Question to All International Forum Members

[WMS]

Sorry to come to this late, but where would I fit in? For convenience, click on the link in my signature for a rundown of my beliefs.

Al already said that in the U.K. I would probably be a moderate Christian Socialist Labourite, but I'm curious where I fit in other countries. Thanks!

[Gabu]

Sorry to come to this late, but where would I fit in? For convenience, click on the link in my signature for a rundown of my beliefs.

Al already said that in the U.K. I would probably be a moderate Christian Socialist Labourite, but I'm curious where I fit in other countries. Thanks!

I can't really think of any parties that you'd fit into in Canada.  Our parties are pretty much either "left" or "right".  I'd say that the closest would probably be the Liberal Party of Canada (their name notwithstanding, they're generally regarded as the most centrist party), but you wouldn't really fully fit in anywhere that I can think of.  Of course, being a member of that party myself, I may be a little biased, but my opinion still holds.

PS: Regarding that link, the following is a more exact one:

https://uselectionatlas.org/FORUM/index.php?topic=14822.msg325863#msg325863

If you click on the little page icon next to the subject of a message, it'll give you a link that can be used to link directly to that message.

[WMS]

Sorry to come to this late, but where would I fit in? For convenience, click on the link in my signature for a rundown of my beliefs.

Al already said that in the U.K. I would probably be a moderate Christian Socialist Labourite, but I'm curious where I fit in other countries. Thanks!

I can't really think of any parties that you'd fit into in Canada.  Our parties are pretty much either "left" or "right".  I'd say that the closest would probably be the Liberal Party of Canada (their name notwithstanding, they're generally regarded as the most centrist party), but you wouldn't really fully fit in anywhere that I can think of.  Of course, being a member of that party myself, I may be a little biased, but my opinion still holds.

PS: Regarding that link, the following is a more exact one:

https://uselectionatlas.org/FORUM/index.php?topic=14822.msg325863#msg325863

If you click on the little page icon next to the subject of a message, it'll give you a link that can be used to link directly to that message.

Thank you for the tip!

[Bono]

Colin- PSD
Philip- PND

Let's sort this out
PCP - Old Style COmmunist
BE - Looney Left. It would be the party of Michael Moore and Nader. A bit left libertarian, since their biggest causes are social issues.
PS - Social Democratic/Socialist Party, depends on the wings.
PSD - Moderate conservtive, moderate libertarian, social-liberal party(then again, depends on the wings)
PP -  Christian Democratic
PND -  Libertarian Conservative

[Middle-aged Europe]

Sorry to come to this late, but where would I fit in? For convenience, click on the link in my signature for a rundown of my beliefs.

Al already said that in the U.K. I would probably be a moderate Christian Socialist Labourite, but I'm curious where I fit in other countries. Thanks!

In Germany, clearly one of the two major parties (CDU/CSU or SPD), depending on your geographical, religious and social background. As a protestant worker from Northrine-Westphalia, you would probably vote for the SPD.  As a Catholic from Bavaria probably CSU.

While the CDU is mostly an economically conservative party, they also have a leftist (= populist, in the American meaning of the word) wing.

But you would never vote for either the FDP (far too economically conservative for you) or the Greens (far too socially liberal for you)... well except for solely tactical reasons. ;-)

[angus]

no, it cannot.  Al has repeatedly pointed out, for example, that englanders do not vote on social issues to the degree that yankees do.  And in developing nations the issues are almost strictly economic, as I have observed in conversations with folks in central and south american bars and cafes.  Even in our own country it doesn't translate from locale to locale.  For example, I am a registered republican in California, but I can assure you that I would not be a registered republican in Mississippi, for example.  And I'm quite sure I would not be a CDU member in Germany.  Such oversimplification does not work.  Also, note that in many western european nations, the term "liberal" really means liberal, and not what it has evolved to mean here.  Alliances arise from issue disagreements, and since issues vary from place to place, you can expect alliances to differ from place to place, and from time to time.  For example, we have often discussed Chirac's party, and its abject nationalism, not unlike that of the american GOP, yet many republicans here are under the false impression that his worldview is orthogonal to their own.  You'll all do well not to attempt to make such juxtapositions, as it would impede communication and understanding.

I admit that such generalizations aren´t never totally accurate and that the possibility of exceptions remain. On  the other hand, as hard as I try, I can´t imagine many Republicans who would vote for something other than CDU, CSU or FDP in Germany. But surprise me...

which german group is closest to pim fortuyn's livable netherlands coalition, would you say? 

[Middle-aged Europe]

which german group is closest to pim fortuyn's livable netherlands coalition, would you say? 

Schill?

But I guess it´s not much left of his movement anymore, after he tried to blackmail the mayor of Hamburg, after he was fired by him, after his party broke apart, after the remaining parts of his party were virtually destroyed in the subsequent election, and after Schill left Germany for Cuba. The guy was mucho crazy, but it took some time before even the last of his allies noticed it. Well, at least it never got boring with him. Sometimes I even miss him. He was certainly fun... unfortunately someone (the same mayor he tried to blackmail later) thought it was a good idea to give him a position in the government.

Anyway, I think that was enough gossip... his political positions came probably closest to that of Pim Fortuyn in the Netherlands. His coalition partners in Hamburg were the CDU and the FDP and I think many Schill supporters joined the CDU after the collapse of his party. So, I would say you would either vote for CDU or FDP in Germany. Depends on what is more important for you: economic conservatism (FDP) or social conservatism (CDU).

[angus]

ganz gut

you win. 

still, my ideal party does not exist in the US, not sure whether it does in Germany either, by the way.  If there's one that's Libertarian-like on civil liberty issues (decriminalize prostitution, drugs, abortion, etc. etc.) and rather centrist on economic issues.  (say, government total not more than 30% overall GDP), that'd be mine.

[Middle-aged Europe]

ganz gut

you win. 

still, my ideal party does not exist in the US, not sure whether it does in Germany either, by the way.  If there's one that's Libertarian-like on civil liberty issues (decriminalize prostitution, drugs, abortion, etc. etc.) and rather centrist on economic issues.  (say, government total not more than 30% overall GDP), that'd be mine.

Um, decriminalize prostitution...? Prostitution IS decriminalized here. So, the question would be if a party wants to "re-criminalize" it.

Anyway, based on these positions, the FDP would probably be best party for you.

[angus]

to clarify, based on your analogy to fortuyn, I'd say you are right about most republicans.  but on a specific note, there are those on the edges of the party who'd not fall into that category.  several posters on this forum I can think of.  my guess is that the right to keep and bear fully-automated weapons, and other basic tenets of conservatism (liberalism, whichever arbitrary label you prefer) precludes any stereotypical central european political group's juxtaposition on this subset of republicans.

ah, just noted your post.  yeah, I'm using terms rather loosely above.  will read more about fdp.  thanks.

[Middle-aged Europe]

to clarify, based on your analogy to fortuyn, I'd say you are right about most republicans.  but on a specific note, there are those on the edges of the party who'd not fall into that category.  several posters on this forum I can think of.  my guess is that the right to keep and bear fully-automated weapons, and other basic tenets of conservatism (liberalism, whichever arbitrary label you prefer) precludes any stereotypical central european political group's juxtaposition on this subset of republicans.

ah, just noted your post.  yeah, I'm using terms rather loosely above.  will read more about fdp.  thanks.

As I said in the beginning, "libertarian-leaning Republicans" would probably vote FDP. Most of them would go for the CDU, though. But I can´t really imagine a Republican who would vote for SPD, Greens or even PDS.   It would require the most extreme case of a RINO I´ve ever seen...

And they aren´t many important parties beside those five... only neo-Nazis, ultra-communists, Lyndon LaRouche´s German affiliate and single issue parties, like a Yoga party, a feminist party or a animal rights´  party. ;-)

[angus]

www.liberale.de

Ja!  das ist mein partei.  (well, mostly)

as I said before, however, issues, and thus alliances would be different.  For example, this party would put me in bed with opebo, for example.  and here we are diametrically opposed.  see what I mean?

[Middle-aged Europe]

www.liberale.de

Ja!  das ist mein partei.  (well, mostly)

as I said before, however, issues, and thus alliances would be different.  For example, this party would put me in bed with opebo, for example.  and here we are diametrically opposed.  see what I mean?

Um, well, maybe... as I said, it was only a generalization and generalizations aren´t always totally accurate.

But doesn´t describe opebo himself as an libertarian-sort type of person? At least I would have placed him in the FDP too.

And I can´t say, if you´re diametrically opposed to opebo. That´s between him and you.

[ThePrezMex]

I don't know if you could fit in any party in Mexico, maybe it would be easier for WMS.

We have three main political parties:
-National Action Party (PAN) which is the party of current President Fox. They are part of the International Christian Democrat Organization or whatever it is called. They are very conservative on social issues, very very close to the Catholic Church (hence, I really don't know of any Jew being a member of that party). It is an interesting fact that they have really few women as candidates or senators or in congress. On economic issues they were pro free market and free trade for many decades, since they were close to the business sector as well. But when President Salinas (1988-94) and President Zedillo after him basically started applying most of the economic platform that PAN had advocated for years, they basically ran out of ideas and they don't have a clue of what to do now - they are basically becoming some sort of populists. They have proved to be quite incompetent.

- Democratic Revolution Party (PRD): Actually, none of you would be members or voters of this party. Is the leftist party in Mexico. They always fight among each others because it is formed by the old style socialist and communist parties (although a real communist party never existed in Mexico) and by disaffected members of the PRI that decided to get out of the party when Presidents Salinas and Zedillo pushed for the free market reforms. They are very liberal socially as well: pro abortion, pro gay rights. And left on economics, but they are not rabid looney leftists though, more of an european social democratic style.

- the Institutional Revolutionary Party (PRI) which ruled Mexico for 71 years until they lost the Presidency in 2000. Everyone fits in here, because it is an umbrella party (very similar in style to the Congress Party of India). You have a wide spectrum of ideologies here, from strong free marketeers to old style union leaders, from business sector leaders to corporatist agrarian organizations. You have the most intelligent and prepared technocrats and the worst and most vicious old style Tammny Hall deal makers. Ideology doesn't matter that much in this party, power does.

[WMS]

Sorry to come to this late, but where would I fit in? For convenience, click on the link in my signature for a rundown of my beliefs.

Al already said that in the U.K. I would probably be a moderate Christian Socialist Labourite, but I'm curious where I fit in other countries. Thanks!

In Germany, clearly one of the two major parties (CDU/CSU or SPD), depending on your geographical, religious and social background. As a protestant worker from Northrine-Westphalia, you would probably vote for the SPD.  As a Catholic from Bavaria probably CSU.

While the CDU is mostly an economically conservative party, they also have a leftist (= populist, in the American meaning of the word) wing.

But you would never vote for either the FDP (far too economically conservative for you) or the Greens (far too socially liberal for you)... well except for solely tactical reasons. ;-)

And let's not even go into the PDS. *shudders* ;-)

Thanks for the information! Interesting that I could potentially fit into either of the two big German political parties...

[WMS]

I don't know if you could fit in any party in Mexico, maybe it would be easier for WMS.

We have three main political parties:
-National Action Party (PAN)

- Democratic Revolution Party (PRD)

- the Institutional Revolutionary Party (PRI)

So which one of these fits me best, hmm? O_O

[ThePrezMex]

Given your political compass score maybe the PRI or PAN

We also have other small parties:

- Green Party - They were originally an environmentalist party as any other greens, but not anymore. Actually, the least in which they are interested is in the environment. It is basically a party 'owned' by one family that just tries to make alliances in different states with either PRI or PAN depending which one offers more $$

- Democratic Convergence Party - An emerging center-left party, basically aiming to middle urban classes. Still small. Could be something similar to the Freedom Party of the Fantasy Elections (eh.. I found were WMS fits).

[WMS]

Given your political compass score maybe the PRI or PAN

We also have other small parties:

- Green Party - They were originally an environmentalist party as any other greens, but not anymore. Actually, the least in which they are interested is in the environment. It is basically a party 'owned' by one family that just tries to make alliances in different states with either PRI or PAN depending which one offers more $$

- Democratic Convergence Party - An emerging center-left party, basically aiming to middle urban classes. Still small. Could be something similar to the Freedom Party of the Fantasy Elections (eh.. I found were WMS fits).

Thanks for the information!

[12th Doctor]

What about myself.

[Platypus]

Coalition in Australia, of course. It's much more interesting to jusge american leftists in aussie terms, because all US republicans are basically automatically coalition, excpet maybe Bullmoose (who'd be an aussie democrat)

[??????????]

I wonder in which parties I'd be in?

[afleitch]

I knwo if I was Dutch I'd be a supporter of LPF, Pim Fortuyn's List.

[angus]

I wonder in which parties I'd be in?

baath?    no offense, man.

probably the partido de accion nacional down south.  up north, you're more the philosophical equivalent of a separatist Quebecois.  n'est ce-pas?

[Middle-aged Europe]

Soupersoulty: mainstream CDU member, wouldn´t bother much to vote FDP for tactical purposes, though.

StatesRights: right edge of the CDU; would despise SPD, Greens, PDS, and the "christian labour" wing of his own party for being "too socialist/communist" and the FDP for being "dangerous liberals" (not in the economic sense of the word, though). Personal admirer of conservative party members such as Brandenburg´s Deputy PM Jörg Schönbohm and CSU parliamentary group leader Michael Glos, because they do not bow down to "the political correctness of the left".

[Gabu]

I wonder in which parties I'd be in?

baath?    no offense, man.

probably the partido de accion nacional down south.  up north, you're more the philosophical equivalent of a separatist Quebecois.  n'est ce-pas?

No, the Bloc Quebecois is actually quite a liberal party; it just also happens to want Quebec to separate from Canada as well.

I don't think that Canada has a party right enough for States.