to us to make sure it works.
Logged
politicus
YaBB God
*****
Posts: 10,202
Denmark


Show only this user's posts in this thread
« Reply #478 on: March 24, 2015, 08:15:57 am »
« Edited: March 24, 2015, 09:08:41 am by Charlotte Hebdo »

The thing is that at this point it is basically an advantage for Danish politicians (outside of Radikale and the left wing) to be criticized by Swedes on immigration and integration. Sweden has been typecasted as a worst case scenario - "this is what happens if we are not careful enough and tough enough." So in that way those Swedish SAP politicians are playing their (small, but appreciated) part in the script seen from SocDem campaign staffers POV.

On welfare Danish politicians scare voters with "American conditions", but on immigration/integration it is "Swedish conditions."

Stuff like this video of disrespect towards PM Löfven when he visited the Biskopgården ghetto in Gothenburg to pay his respect after a couple of gang related murders (and could not remember the names of the dead) is seen as "typical Swedish".
Logged
MaxQue
YaBB God
*****
Posts: 11,007
Canada


Show only this user's posts in this thread
« Reply #479 on: March 24, 2015, 03:22:45 pm »

We get it. Danish people are racist and don't like immigrants. We know, no need to try justify it.
Logged
politicus
YaBB God
*****
Posts: 10,202
Denmark


Show only this user's posts in this thread
« Reply #480 on: March 24, 2015, 03:58:16 pm »
« Edited: March 24, 2015, 06:30:39 pm by Charlotte Hebdo »

We get it. Danish people are racist and don't like immigrants. We know, no need to try justify it.

Complex and paradoxical issue Max - I made an effortpost about it in the Denmark Election thread (one of the first pages).

Dunno where you get the "justification" stuff from - only analytical and descriptive stuff in the above, no normative allegations in either Marbury's or my posts.
Logged
Swedish Austerity Cheese
JOHN91043353
YaBB God
*****
Posts: 4,247
Sweden


Show only this user's posts in this thread
« Reply #481 on: March 24, 2015, 06:21:41 pm »

The Danish SDs should be euthanized.

I'm so glad when we agree on something 100%  ^^

The thing is that at this point it is basically an advantage for Danish politicians (outside of Radikale and the left wing) to be criticized by Swedes on immigration and integration.

Well it's a door that swings both ways. V and S aren't running these ads because they think it will affect the Danish Social Democrats or Danish opinion, they're using it to win political points at home, as Denmark is often seen as the worst example to what will happen if we give in to demands for stronger restrictions for immigrants.  Them criticizing SD because this ad might help SD, but it also helps themselves here at home by energizing their grassroots.   

Logged
politicus
YaBB God
*****
Posts: 10,202
Denmark


Show only this user's posts in this thread
« Reply #482 on: March 24, 2015, 06:35:38 pm »

The thing is that at this point it is basically an advantage for Danish politicians (outside of Radikale and the left wing) to be criticized by Swedes on immigration and integration.

Well it's a door that swings both ways. V and S aren't running these ads because they think it will affect the Danish Social Democrats or Danish opinion, they're using it to win political points at home, as Denmark is often seen as the worst example to what will happen if we give in to demands for stronger restrictions for immigrants. Them criticizing SD because of this ad might help SD, but it also helps themselves here at home by energizing their grassroots.   


That is obvious. I was just trying to explain the effect to non-Scandinavian posters.
Logged
politicus
YaBB God
*****
Posts: 10,202
Denmark


Show only this user's posts in this thread
« Reply #483 on: March 25, 2015, 08:22:39 am »
« Edited: April 01, 2015, 06:38:32 am by Charlotte Hebdo »

Jón Gnarr, comedian and former mayor of Reykjavík, has finally ruled out running for president next year (which he was favoured to win) citing that he can not stand the political culture in Iceland, which he finds sad and pathetic.

"I get bored of impudence, insolence and rudeness. I try to avoid people who see that as a normal part of daily interaction. I am appalled at the thought to in this way become part of the sad and pathetic culture that is the Icelandic political culture. I can not stand opposite the "cheeky guys" again. I just can not offer myself and my wife that. I can not offer my boys that."

A bit sad because his program sounds pretty good:

"I think I would be a fine president. I love Iceland land and the people who live there and want nothing more than to see it grow and develop in the future. I believe I would be a pretty popular president. But I would also get involved in the international arena. I would take a clear stance on issues of equality and human rights, peace and climate issues. I would try to use the office and myself to advertise Iceland and attract filmmakers, musicians, writers and all those who have exciting and interesting ideas to bring to the country. But I know that I would provoke many. I would like to change much that I think is stagnant and outdated. I would try to eliminate what I think feels contrived or snobbish. "

He does not rule out running in 2020 when his boys will have left home, but this was probably his best chance.

With fifteen months to go before the presidential election, there are still no candidates and this leaves the door open for former leftist Ólafur Ragnar Grimsson (71) to go for a sixth term and try becoming "President Forever" Wink.

Pundits say it probably mainly depends on the EU issue. If the government manages to get it off the agenda that reduces the likelihood that he continues. If the application lives on he is likely staying on to try to see if he can somehow block it.

If Grimsson does not want to run again it will be wide open. Former Prime Minister Þorsteinn Pálsson from the moderate, europhile IP left wing and former Foreign Affairs Minister Össur Skarphéðinsson from SDA were the two obvious elder statesmen type candidates and they have both declined.
Logged
politicus
YaBB God
*****
Posts: 10,202
Denmark


Show only this user's posts in this thread
« Reply #484 on: March 25, 2015, 09:17:56 am »

After selling Dong Energy to Goldman Sachs for 31,5 billion kroner it now turns out the company is valued at 50 billion kroner after landing an order for three huge sea based wind mill parks with full public funding from the British state a mere three months after the sale. So a loss for the Danish tax payers of more than 3 billion dollars. Apparently everybody in the business knew about the order, but not - officially - the Danish Ministry of Finance. No post-deal price regulation mechanism was included in the contract as it is usual in trades with big orders just around the corner. So either incompetence/carelessness or foul play. Anyway, not good for the government in an election year.
Logged
politicus
YaBB God
*****
Posts: 10,202
Denmark


Show only this user's posts in this thread
« Reply #485 on: March 26, 2015, 04:28:18 pm »
« Edited: March 26, 2015, 09:24:02 pm by Charlotte Hebdo »

Norway has gotten their own version of Feminist Initiative. Norwegian F! will run in the municipal election in Oslo and Bergen this year and try to get on the ballot to the Storting election in 2017.

From their manifesto:

"In Sweden, FI managed to get almost all parties to call themselves feminists , and Stefan Löfven and his new government proclaimed that they are a feminist government. Without FI this would not have been possible. We want the feminist wave that now washes over Norway to gush into the corridors of power. To do that we need to be an inclusive party that starts anew."

Unsurprisingly Socialist Left fear losing votes to the upstarts - as the Swedish Left Party did - and Deputy Leader Oddny Miljeteig says this will "paradoxically split the feminist strength on the left wing".
Logged
politicus
YaBB God
*****
Posts: 10,202
Denmark


Show only this user's posts in this thread
« Reply #486 on: March 27, 2015, 08:45:56 pm »
« Edited: March 27, 2015, 08:51:24 pm by Charlotte Hebdo »

Two men have been arrested for planning to kill Danish Minister of Defence Nicolai Wammen. One with Somali and one with Pakistani background.
Logged
politicus
YaBB God
*****
Posts: 10,202
Denmark


Show only this user's posts in this thread
« Reply #487 on: March 28, 2015, 10:01:57 am »
« Edited: March 28, 2015, 11:20:16 am by Charlotte Hebdo »

Not sure it interests anybody, but continuing my Icelandic party description:

Iceland has a public monopoly on sale of strong beer, wine and liquor through the state owned Vínbúðin (wine store) chain and there is a Pirate Party proposal for it to be abolished, but it will likely fail. A typical libertarian-communitarian issue, which illustrates the difference between the traditional left and the new "postmodern progressives" and the typical rural/urban cleavage between PP and IP. Also clear gender and, especially, generational differences.

"Should alcohol sale be legal in "food stores" (supermarkets and general stores)?"


No 55%
Yes 45%

Men: 50/50
Women: 39/61

18-49: 56/44
50+: 32/68

Yes:

IP 61%
Pirates 54%
Bright Future 50%
-----------------
SDA 30%
PP 30%
Left Greens 25%
Logged
politicus
YaBB God
*****
Posts: 10,202
Denmark


Show only this user's posts in this thread
« Reply #488 on: April 01, 2015, 06:52:30 am »

The Pirates are back to being the second largest party in Iceland in new Kjarninn poll, so the 29%+ MMR poll was probably an outlier.

Left Greens 10.2%    
SDA 16.1%    
Pirates 23.6%    
Bright Future 10.1%    
PP 11.0%    
IP 24.8%    
Others 4.2%
Logged
politicus
YaBB God
*****
Posts: 10,202
Denmark


Show only this user's posts in this thread
« Reply #489 on: April 01, 2015, 11:37:16 am »

Danish death penalty poll:

20% of voters are in favour of reinstating the death penalty (none of the parties represented in the Folketing support it)

Pro death penalty:

DPP 36%
Liberal Alliance 34%
Liberals 32%
Conservatives 22%
SocDem 9%
SPP 8%
Social Liberals 4%
Red Greens 4%

Liberal Alliance is the most surprising. Combined with their voters strong opposition to feminism and support for tough immigration policies it seems that the party that mostly originated in the Social Liberals now (mainly?) attracts genuine right wingers.
Logged
¢®🅰ß 🦀 ©@k€ 🎂
CrabCake
YaBB God
*****
Posts: 16,271
Kiribati


Show only this user's posts in this thread
« Reply #490 on: April 01, 2015, 11:38:50 am »

Aw, libertarians grow up so fast :') cute
Logged
politicus
YaBB God
*****
Posts: 10,202
Denmark


Show only this user's posts in this thread
« Reply #491 on: April 04, 2015, 05:06:46 am »
« Edited: April 04, 2015, 05:23:22 am by Charlotte Hebdo »

Capacent Gallup poll confirms the pattern of a strong Pirate Party and that the 29'% poll was an outlier. Now three polls on 21,7, 21,9 and 23,6, which starts to look like a credible interval. Seven micro parties above 0,5%. Mostly from the old crash-era Citizens' Movement, which seems as divided as ever. Right Greens is an attempt to unite xenophobia, libertarianism and environmentalism. One of the most bizarre parties in Europe.

Píratar (Pirate Party)  21.7% ↑6.5%
Vinstri græn (LG) 10.1% ↓1.1%
Samfylkingin (SDA) 15.8% ↓1.3%
Björt framtíð (BF) 10.9% ↓2.4%
Framsóknarflokkur (PP) 10.8% ↓0.2%
Sjálfstæðisflokkur (IP) 25% ↓1.1%

Frjálslyndir (Liberals) 0.6% •0%
Borgarahreyfingin (Citizens' Movement) 0.6% ↑0.1%
Hreyfingin (The Movement) 0.6% ↓0.4%
Samstaða (Solidarity) 1% ↓0.3%
Hægri grænir (Right Greens) 0.9% ↓0.3%
Dögun (Dawn) 0.8% ↑0.2%
Lýðræðisvaktin (Democracy Watch) 0.9% ↑0.2%
Others 3.2% ↓0.3%
Logged
Secret Cavern Survivor
Antonio V
YaBB God
*****
Posts: 49,961
United States


Political Matrix
E: -7.87, S: -3.83

P P
Show only this user's posts in this thread
« Reply #492 on: April 04, 2015, 06:00:18 am »

Aw, libertarians grow up so fast :') cute

If they grow up into disgusting right-wingers, I'd rather send them to Neverland.
Logged
¢®🅰ß 🦀 ©@k€ 🎂
CrabCake
YaBB God
*****
Posts: 16,271
Kiribati


Show only this user's posts in this thread
« Reply #493 on: April 04, 2015, 04:50:09 pm »

Wait so before last election; Movement, Citizen's Mt. and the Liberals all merged to form Dawn and they all epically failed. So it makes sense they sulkily split apart, but what crazy weirdo is trying to keep Dawn going with no constituent parties? Imao
Logged
politicus
YaBB God
*****
Posts: 10,202
Denmark


Show only this user's posts in this thread
« Reply #494 on: April 04, 2015, 05:59:24 pm »
« Edited: April 04, 2015, 06:01:21 pm by Charlotte Hebdo »

Wait so before last election; Movement, Citizen's Mt. and the Liberals all merged to form Dawn and they all epically failed. So it makes sense they sulkily split apart, but what crazy weirdo is trying to keep Dawn going with no constituent parties? Imao

Short answer: Money (party aid).

Dawn was always an artificial entity because the Liberals was a populist, low tax, no regulations and soft anti-immigration party akin to the Progress Party in Norway and the others were direct democracy/anti-corruption activists with a mostly leftist outlook. It was founded solely to pass the threshold and also  attracted people from other parts of the anti-establishment citizens movement than the three founding parties. After the election the right wingers left and reestablished the Liberals, and the sensible thing would have been to keep the rest together. But apparently there were too many personal grudges.

It is not so odd that Dawn continued because it looked like the best bid to get in next time and they had better finances (you receive public party aid according to votes). The weirdest thing was to reestablish the original Citizens Movement, which was mostly an empty shell after the leadership leaving to form The Movement. But apparently personal grudges decided that.

Generally everybody with a bit of political talent has moved on to the Pirates (Birgitta Jonsdottir is ex Citizens Movement/The Movement), Left Greens or BF. So you only got no-names and amateurs left with a high concentration of cranks, querulous types and contrarians.

The fact that Democracy Watch, which was a single issue party created to continue the constitutional process, lives on is also weird. I had expected at least a couple of the micro parties to fold, but it seems all 2013 parties still exist.

Solidarity is a true leftist splinter from LG and makes better sense - even if there is also an ideologically similar more working class and northern party called Rainbow.
Logged
politicus
YaBB God
*****
Posts: 10,202
Denmark


Show only this user's posts in this thread
« Reply #495 on: April 05, 2015, 11:40:25 am »

Klaus Rifbjerg is dead. RIP.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Klaus_Rifbjerg
Logged
ingemann
YaBB God
*****
Posts: 2,890


Show only this user's posts in this thread
« Reply #496 on: April 05, 2015, 02:43:12 pm »

Klaus Rifbjerg is dead. RIP.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Klaus_Rifbjerg

RIP
Logged
politicus
YaBB God
*****
Posts: 10,202
Denmark


Show only this user's posts in this thread
« Reply #497 on: April 06, 2015, 04:25:50 pm »

Latest Norwegian poll from Norstat:

Centre Party 5.9
Greens 4.3
Labour 41.7    
Socialist Left 2.6
Red 1.8

Liberals 3.8
Christian Democrats 6.5
Conservatives 22.3
Progress Party 10.0

Others 1.1

Norway is starting to resemble Iceland in that the centre-right government seems stuck on a 30%+ level with no ability to bounce back (and after a populist party called the Progress Party has collapsed). Socialist Left below the threshold in the seventh poll in a row, but the Greens above. Liberals also just below 4%.
Logged
politicus
YaBB God
*****
Posts: 10,202
Denmark


Show only this user's posts in this thread
« Reply #498 on: April 06, 2015, 10:48:15 pm »
« Edited: April 06, 2015, 11:18:56 pm by Charlotte Hebdo »

This is a bit long, but on the subject of how the Danish right wing (not just the far right, but conservatives in general) sees Sweden as a dystopia - or at least a country headed down a wrong path - I think this editorial by editor-in-chief Jørn Mikkelsen from our most right wing broadsheet daily Jyllands-Posten (of cartoon crisis fame) describes Sweden is illustrative:

"The exception Sweden

The debate about an explosive attack on the courthouse in Malmö was a striking example of the Swedish state of emergency. It expressed outrage not over the nature of the crime, but rather of the fact that the courthouse is located in a place where it can pose a danger to its surroundings. Translated into Danish: When justice is attacked physically, it is better that the legal system gives way. We wouldn't want to harm people.

The latter is rhetorical. Shooting dramas and physical abuse have long been part of particularly the nightly hours in Malmö, Gothenburg, Stockholm and other major cities in Sweden. People are actually hurt, and meanwhile the institutional basis for the Swedish democracy is sliding. As the Swedish journalist and foreign correspondent Richard Swartz wrote in the newspaper Information recently, elementary journalistic principles are neglected when stories are about people with an immigrant background. Presto, the media transforms themselves into shepherds for the good cause and don the expected self-censorship so that no one can understand what the news is about.

Formally there are still freedom of speech and parliamentarism in Sweden. But the real situation is highly segregated. Either you are inside or out in Sweden. This is not just political correctness, but also parliamentary practice, since the normal political competition is inoperative for the next eight years thanks to the infamous 'December Agreement' concluded between the Riksdag parties minus the Sweden Democrats.

The shaming of this one party and its 800,000 voters, which the opinion polls show to be more and more, is fully conscious and deliberate, and comparison between today's fainthearted criticism of immigration from Islamic countries and Jew hatred in 1930s Nazi Germany is normal imagery on the other side of the Kattegat.

In Sweden the normal becomes extreme, and the exception the rule. While Latin America and other parts of the world are moving towards ever more political and economic freedom, the Swedes lose their freedom because they have made themselves and each other into slaves by a moralistic purity that obscures everything. The secular goodness ideology in media, politics, culture, industry and the Swedish education system over the past decades have been imposed with a speed and heaviness, so even the biggest skeptics have been surprised. There is an overwhelming systematic hubris that can lead the country into a longstanding crisis - not only economic. States can tolerate many beatings, and it would be premature to predict a collapse. But Sweden is moving step by step towards less control over the social, political and demographic order. Where it leads, no one can know for sure, but even now it can be seen that the asylum system is about to collapse under the growing burden of a de facto free immigration to Sweden. Just below the surface this raises concern among even Swedish Social Democrats, but the criticism is hushed up.

The outgoing Prime Minister, the Moderate Fredrik Reinfeldt, outlined the choice quite frankly shortly before the autumn elections to the Riksdag: Either we choose the welfare state as we have known it, or we choose to become an immigrant nation. Reinfeldt preferred the latter and lost to a red bloc that thinks they know that a generous welfare state must go hand in hand with the historically unique and rapid immigration to Sweden from the cultures and countries most alien to Sweden. The immigration issue part the waters throughout Western Europe. But nowhere is the answer so dogmatic and naive as in Sweden."

(my translation)

http://jyllands-posten.dk/debat/leder/ECE7600842/Undtagelsen-Sverige/
Logged
Lurker
YaBB God
*****
Posts: 706
Norway
Show only this user's posts in this thread
« Reply #499 on: April 08, 2015, 09:56:55 am »

Latest Norwegian poll from Norstat:

Centre Party 5.9
Greens 4.3
Labour 41.7    
Socialist Left 2.6
Red 1.8

Liberals 3.8
Christian Democrats 6.5
Conservatives 22.3
Progress Party 10.0

Others 1.1

Norway is starting to resemble Iceland in that the centre-right government seems stuck on a 30%+ level with no ability to bounce back (and after a populist party called the Progress Party has collapsed). Socialist Left below the threshold in the seventh poll in a row, but the Greens above. Liberals also just below 4%.

The thing that should worry Labour and the centre-left, as far as the 2017 general election is concerned, is the possibility of a significant numbers of "wasted" left-wing votes. If the results of this Norstat poll was only slightly altered, for instance, it could mean that over 8% of the vote would og to left(ish) parties below the treshold. And the recent introduction of a Norwegian Feministisk Initiativ could make this problem even worse, even if it's doubtful that they could get a significant share of the vote.

Of course, I realize that this is getting ahead of myself, and that the political landscape might have changed completely by 2017.
Logged
Pages: 1 ... 15 16 17 18 19 [20] 21 22 23 24 25 ... 46 Print 
« previous next »
Jump to:  


Login with username, password and session length
Logout

Terms of Service - DMCA Agent and Policy - Privacy Policy and Cookies

Powered by SMF 1.1.21 | SMF © 2015, Simple Machines

© Dave Leip's Atlas of U.S. Elections, LLC