SENATE BILL: Empowering Regions in Federal Elections Amendment (FAILED)

[Napoleon]

Aye

[Kaine for Senate '18]

Aye suppose NAY

[Snowstalker Mk. II]

Aye

[Oakvale]

Eh, I'm not especially invested in the idea either way, but I don't have any major objection to this.

Aye guess.

[Chancellor Tanterterg]

NAY

[Napoleon]

There's very little more disappointing to me than seeing Senators neglect to participate in debate and then vote Nay. Especially Senators that accuse others of not supporting "game reform" or not trusting the President.

Let the people vote on the damn amendment.

[Napoleon]

I did participate in debate. You called the vote when I was still on the fence about this, so I thought about the proposal for a while before deciding that I didn't like it for reasons that I've already described, and voted "Nay."

Excuse me Senator. You did participate in the debate, to an extent, but Senator X was nowhere to be found.

There was over 24 hours between my statement and the vote where you could have given us an opportunity to address your still unknown concerns. You did not do so and are not doing so now when minds and votes can be changes. That is entirely your failing, not mine. I called a vote because debate had ceased.

[Chancellor Tanterterg]

I did participate in debate. You called the vote when I was still on the fence about this, so I thought about the proposal for a while before deciding that I didn't like it for reasons that I've already described, and voted "Nay."

Excuse me Senator. You did participate in the debate, to an extent, but Senator X was nowhere to be found.

There was over 24 hours between my statement and the vote where you could have given us an opportunity to address your still unknown concerns. You did not do so and are not doing so now when minds and votes can be changes. That is entirely your failing, not mine. I called a vote because debate had ceased.

With all due respect Senator Napoleon, I have not missed a single vote and try to participate in debate when possible.  However, I also have to (and I feel I have done a good job of it, I should add) balance real life with Atlasia and to be honest, real life comes first.  I haven't disappeared without explanation, I have never missed a vote, I participate in debate when possible, and feel I have done a pretty [Inks] good job.  But if The People, don't think so, I'd encourage them to let me know (and I'd also welcome any words of support from those who think I'm doing a good job).  That's the whole purpose of my Senate office.  Also, I don't believe in making token posts just to say "well, I said something."  When I take part in a Senate debate, I try to make sure I actually have something valuable to contribute.  Others have expressed my reasons for opposing this bill quite articulately already and things have been extremely busy IRL due to personal issues, but my opposition to this bill stems from my belief that it would both create a great deal of unnecessary confusion and needlessly risk a regional executive simply not opening a voting booth.  Most importantly though, I seem to recall Senator Napoleon arguing that his opposition to my Senatorial Election Reform amendment stemmed from his belief that you shouldn't fix something if it isn't broken.  I believe the Empowering Regions in Federal Elections Amendment does just that!  I also think this is a classic example of "game reform" that simply changes something needlessly, as opposed to addressing an existing issue.  Lastly, I didn't comment during the vote because I voted right as my lunch break was ending, I still have an internship and that comes with responsibilities too!

Also, sorry if my tone is a bit intense, but I'm sure you can relate to the frustration that comes when one feels they are being unfairly attacked.

[Franzl]

Abstain

[Fmr. Pres. Duke]

I posted this in Napoleon's thread, but I wanted to repeat it here:

The reasoning behind the amendment was to spur regional activity. That is a large centerpiece of our platform. Is the current system broken? No. It works. Fine. Great. But a lot of things are "good enough" but they can be made better.

If the amendment passes, we fully expect turnout for the regional seats to drop initially, but we are looking to build a stronger future for the game. We want the regions to be more involved, and allowing them to administer their regional senate seats makes sense, just as allowing the federal government to administer the at-large seats. The returns may not show up now, but it is our goal that they will in the future. I do wish the senate would at least send the amendment to The People or amend it as they wish.

That is my view, at least, but I have been wrong before.

My main argument is yes, the status quo works, but it is not always the perfect solution. We can't simply say this would fail before we try it. I hope that, if we do pass it, it will increase turnout in regional elections and lift them from afterthought status.

[Marokai Backbeat]

https://uselectionatlas.org/AFEWIKI/index.php/TPP#V._Game_Reform

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[Napoleon]

https://uselectionatlas.org/AFEWIKI/index.php/TPP#V._Game_Reform

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I recall Senator X joining the empty quote chorus when they voted on that too. That's why I shrug off the idea that you and I are responsible for not making sure he supported this.

Even if it wasn't one of the few game reform planks in the platform of the party he supposedly joined because of game reform, I would think he would at least let The People decide. I guess not but again, this is why nothing gets done.

[HagridOfTheDeep]

Nay

[Fmr. Pres. Duke]

Maybe the senate can reintroduce a bill that simply gives regions the authority to manage regional senate elections and leave the presidential vote at the federal level? As I said above, it makes sense. And if it goes over well, then maybe we can discuss the presidency.

[HagridOfTheDeep]

Maybe the senate can reintroduce a bill that simply gives regions the authority to manage regional senate elections and leave the presidential vote at the federal level? As I said above, it makes sense. And if it goes over well, then maybe we can discuss the presidency.

That's what I said, but apparently it's a shitty idea.

[Napoleon]

Maybe the senate can reintroduce a bill that simply gives regions the authority to manage regional senate elections and leave the presidential vote at the federal level? As I said above, it makes sense. And if it goes over well, then maybe we can discuss the presidency.

That's what I said, but apparently it's a shitty idea.

I won't be supporting that. I won't even be supporting this if its introduced again. its failed enough times and I think its time for everyone involved to just move on and focus on something that we can be more productive with. Sorry.

[Fmr. Pres. Duke]

Even if Napoleon won't support it, why can't the senate, if the majority would be open to at least starting with regional senators, just amend the bill for that? This doesn't have to be an all-or-nothing thing.

[Napoleon]

Even if Napoleon won't support it, why can't the senate, if the majority would be open to at least starting with regional senators, just amend the bill for that? This doesn't have to be an all-or-nothing thing.

Thats the thing, if it was a majority we'd be fine but we need over 2/3. It's real tough to do and we've tried many, many times. I'm not trying to be black-and-white about it, but at a certain point you have to accept defeat, maybe in a year or so it'll be worth coming back to and giving another look but we have debated this to death. This is like the fourth time we've tried to do something like this and the fourth time it hasn't worked.

None of the Senators voting Nay wanted to offer any amendments or anything, when we were actually debating the amendment.

[Chancellor Tanterterg]

https://uselectionatlas.org/AFEWIKI/index.php/TPP#V._Game_Reform

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I recall Senator X joining the empty quote chorus when they voted on that too. That's why I shrug off the idea that you and I are responsible for not making sure he supported this.

Even if it wasn't one of the few game reform planks in the platform of the party he supposedly joined because of game reform, I would think he would at least let The People decide. I guess not but again, this is why nothing gets done.

As I made clear at the time, there were a number of reasons I left the Liberal Party including the atmosphere of personality politics, unnecessary behind the scenes drama, and extremely nasty attitudes of certain prominent Liberals towards other Atlasians purely due to party ID.  Game reform was a reason, but it was hardly the only reason.  I don't want to reopen newly healed wounds, but this post deserved a response.

[Napoleon]

That's not my point. You tried to claim it was my fault or the administration's fault for not seeing if you we're supporting this. Am I supposed to PM you about every bill or amendment I sponsor? Every indication was that you supported the President's game reform agenda- you talked about an awful lot. You seemed happy to add the plank to your party's platform.

You know very well that I make an effort to contact Senators individually- but I should not HAVE TO. Two weeks and not a peep, while you've been talking about how you support this stuff...its relevant because you tried to make this someone else's fault and in the end you do deserve the blame. I didn't vote for this President but at least when I oppose something his agenda I will specify what and why. Minds can't be changed with silence, Senator and this is not why I voted for you.

[Chancellor Tanterterg]

This is one game reform proposal that I don't support and I have since explained why.  In any event, I have promised to do better going forward.  Overall, I support the President's game reform agenda.  I don't agree with all of your criticisms, but I do think The People deserve better and that is exactly what I am going to give them. 

[Southern Senator North Carolina Yankee]

AYE

[DemPGH]

This one's serious. We'll just need to ensure that Amendments 7, 8, as well as Article VI.15 and V.2 are not breached or violated. Otherwise, giving regions bureaucratic leeway shouldn't be a problem.

[Southern Senator North Carolina Yankee]

This one's serious. We'll just need to ensure that Amendments 7, 8, as well as Article VI.15 and V.2 are not breached or violated. Otherwise, giving regions bureaucratic leeway shouldn't be a problem.

A proactive oversight effort by the SoFE should ensure that all appropriate standards are followed, should it not? Plus the Judiciary and GOR committees would have an interest in policing this as well.

[Southern Senator North Carolina Yankee]

Vote on Senate Passage of the Empowering Regions in Federal Elections Amendment:

Aye (4): Napoleon, NC Yankee, Oakvale, and Snowstalker
Nay (4): Averroës Nix, Ben, HagridoftheDeep, and jdb
Abstain (1): Franzl

Vacant Seats (1): Spamage

This is failing, Duke can call 24 hours on vote changes.