Have you ever actually been persuaded/persuaded someone else in an argument?

[H.E. VOLODYMYR ZELENKSYY]

I persuaded half my school to join a cult I made up. Does that count?

[anvi]

Of course, I sometimes change my views.  I do my best to listen to others, take account of the evidence they offer or the arguments they make, and if they are persuasive, I can certainly be convinced of something I didn't initially believe or think.  

I have no idea how often I persuade others.  I can't tell how much I do so in the classroom, and I don't think I hardly ever do on Atlas.  I still like Atlas a great deal, because I can learn a lot from people here.

[Oldiesfreak1854]

Yes to both, and I sometimes change my opinion but hardly ever persuade anyone.

[後援会]

Yes, I have changed my opinions on many things. And I have the changed the opinions of many other people.

I've grown to solidly oppose the death penalty. I've grown to support the TARP bill. I grew to support the America Invents Act. I opposed the Medicare Modernization Act at first, but I eventually grew to support it. I've grown to support keeping the tax rates where they are. I've grown from being pro-choice to relatively centrist on the issue. I've grown from being pro-gay marriage to be completely apathetic/conflicted. I've grown to oppose the "Russian reset" policy. I've grown to oppose the Afghanistan surge. I've grown to oppose expanding gun control. I've grown to oppose Cap and Trade.

And of course, I've switched parties.

As for persuading, well, my ring of family friends has slowly morphed from 90/10 Democrat/Republican to 10/90. We used to have only two Republicans - we now have only three Democrats.

And again, on local politics, I've been persuaded and persuaded others many times. But then again, local politics is a lot less ideological. So it's to be expected.

[afleitch]

I've grown from being pro-gay marriage to be completely apathetic/conflicted.

May I ask why? I'm about to get married to my partner and would be curious to know what made you become less supportive of them, not as an 'idea' (because gay marriage is no longer in the realm of theoretical) but as actual event taking place between two people. What is it about gay marriages that puts you off them? Do you think that now that people have financial and next of kin rights that these are bad things and should be taken away from them?

[後援会]

I've grown from being pro-gay marriage to be completely apathetic/conflicted.

May I ask why? I'm about to get married to my partner and would be curious to know what made you become less supportive of them, not as an 'idea' (because gay marriage is no longer in the realm of theoretical) but as actual event taking place between two people. What is it about gay marriages that puts you off them? Do you think that now that people have financial and next of kin rights that these are bad things and should be taken away from them?

I think Gavin Newsom put it best in that gaffe the Prop 8 guys jumped on. "IT'S GONNA HAPPEN, WHILE YOU WANT IT OR NOT."

Looking at the demographics of how people view gay marriage, I've come to the conclusion that legalized gay marriage is inevitable in the United States regardless of what happens. If someone comes up to me and says "yo we're going to have a referendum on it", I'd probably vote in favor. But otherwise, I don't think/care about it.

[afleitch]

I've grown from being pro-gay marriage to be completely apathetic/conflicted.

May I ask why? I'm about to get married to my partner and would be curious to know what made you become less supportive of them, not as an 'idea' (because gay marriage is no longer in the realm of theoretical) but as actual event taking place between two people. What is it about gay marriages that puts you off them? Do you think that now that people have financial and next of kin rights that these are bad things and should be taken away from them?

I think Gavin Newsom put it best in that gaffe the Prop 8 guys jumped on. "IT'S GONNA HAPPEN, WHILE YOU WANT IT OR NOT."

Looking at the demographics of how people view gay marriage, I've come to the conclusion that legalized gay marriage is inevitable in the United States regardless of what happens. If someone comes up to me and says "yo we're going to have a referendum on it", I'd probably vote in favor. But otherwise, I don't think/care about it.

I'm talking about actual marriages between people. I am a person about to commit to another; why go from support to indifference on that? I am not indifferent to other peoples marriages, to my parents or my friends. They all mean something.

[後援会]

I'm talking about actual marriages between people. I am a person about to commit to another; why go from support to indifference on that? I am not indifferent to other peoples marriages, to my parents or my friends. They all mean something.

Sorry if I may not have been clear in what I meant. What I'm trying to say is that in the past, a candidate's stance on gay marriage would be something I would take into account when voting for them. With what I understand about political demographics, it is no longer something I take into account because it seems like an inevitability, untethered to the success of politicians.

[opebo]

I would also like to expand on Vosem's comment. The core there is that information can move judgements, unless there is a stronger underlying belief. On subjects where one has a significant edge in knowledge and there is little personal involvement, debate can be very effective.

Your only missing one point - Vosem (and sjoyceflorida) mention that these simpletons they led astray trusted them.  Even the most ignorant person can be a good judge of character with a little life experience - for example, I should think that it would be obvious to most people they couldn't trust someone like Vosem, or sjoyceflorida, or Romney - even without knowing they were being lied to they could sense or suspect it. 

[Donerail]

Your only missing one point - Vosem (and sjoyceflorida) mention that these simpletons they led astray trusted them.  Even the most ignorant person can be a good judge of character with a little life experience - for example, I should think that it would be obvious to most people they couldn't trust someone like Vosem, or sjoyceflorida, or Romney - even without knowing they were being lied to they could sense or suspect it. 

I managed to get half of my English class to start a political chant today (Rom-Ney! Rom-Ney! Rom-Ney!). They're so apathetic, it's worrying.

[opebo]

Your only missing one point - Vosem (and sjoyceflorida) mention that these simpletons they led astray trusted them.  Even the most ignorant person can be a good judge of character with a little life experience - for example, I should think that it would be obvious to most people they couldn't trust someone like Vosem, or sjoyceflorida, or Romney - even without knowing they were being lied to they could sense or suspect it. 

I managed to get half of my English class to start a political chant today (Rom-Ney! Rom-Ney! Rom-Ney!). They're so apathetic, it's worrying.

Not sure apathetic is the word.  I think they must have some psychological problems or at least 'bad upbringing'.  After all, one may be a nihilist or too lazy to even consider anything, but anyone's 'gut', who has a 'gut', would know not to listen to the likes of you.  Don't you agree?

[Donerail]

Your only missing one point - Vosem (and sjoyceflorida) mention that these simpletons they led astray trusted them.  Even the most ignorant person can be a good judge of character with a little life experience - for example, I should think that it would be obvious to most people they couldn't trust someone like Vosem, or sjoyceflorida, or Romney - even without knowing they were being lied to they could sense or suspect it. 

I managed to get half of my English class to start a political chant today (Rom-Ney! Rom-Ney! Rom-Ney!). They're so apathetic, it's worrying.

Not sure apathetic is the word.  I think they must have some psychological problems or at least 'bad upbringing'.  After all, one may be a nihilist or too lazy to even consider anything, but anyone's 'gut', who has a 'gut', would know not to listen to the likes of you.  Don't you agree?

What it seems to me is that they 'have bigger issues', like the Kardashians and such, to give a damn about anything political, and since I actually follow politics (I'm the only one who wears a 'Castor for Congress' shirt to school or anything) it seems like they're just "Okay, so he's good? Okay. I'll support him. Check out this music. Did you hear what happened with Carly Rae Jepsen?"

[opebo]

What it seems to me is that they 'have bigger issues', like the Kardashians and such, to give a damn about anything political, and since I actually follow politics (I'm the only one who wears a 'Castor for Congress' shirt to school or anything) it seems like they're just "Okay, so he's good? Okay. I'll support him. Check out this music. Did you hear what happened with Carly Rae Jepsen?"

You go to school with the Kardashians?

[Tetro Kornbluth]

Quite frequently. There are these things called "literature seminars".

[Donerail]

What it seems to me is that they 'have bigger issues', like the Kardashians and such, to give a damn about anything political, and since I actually follow politics (I'm the only one who wears a 'Castor for Congress' shirt to school or anything) it seems like they're just "Okay, so he's good? Okay. I'll support him. Check out this music. Did you hear what happened with Carly Rae Jepsen?"

You go to school with the Kardashians?

With people who care about whatever they do.

[DC Al Fine]

Yes, I've gone from neo-con to libertarian to an Old Right sort of conservatism.

The only issue, I've managed to change someone on was pretty obscure; convincing someone about the proper remedy to my city's congestion problem.