Myths about American politics...

[All Along The Watchtower]

What are some of the common myths out there about American politics?

Off the top of my head:


1. "Reagan Democrats"

2. High-income people vote Democratic (in general)

3. Low-income whites vote Republican (this one's more a matter of degree)

4. Black people are more homophobic than white people

5. America is a "conservative nation"

[Queen Mum Inks.LWC]

1. How did Reagan Democrats not exist?

3. It depends on the state and office a lot of the time.

4. I've never heard anyone claim this.  I've heard the claim that black people oppose gay marriage more than white people, and until Obama came out in support of gay marriage, that was true.

5. That really depends on how you define "conservative nation".  But it is true that conservatives vastly outnumber liberals when asked for self-identification in polls.

[tpfkaw]

Off the top of my head:


1. "Reagan Democrats"

Legitimate concept, Reagan did in fact win in two landslides.

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In urban areas/West Coast/Northeast they do.

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Low-income whites do vote Republican, although to a lesser degree than other whites.

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Objectively true.  There's a reason why black men go on the "down low."

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It isn't, but it certainly self-identifies as one.

[The world will shine with light in our nightmare]

1. I disagree... plenty of conservadems still exist today.
2. Depends on location.
3. Depends on location.
4. Well, polls do say...
5. America is not a conservative country nor a liberal country.  Personally, I'd place it pretty dead center, and frankly most Americans don't even have an ideology simply because most Americans don't think about politics that much or base their positions off of ideology.

[Mr. Morden]

On voting and income, you should read "Red State, Blue State, Rich State, Poor State" for a good explanation, or at least watch this summary:

http://bloggingheads.tv/videos/1876?in=05:00&out=10:26

[All Along The Watchtower]

1. How did Reagan Democrats not exist?

They did, but they weren't the kinds of people that some  people think they were.

[All Along The Watchtower]

5. That really depends on how you define "conservative nation".  But it is true that conservatives vastly outnumber liberals when asked for self-identification in polls.

Self-identification is a horrible way of measuring this thing. How about support for liberal policies-which a majority of Americans support?

[courts]

Off the top of my head:


1. "Reagan Democrats"

Legitimate concept, Reagan did in fact win in two landslides.

not in the context the media uses it, which is idiotic short hand for swing voters and/or working class whites. my favorite thing is when it's used for west pennsylvania democrats...

[Free Palestine]

Your vote counts!

[H.E. VOLODYMYR ZELENKSYY]

5. That really depends on how you define "conservative nation".  But it is true that conservatives vastly outnumber liberals when asked for self-identification in polls.

Self-identification is a horrible way of measuring this thing. How about support for liberal policies-which a majority of Americans support?

If the issues were decided by popular vote, America would have universal health care. However, 'liberal' has been made into a dirty word by the right-wing establishment.

[Indy Texas]

Conservative activists stereotype liberals and being wealthy to stoke resentment among working- and middle-class whites (which is ironic, considering how class warfare-y that is).

The liberal commentariat evokes the image of the bigoted, undereducated blue-collar conservative when they want to belittle those who disagree with them and allow less-affluent liberals to view their political views in an aspirational way.

I seem to recall seeing a paper somewhere that said partisan identity was more strongly determined by income level in Democratic states (rich people more likely to vote Republican; poor people more likely to vote Democratic) and more strongly determined by social views in Republican states.

[🐒Gods of Prosperity🔱🐲💸]

5. That really depends on how you define "conservative nation".  But it is true that conservatives vastly outnumber liberals when asked for self-identification in polls.

Self-identification is a horrible way of measuring this thing. How about support for liberal policies-which a majority of Americans support?

If the issues were decided by popular vote, America would have universal health care. However, 'liberal' has been made into a dirty word by the right-wing establishment.

In the abstract, yes, a majority of Americans want universal health care. But every time a plan to do it has been presented to them, it doesn't win majority support. Taxes, rationing plans, mandates - there's the rub.

[I spent the winter writing songs about getting better]

Off the top of my head:


1. "Reagan Democrats"

Legitimate concept, Reagan did in fact win in two landslides.

not in the context the media uses it, which is idiotic short hand for swing voters and/or working class whites. my favorite thing is when it's used for west pennsylvania democrats...

Exactly. It has a certain historical context, but that has virtually zero relevance to how it's used today. Thus it's a useless and idiotic term that needs to be retired.

Oh and the point about western Pennsylvania is the perfect example of how it's such a totally f**king stupid term:

[Queen Mum Inks.LWC]

5. That really depends on how you define "conservative nation".  But it is true that conservatives vastly outnumber liberals when asked for self-identification in polls.

Self-identification is a horrible way of measuring this thing. How about support for liberal policies-which a majority of Americans support?

Well, when you post a topic about myths of American politics and list 5 very short myths lacking any discussion, it's hard to understand exactly what about the list you don't believe.

[○∙◄☻¥tπ[╪AV┼cVê└]

One of the biggest ones:

Elections are won by being closer to some swing voters on the issues, who took a totally moderate view on every issue.

[dead0man]

No offense, but that's a sh**tty list.  5 is the only one that really works.
1.as noted, isn't a myth, these people existed (how one defines them is a totally different thing)
2.isn't believed by many people in first place
3.maybe....but again, not that many people that matter actually believe it in the first place
4.is objectively true, thus not a myth
5.works, but only if you use a specific set of definitions for words

[BaldEagle1991]

4. Black people are more homophobic than white people

Not so much anymore.

But I can see more Asians and Hispanics as so.


I think another one would be that the South is a bastion of conservatism, not when there are now megalopolises like Atlanta and Houston, increasing ethnic diversity in the South, and states like Utah and Idaho beats them in the Cook PVI and makes laws that even make the South liberal.

[Brittain33]

"Reagan Democrats" may well have existed in the early '80s (I have no reason to think it's not true) but the myth is that they've carried on as a group that the Dems have to win in order to be competitive. A hell of a lot has happened in 30 years. Most Reagan Democrats are now better described as senior citizens and we know how they vote. Their kids have had a completely different economic experience. Then what BRTD said about using it to describe the white working class. And in the meantime, you have increasing diversity in the electorate and the move of well-educated middle class people who would have voted for Anderson in '80 and Reagan in '84 into a position where they're often uncomfortable with the GOP.

[memphis]

The New York Times did those big piece about the Reagan Democrats last week about how they're not happy with either Obama or Romney this year. And to demonstrate they interviewed people in Fayette County, Pennsylvania. Check the results from 1984, if you don't immediately recognize why this is such epic fail.

[I spent the winter writing songs about getting better]

Yep, see the map I've posted. In any case it's quite idiotic to define people into a category based on elections that happened around 30 years ago. The youngest people alive today who could've voted for Reagan are 46.

[RIP Robert H Bork]

1. "Reagan Democrats"

Uh, no. These voters did in fact exist.

2. High-income people vote Democratic (in general)

Depends on the region.

3. Low-income whites vote Republican (this one's more a matter of degree)

See above.

4. Black people are more homophobic than white people.

*The Emoticon that Must Not be Used* at your use of 'homophobic'.

Black people are more anti-gay marriage, although that might have changed given Obama's recent 'evolution' on the issue.

5. America is a "conservative nation"

This is the only 'myth' here that might qualify as one.

[Redalgo]

I did not give them much though, but what are your thoughts on these ten?

- American politics is a bipolar contest betwixt "liberals" and "conservatives."
- Donors and interest groups oft buy the votes of most high elected officials.
- All American politicians are unprincipled, opportunistic, and lie to win votes.
- Democrats dislike free enterprise, and are disloyal to the U.S. Constitution.
- Republicans do not care about human suffering, poverty, or social injustice.
- The invasion and occupation of Iraq was centered on securing oil interests.
- Social conservatives are closed-minded bigots who reject science and logic.
- Liberals try to punish hard work, foster dependency, and repress Christians.
- Ones vote in an election does not matter because elites call all of the shots.
- Compromise and bipartisanship will yield the best solutions to our problems.

[Joe Republic]

I did not give them much though, but what are your thoughts on these ten?

- American politics is a bipolar contest betwixt "liberals" and "conservatives."
- Donors and interest groups oft buy the votes of most high elected officials.
- All American politicians are unprincipled, opportunistic, and lie to win votes.
- Democrats dislike free enterprise, and are disloyal to the U.S. Constitution.
- Republicans do not care about human suffering, poverty, or social injustice.
- The invasion and occupation of Iraq was centered on securing oil interests.
- Social conservatives are closed-minded bigots who reject science and logic.
- Liberals try to punish hard work, foster dependency, and repress Christians.
- Ones vote in an election does not matter because elites call all of the shots.
- Compromise and bipartisanship will yield the best solutions to our problems.

My initial thoughts are that all of those sentences were somehow the same length.  I'm impressed.

[Redalgo]

I did not give them much though, but what are your thoughts on these ten?

- American politics is a bipolar contest betwixt "liberals" and "conservatives."
- Donors and interest groups oft buy the votes of most high elected officials.
- All American politicians are unprincipled, opportunistic, and lie to win votes.
- Democrats dislike free enterprise, and are disloyal to the U.S. Constitution.
- Republicans do not care about human suffering, poverty, or social injustice.
- The invasion and occupation of Iraq was centered on securing oil interests.
- Social conservatives are closed-minded bigots who reject science and logic.
- Liberals try to punish hard work, foster dependency, and repress Christians.
- Ones vote in an election does not matter because elites call all of the shots.
- Compromise and bipartisanship will yield the best solutions to our problems.

My initial thoughts are that all of those sentences were somehow the same length.  I'm impressed.

Having some obsessive-compulsive tendencies is a time sink, ftl, and such. xD

[tpfkaw]

The idea that one's opinions on gay marriage serve as a proxy for whether one is homophobic or not verges on the ridiculous.