most unelectable potential nominee?

[Keystone Phil]

republican:  rick santorum

Besides Santorum vs. Bayh, give me a scenario where Santorum would by like to lose.

Whether you like the guy or hate him, you have to admit that he's not as unelectable as some would love to believe.

[Keystone Phil]

Even in this situation, as bad as it looks for the GOP, Santorum would win 270-268 and that's with almost everything going in the Dems favor.

[Keystone Phil]

Why is Santorum unelectable?

Because some people absolutley despise him and let that cloud their judgement. In reality, he is definetley electable.

[Keystone Phil]

most any democrat would beat him nationally.

So I ask again (I really do enjoy when Santorum haters avoid this): Give me someone that is likely to win the Dem nomination that could beat Santorum and show me a map.

[Keystone Phil]

republican:  rick santorum

Besides Santorum vs. Bayh, give me a scenario where Santorum would by like to lose.

Whether you like the guy or hate him, you have to admit that he's not as unelectable as some would love to believe.

Santorum's idiotic ideas about individual rights ( that they shouldn't exist) would destroy him in a national election

He would lose to
Bayh
Clark
Richardson
Vilsack
Kerry
Edwards
and more

He'd lose to Kerry? Good one, Smash.

Show me a map.

[Keystone Phil]

most any democrat would beat him nationally.

So I ask again (I really do enjoy when Santorum haters avoid this): Give me someone that is likely to win the Dem nomination that could beat Santorum and show me a map.

phil, any widely mentioned potential nominee could beat santorum. except hillary or dean.

Great reasoning, Walter. Once again...map please...

[Keystone Phil]

Fix your map, Smash.

[Keystone Phil]

if i were santorum...id worry about 2006.  he really has no room for comfort.

most any democrat would beat him nationally.

Mark my words, Santorum will win... comfortably.  The only candidate who can beat him is Casey and Casey wants to be governor.

We can say that a thousand times and they still won't believe it. They're going to put their faith in Hafer and Hoeffel and really believe they can win!

[Keystone Phil]

We can say that a thousand times and they still won't believe it. They're going to put their faith in Hafer and Hoeffel and really believe they can win!

Rendell obviously isnt running for Senate because he will be running for re-election.  But if he did decide to run for some reason or another could he beat Santorum?

Nope

[Keystone Phil]

if i were santorum...id worry about 2006.  he really has no room for comfort.

most any democrat would beat him nationally.

Mark my words, Santorum will win... comfortably.  The only candidate who can beat him is Casey and Casey wants to be governor.

We can say that a thousand times and they still won't believe it. They're going to put their faith in Hafer and Hoeffel and really believe they can win!

Need I say this again:

Highest approval rating of any sitting Senator

Ha...don't bother, Super. Don't bother. They refuse to listen to that...

[Keystone Phil]

We can say that a thousand times and they still won't believe it. They're going to put their faith in Hafer and Hoeffel and really believe they can win!

Rendell obviously isnt running for Senate because he will be running for re-election.  But if he did decide to run for some reason or another could he beat Santorum?

If the Republicans can manage to field a decent candidate, like Lynn Swann, Redell won't even win his own reelection.

I'm not sure if Swann can beat Rendell but I agree that he isn't a lock for re-election as most Dems, and even many Republicans, believe.

[Keystone Phil]

So wait, Kerry would do better in Ohio against Santorum... a true social populist, than he did against Bush.  It is to laugh.

With someone like bayh as his VP he would

And with someone like Bill Owens on the GOP ticket, Santorum wins CO. Throw out Smash's map...

[Keystone Phil]

So wait, Kerry would do better in Ohio against Santorum... a true social populist, than he did against Bush.  It is to laugh.

With someone like bayh as his VP he would

We saw how Edwards helped Kerry win all those southern states right.  Wait, wrong.

No, no! Let Smash have his way with the VP guessing game. Then we guess Santorum/Owens, and Santorum wins CO and the Presidency.

Start making some new maps, Smash.

[Keystone Phil]

So wait, Kerry would do better in Ohio against Santorum... a true social populist, than he did against Bush.  It is to laugh.

With someone like bayh as his VP he would

And with someone like Bill Owens on the GOP ticket, Santorum wins CO. Throw out Smash's map...

Not so sure about that.  CO is trending Dem and a libertarian leaning state.  His individual rights comments will really hurt him there possibly so bad that Owens can't save him

CO is trending Dem but still a Republican state and Owens is pretty popular there. But if you want to play that game, Edwards was supposed to give Ohio to Kerry. How'd that work out?

[Keystone Phil]

Highest approval rating of any sitting Senator

In Pennsylvania or the entire country?

He has the highest approval rating amounst his constituents of any Senator in the country.

thats wrong.  Last time I saw his approval among Republicans was in the 70's.  Schumer's approval among Dems in NY is in the 80's  (65 overall)

No, I mean, that his approval rating amoung the people of his state.  It is pretty sad that you consider "constituents" to be reflective only of what party you represent.

I don't, but you said highest in the nation.  The six month old poll Keystone likes to refer to so much has Santorum's approval in the mid 50's, thats the highest of either PA senator, but FAR from the highest of any senator in their state

You might be right about Shumer, but have you looked at other polls?  Generally, Senators are either unknown or unliked.

The poll for Chucky might have been among those who knew who he was, whereas the Santorum poll was a general population sample.  Those who conducted the study found it amazing that so many people were able to identify Santorum without any prompting... I think something like 70% of the respondants.

Typically, in a poll, they throw out those who cannot identify the individual.

i think the poll you are referring to was of REPUBLICANS not the general population sample, I do remember seeing a poll of 70 something 5 among Republicans and considering the fact Keystone keeps bringing up the August poll that showed his approval @ 55%, we all know if their was a poll as you suggest of 70% of the population Keystone would have posted it 500 times by now  For the record both Clinton & Schumer have approval ratings in the 60's

And if there was a poll with Santorum with 70% approval rating, what's your point about me posting it about 500 times?

The probably with most Santorum haters, especially you, is that you fail to acknowledge that the people of the Commonwealth of Pennsylvania APPROVE OF THE JOB RICK SANTORUM IS DOING AS A UNITED STATES SENATOR. You let your own dislike for the man cloud your analysis of Santorum's campaigns.

This is for every Santorum-hating Democrat (or Republican): Rick Santorum will be easily re-elected if Bob Casey, Jr. doesn't run. I'd say about a 6 point win for Santorum if he runs against Hoeffel, maybe alittle more against Hafer. You might not like him but the important thing is that a majority of people in PA like him so to sum it up in three words, Get over it.

[Keystone Phil]

Highest approval rating of any sitting Senator

In Pennsylvania or the entire country?

He has the highest approval rating amounst his constituents of any Senator in the country.

thats wrong.  Last time I saw his approval among Republicans was in the 70's.  Schumer's approval among Dems in NY is in the 80's  (65 overall)

No, I mean, that his approval rating amoung the people of his state.  It is pretty sad that you consider "constituents" to be reflective only of what party you represent.

I don't, but you said highest in the nation.  The six month old poll Keystone likes to refer to so much has Santorum's approval in the mid 50's, thats the highest of either PA senator, but FAR from the highest of any senator in their state

You might be right about Shumer, but have you looked at other polls?  Generally, Senators are either unknown or unliked.

The poll for Chucky might have been among those who knew who he was, whereas the Santorum poll was a general population sample.  Those who conducted the study found it amazing that so many people were able to identify Santorum without any prompting... I think something like 70% of the respondants.

Typically, in a poll, they throw out those who cannot identify the individual.

i think the poll you are referring to was of REPUBLICANS not the general population sample, I do remember seeing a poll of 70 something 5 among Republicans and considering the fact Keystone keeps bringing up the August poll that showed his approval @ 55%, we all know if their was a poll as you suggest of 70% of the population Keystone would have posted it 500 times by now  For the record both Clinton & Schumer have approval ratings in the 60's

And if there was a poll with Santorum with 70% approval rating, what's your point about me posting it about 500 times?

The probably with most Santorum haters, especially you, is that you fail to acknowledge that the people of the Commonwealth of Pennsylvania APPROVE OF THE JOB RICK SANTORUM IS DOING AS A UNITED STATES SENATOR. You let your own dislike for the man cloud your analysis of Santorum's campaigns.

This is for every Santorum-hating Democrat (or Republican): Rick Santorum will be easily re-elected if Bob Casey, Jr. doesn't run. I'd say about a 6 point win for Santorum if he runs against Hoeffel, maybe alittle more against Hafer. You might not like him but the important thing is that a majority of people in PA like him so to sum it up in three words, Get over it.

i mention the 500 times thing because when polls reach a certain age they tend to lose their meaning.  Granted their hasn't been a newer poll since, but you mention a 6 month old poll every chance you get.  the poll is 6 Months old.

Atleast I base my arguments on something. danwxman cites some article that says Santorum's ratings are going down but they don't go into detail. My source is much better than that.

But let's say we throw out that poll. What do we base our arguments on? Would you like me to insist that Santorum will get 60% of the vote while you might argue that the Dem will crush him in the General? It makes no sense for me not to cite something of importance.

I just can't wait until they do their poll again. They seem to be starting up again in NJ and CT so Pennsylvania should be pretty soon. And when Santorum's numbers are still in the mid 50s with the probably the lowest disapproval numbers, I'll really enjoy danwxman and others that say Santorum is actually disliked here. Don't think your opinion is shared by Pennsylvania, my friend, because you'll be in for a big surprise.

[Keystone Phil]

You must be logged in to read this quote.

And I'll state here, for the record, that if a new poll comes out showing Santorum down by a significant amount, I will accept that and will have no problem with you guys using that for your arguments. It doesn't mean that I think Santorum won't win but I'll accept that the polls aren't looking as good as they should.

On a national level, I really don't see a realistic Electoral situation (unless it was Bayh vs. Santorum) where Santorum would by likely to lose or lose by the big margins that some suggest.

[Keystone Phil]

2. Could certain Republicans stop playing silly buggers with his approval and/or name recognition numbers.

We're just stating a few things that some Democrats refuse to pay attention to.

[Keystone Phil]

Why is Santorum unelectable?

He's a religious nut.

Besides Bayh vs. Santorum, give me a situation where Santorum would likely lose.

[Keystone Phil]

Santorum is like a moderate Jerry Falwell.

Thanks for not answering my request.