Doctor Who episodes, R. T. Davies period (2005-2010) survivor - Phase I Round 20

[Antonio the Sixth]

Ladies, gentlemen, multi-sex, undecided or robot, welcome to this survivor !

  

    

Series 1 (2005)

1. Rose Eliminated Round 14
2. The End of the World Eliminated Round 10
3. The Unquiet Dead Eliminated Round 4
4-5. Aliens of London / World War Three
6. Dalek
7. The Long Game
8. Father's Day
9-10. The Empty Child / The Doctor Dances
11. Boom Town Eliminated Round 13
12-13. Bad Wolf / The Parting of the Ways


Series 2 (2006)

1. New Earth Eliminated Round 8
2. Tooth and Claw Eliminated Round 7
3. School Reunion Eliminated Round 19
4. The Girl in the Fireplace
5-6. Rise of the Cybermen / The Age of Steel
7. The Idiot's Lantern Eliminated Round 3
8-9. The Impossible Planet / The Satan Pit
10. Love & Monsters Eliminated Round 2
11. Fear Her Eliminated Round 1
12-13. Army of Ghosts / Doomsday


Series 3 (2007)

1. Smith and Jones
2. The Shakespeare Code Eliminated Round 17
3. Gridlock
4-5. Daleks in Manhattan / Evolution of the Daleks Eliminated Round 5
6. The Lazarus Experiment Eliminated Round 9
7. 42
8-9. Human Nature / The Family of Blood
10. Blink
11-12-13. Utopia / The Sound of Drums / Last of the Time Lords


Series 4 (2008)

1. Partners in Crime Eliminated Round 16
2. The Fires of Pompeii
3. Planet of the Ood Immunized Round 18
4-5. The Sontaran Stratagem / The Poison Sky
6. The Doctor's Daughter
7. The Unicorn and the Wasp Eliminated Round 11
8-9. Silence in the Library / Forest of the Dead
10. Midnight
11. Turn Left Immunized Round 6
12-13. The Stolen Earth / Journey's End Immunized Round 12


Special episodes

Xmas 2005 The Christmas Invasion
Xmas 2006 The Runaway Bride
Xmas 2007 Voyage of the Damned
Xmas 2008 The Next Doctor Eliminated Round 15
Easter 2009 Planet of the Dead
Nov. 2009 The Waters of Mars
Xmas/NY 2009-10 The End of Time


Rules

The principles of this games are simple : at each round, we will vote to eliminate one episode. The classical rule is that everybody has one vote to eliminate, but there can be variations from time to time. Rounds generally last around 24 hours, but can be extended if necessary to let people vote.

This survivor is composed of 46 episodes (note : episodes in two or more parts are counted as a single episode, so for example you can't vote to eliminate "The Sontaran Stratagem" only without also ousting "The Poison Sky"). Phase I will consist in eliminating the first 30 episodes. During each round, you are free to choose whatever episode you want to eliminate, with the exception that at least 3 episodes of each series (and two specials) must ascend to phase II. That means, when there are only 3 episodes left in the series, you can't oust them.

Every five normal rounds (that is, on round 6, 12, 18, 24 and 30), there will also be an immunity round. During such rounds, the vote will not consist in eliminating, but rather in "saving" an episode : if selected, the episode will be protected from elimination until the end of Phase I. Like for elimination, not more than 3 episodes can be immunized in the same series (2 in specials).

All right, enough talking ! Round 1 begins ! Have fun.

[Antonio the Sixth]

The Unquiet Dead

The only interesting thing was the Doctor's admiration of Dickens. Otherwise, it's all quite forgettable.

[Antonio the Sixth]

Fear Her : 4
Love & Monsters : 2
Turn Left : 1
Voyage of the Damned : 1
The Unquiet Dead : 1
Daleks in Manhattan/Evolution of the Daleks : 1

Eliminated :
Series 2 - Episode 11



Aired 24 June 2006

    

    

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Round 2 begins.

[Antonio the Sixth]

The Unquiet Dead

Can't resolve myself to vote Love & Monsters already. It's definitely subpar, but I quite like the dissonance between its unusually light/childish tone and the fact the story ends up being one of the saddest of the series.

[Antonio the Sixth]

Nobody else ? C'mon people !

Pit : You didn't like Daleks in Manhattan ? It might well be my favorite Dalek episode ever, with the very original idea of giving the Daleks a chance to redeem themselves and become better creatures thanks to humanity. The fact it ends up in such a tragic way, in particular regarding Dalek Sec, the only "lucid" Dalek to have ever existed, makes the ending particularly moving. I've also liked Talullah and Laszlo's romance.

[Antonio the Sixth]

     I thought the Daleks had a certain charm as implacable killing machines. It's a nice break from the complexity of real life, if you will. That four Daleks were stuck hiding under Manhattan (a fact that was pointed out, even) was humiliating to them and made them seem less threatening in the long run. I thought it was a good story on its own terms, but I didn't like the effect it had on the greater saga.

     Ultimately, I concede that it may not be fair to blame any one story for the recent decline of the Daleks. Overall, they were just used too often. Any tack that would let them stay menacing in spite of such frequent appearances would probably be too pessimistic to work in Doctor Who.

I agree. As a villain they really have ceased to be villainous (and this goes back to the 80's). One Dalek is not particualrly frightening and neither is a million; it's hard to get a happy medium - 'Dalek' got it balanced well.

Moffat has been wise to 'retire' the Dalek's though the first episode of the new series will feature every Dalek there has ever been so who knows if it will be a bit of a re-invention.

Well, personally, having watched only the new series I must say I have never found the Daleks particularly terrifying (except in "Dalek", by the point you see how terrified the Doctor himself is). They have long been overshadowed by the Angels, the Vashta Nerada, the Midnight thing or the Silence in terms of creepiness. IMO, the Daleks are in the show as a metaphor of evil and inhumanity. They don't need to be terrifying, they might even look utterly pathetic (the "do not blaspheme" bit in Doomsday is perfect in that regard). The remnants of the Skaro Cult in Daleks in Manhattan is a way to point out why the Daleks fail : because their conviction that dalekness equals perfection prevents them from evolving like every species does. And when one of them finally tries to, he ends up being rejected by his former mates (which he is genuinely trying to help). I thinks this story tells a lot of truth about fanaticism and hatred of difference, and is magnificently tragic this way.

[Antonio the Sixth]

Love & Monsters : 2
The Stolen Earth/Journey's End : 1
Gridlock : 1
The Unquiet Dead : 1
Daleks in Manhattan/Evolution of the Daleks : 1

Eliminated :
Series 2 - Episode 10



Aired 17 June 2006

    

    

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Round 3 begins.

[Antonio the Sixth]

OK, let's go with Boom town.

I hope people don't forget about this. Where have all the first round voters gone ?

[Antonio the Sixth]

The Idiot's Lantern : 3
Boom Town : 2
Daleks in Manhattan/Evolution of the Daleks : 2
Gridlock : 1
Voyage of the Damned : 1

Eliminated :
Series 2 - Episode 7



Aired 27 May 2006

   

   

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Round 4 begins.

[Antonio the Sixth]

Yeah, I think the focus on series 2 has been a bit excessive.

Now, I'm going with The Unquiet Dead. Can someone tell me why it is still there ? It had nothing much interesting. The Lazarus experiment had, by the end, a really beautiful dialogue between Lazarus and the Doctor about life and death.

     The thing is, the Daleks are built up to be a genuine menace in canon. They fought on equal terms with the Time Lords (& were implied to have been winning the Time War) and a small number of Daleks can easily defeat a large force of humans and Cybermen. While they are quite goofy (seriously, they have a plunger for an arm) and seriously flawed in their world view, they are also meant to be seen as formidable fighters.

     In reality, most enemies that the Doctor faces are essentially bugs that he doesn't just squash outright due to his strong sense of morality. The way he dresses down the Vashta Nerada when they try to threaten him at the end of Forest of the Dead reinforces that fact. The difference with the Daleks is that they (& the Master too, for that matter) can actually challenge the Doctor on equal terms. That the Daleks are so privileged in the story canon and yet command so little awe from the viewing audience is a waste of character potential.

I don't think the dangerousness of the Daleks has been downplayed in the series overall. Sure, they have their own truly pathetic moments (and yeah, Daleks in Manhattan is particularly full of these moments), but this (at least in my view) doesn't make them any less impressive when they show all their force. The best example is the expression on the faces of Jack, Martha, Sarah Jane and the others when they hear the Daleks' "message to humanity" in The Stolen Earth. As soon as they hear it, they know there's nothing they can do. And we're talking about the doctor's bravest and most determined companions. Sure, one of the reason they freak out is because the Doctor is seemingly unreachable, but still. Others enemies could be handled without the Doctor by such a badass team, but not the Daleks. As for the Doctor himself, his tendency to act in a nonchalant and mocking way doesn't mean he does not fear them. It happens a couple times that his true feelings toward the Daleks are made evident : in Dalek, of course, but also in every other Dalek episode to some extent. And, remember, they came very close to winning several times (in The Parting of the Ways they were only stopped by a nigh-almighty Rose, and in Journey's End, they just made the mistake not to care about Donna - but how could they have known that she had become part-timelord ?). And in Evolution of the Daleks itself, the Doctor himself at some point was genuinely resigned to their victory, to the point when he was offering himself to them to be killed.

Of course, the problem with the Daleks is that they always come back, get their ass kicked, then come back again, etc. But after all, the same happens to the Master as well (even though his appearances have been made scarcer in the new series).

[Antonio the Sixth]

     The thing is, the Daleks are built up to be a genuine menace in canon. They fought on equal terms with the Time Lords (& were implied to have been winning the Time War) and a small number of Daleks can easily defeat a large force of humans and Cybermen. While they are quite goofy (seriously, they have a plunger for an arm) and seriously flawed in their world view, they are also meant to be seen as formidable fighters.

     In reality, most enemies that the Doctor faces are essentially bugs that he doesn't just squash outright due to his strong sense of morality. The way he dresses down the Vashta Nerada when they try to threaten him at the end of Forest of the Dead reinforces that fact. The difference with the Daleks is that they (& the Master too, for that matter) can actually challenge the Doctor on equal terms. That the Daleks are so privileged in the story canon and yet command so little awe from the viewing audience is a waste of character potential.

I don't think the dangerousness of the Daleks has been downplayed in the series overall. Sure, they have their own truly pathetic moments (and yeah, Daleks in Manhattan is particularly full of these moments), but this (at least in my view) doesn't make them any less impressive when they show all their force. The best example is the expression on the faces of Jack, Martha, Sarah Jane and the others when they hear the Daleks' "message to humanity" in The Stolen Earth. As soon as they hear it, they know there's nothing they can do. And we're talking about the doctor's bravest and most determined companions. Sure, one of the reason they freak out is because the Doctor is seemingly unreachable, but still. Others enemies could be handled without the Doctor by such a badass team, but not the Daleks. As for the Doctor himself, his tendency to act in a nonchalant and mocking way doesn't mean he does not fear them. It happens a couple times that his true feelings toward the Daleks are made evident : in Dalek, of course, but also in every other Dalek episode to some extent. And, remember, they came very close to winning several times (in The Parting of the Ways they were only stopped by a nigh-almighty Rose, and in Journey's End, they just made the mistake not to care about Donna - but how could they have known that she had become part-timelord ?). And in Evolution of the Daleks itself, the Doctor himself at some point was genuinely resigned to their victory, to the point when he was offering himself to them to be killed.

Of course, the problem with the Daleks is that they always come back, get their ass kicked, then come back again, etc. But after all, the same happens to the Master as well (even though his appearances have been made scarcer in the new series).

     Which gets to my point. The Daleks are generally built up to be a grave threat. However, their constant appearances and rapid exterminations at the hands of the Doctor makes it hard for the audience to take them seriously and wastes the work of building them up. Between the pointlessness of the millions of Daleks that appeared at the end of Doomsday and the sheer ineffectualness of the Cult of Skaro in Daleks in Manhattan (who really would have had no difficulty just conquering the world), the middle of Davies's run was a real low point for the threat of the Daleks.

Yeah, I admit that's a huge plot hole in that episode. The Daleks, if as powerful as usual, certainly didn't need to hide. This probably can be justified in some way, like the "emergency time-travel" device consuming an insane amount of energy and leaving them near powerless, but you're right that this has been a low point in the Dalek's image. Still, I don't think that's near enough to dislike Daleks in Manhattan, because it's still an amazing story.

[Antonio the Sixth]

The Unquiet Dead : 6
The Lazarus Experiment : 1
Boom Town : 1
Daleks in Manhattan/Evolution of the Daleks : 1

Eliminated :
Series 1 - Episode 3



Aired 9 April 2005

   

   

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Round 5 begins.

[Antonio the Sixth]

Oh crap... I'd vote anything to save Daleks in Manhattan.

Let's try Boom Town again. I don't dislike it, but it's definitely subpar compared to last two thirds of season 1.

Also, anyone else realize that Daleks only really appeared as actual characters in one episode (Victory of the Daleks) of the Moffat era? In The Big Bang and The Wedding of River Song they were more tools to propel the plot forward then the much-beloved Nazi allegories of old. I don't think that Moffat has the same sort of nostalgia for the old Doctor Who villians that RTD had.

Yeah, Moffat doesn't seem to be a huge fan of the Daleks. Or maybe he just wants to let them rest a bit, so that next time they appear it will be more sudden. But I don't like the way he treated them in The Pandorica Opens. The Daleks will not, ever, ally with any other species. Even if it's in order to beat the doctor. They are supposed to consider any other living being as an abomination whose sole existence is inherently immoral.

Anyways, I for one generally like the treatment of the Daleks by R T Davies. Maybe that's because I don't know the old series...

[Antonio the Sixth]

Uh oh, looks like Daleks in Manhattan is screwed.

[Antonio the Sixth]

Daleks in Manhattan/Evolution of the Daleks : 4
Boom Town : 3
Turn Left : 1
The Lazarus Experiment : 1
42 : 1

Eliminated :
Series 3 - Episodes 4-5

   

Aired 21-28 April 2007

   

     

   

 

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Round 6 begins. This is an immunity round : you must vote for an episode you want to protect from elimination during the rest of phase I.

[Antonio the Sixth]

Yeah, Turn Left.

[Antonio the Sixth]

Also, anyone else realize that Daleks only really appeared as actual characters in one episode (Victory of the Daleks) of the Moffat era? In The Big Bang and The Wedding of River Song they were more tools to propel the plot forward then the much-beloved Nazi allegories of old. I don't think that Moffat has the same sort of nostalgia for the old Doctor Who villians that RTD had.

Yeah, Moffat doesn't seem to be a huge fan of the Daleks. Or maybe he just wants to let them rest a bit, so that next time they appear it will be more sudden. But I don't like the way he treated them in The Pandorica Opens. The Daleks will not, ever, ally with any other species. Even if it's in order to beat the doctor. They are supposed to consider any other living being as an abomination whose sole existence is inherently immoral.

Anyways, I for one generally like the treatment of the Daleks by R T Davies. Maybe that's because I don't know the old series...

     I heard that he was letting them rest so they'd be "fresher", which is a notion that I agree with. Then again, he did have them appear briefly in The Big Bang and The Wedding of River Song to do basically nothing but get trashed by River Song and the Doctor respectively. So who knows.

     Daleks sometimes do form temporary alliances to further their own ends (like enlisting the foreman in Daleks In Manhattan, actually). The trick is that they think absolutely nothing of betraying their partners when they decide that they are no longer useful.

     The thing that really bothered me in The Pandorica Opens was the sheer number of species who probably hadn't met the Doctor yet and couldn't travel through time. It's like we were meant to think that the Daleks bothered to bring back species like the Weevils, Judoon, Sontarans, &c. who were vastly inferior on a technological level and could serve no purpose but to stand there and look threatening.

     If it were up to me, the Daleks would have captured the Doctor themselves. Use an electrical holding field or something. Allow the Daleks to actually win something for once, since it ultimately wouldn't matter. It'd help their image out.

You finally got what you wanted...

You are certainly far more knowledgeable than I am about the show's history. I mostly agree with you, though I admit I didn't feel the Daleks' villain decay as you did due to not watching the old series. But I still love Daleks in Manhattan and find it unfair that it's gone before New Earth, Boom Town, The End of the World or The Unicorn and the Wasp... As the number of quotes and images I've posted might tell you.

I admit it would be fun to see a full fledged Dalek win for once. "Victory of the Daleks" was one, but one of limited consequences. I think a nice idea could be to handle it as the Master was in its return. The Sound of Drums was a continuous streak of failures and humiliations for the doctor, and he only gets better at the very end of Last of Time Lords. This clearly established the Master as a formidable genius.

[Antonio the Sixth]

Yeah, the Genesis Ark in Doomsday was a big mistake. It literally had no point in the whole plot, and the only thing these Daleks had the occasion to do was to die. A shame, really (all the more because it was made evident that four Daleks could easily deal with all the cybermen). I see your issues with Dalek in Manhattan as well. The Daleks in Stolen Earth/Journey's end, however, were extremely powerful and threatening IMO. While Davros somewhat monopolized screen time at their expense, they were the real danger all along, and came insanely close at wiping out all of reality.

[Antonio the Sixth]

Turn Left : 3 (winner by coin toss)
42 : 3
Boom Town : 1

Immune :
Series 4 - Episode 11

Round 7 begins. Back to normal rules.

[Antonio the Sixth]

New Earth. The whole body switch thing was plain silly.

Tooth and claw was not great, but not really bad either.

[Antonio the Sixth]

Regarding vote changes, I'm not banning them, but try to avoid doing it too frequently.

[Antonio the Sixth]

Afleitch ? Patrick ? Pit ? Hugh ?

[Antonio the Sixth]

Poor season 2... It isn't really lucky so far. It's true that it had many mediocre episodes, but season 1 had a couple of those too. And I don't think Love & Monster and The Idiot's lantern should have gone so soon.

[Antonio the Sixth]

Tooth and Claw : 4
Boom Town : 2
New Earth : 2
Partners in Crime : 1

Eliminated :
Series 2 - Episode 2



Aired 22 April 2006

   

   

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Round 8 begins.

[Antonio the Sixth]

New Earth, and then let's leave season 2 alone.

I'm going with Partners in Crime again.  I know the episode is more meant as an introduction but come on- Adipose?

But they are so cute!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!