FIFA Confederations Cup 2013 - Official Discussion Thread

[Velasco]

You mean to tell me I'm not a fan or don't understand the game because I dislike a team? I don't think you understand sports, my friend. Now one can certainly dislike a team but still appreciate their contributions. I'm just not that way when it comes to the Spanish.

You are obviously a fan and a great supporter of Italy, but when you say certain things I doubt you really understand the game, sorry. It's not a question relative to your personal tastes; it's understandable that you prefer a style of game to another. Now then, when you say  " the whole world despises to ... ", apart from not being true reveals ignorance or envy. I would never speak this way about the Italy team, in spite of not being a fan of the classic catenaccio style. I use to despise hooligans.

A small example of which not the whole world hates us, though you will be upset with it:

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http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/football/22932625

[Keystone Phil]

Most of the world is tired of Spain dominating the game. I'm sorry that you can't understand that and think that not admiring them means one doesn't understand the game. It's not even necessarily a matter of me not liking the way they play. There's more to it including rivalry, disliking the way they've controlled essentially everything since 2008 (what you might call "envy." I just consider it boring and annoying), the arrogance, etc.

[Velasco]

Definitely it's envy, Phil. It's pretty clear when you mention "arrogance". Rivalry it's OK, but you go a step further. It's not like you must admire the way your rivals play, you can even consider that the game style is boring. I think Brazil is much more boring nowadays, but I would never deny the quality of Brazilian players. You don't even have a consistent argumentation, just ranting. It's OK, but if what you consider "most of the world" includes people without a clue and haters, I wouldn't care too much. Also, envy and bitterness are not good for your health.

[Keystone Phil]

...I never denied the quality of the players or what they have achieved but enough already. It's tiring. And I can say they're disgusting for other reasons. Not sure what has been consistent here besides my presence. You rear your head when your team does well. A bandwagon fan, perhaps? I think I might be on to something...

Anyway, when I say "most of the world," I mean most of the global fans of the game, dude. Don't play a semantics game with me. You know what I mean.

My least favorite side is the French national team. I'd absolutely call them disgusting. You mean to tell me I'm envious of them, too? Please.

[Velasco]

I like how they play, I can appreciate the style that you hate. Even when they not play at 100%, (because no team actually can) and they abuse of horizontal passing, you can see details that you don't see in other teams if you have an eye for subtleties. I'm far away from being a bandwagon fan, among other reasons because I'm far from being a blatant nationalist. There's nothing in the players' or coach's attitudes that you can call arrogance, such claims lack of consistence. In addition, I like the fact that we don't have top stars, like Maradona or Zidane, just humble and generally underrated players with great quality.

[Snowstalker Mk. II]

I know you know I care far less about the game or the team than about seeing you get pissy. Am I a real fan? No. I casually watch the game and casually root for the Spanish national team, mostly because seeing people complain about them being good is fun to see.

[minionofmidas]

Definitely it's envy, Phil. It's pretty clear when you mention "arrogance". Rivalry it's OK, but you go a step further.

No, he just takes it very seriously. Which is bound up with his overall character.

Seeing the Italian-Spanish rivalry in action is always hilarious because for some strange reason the rest of Europe is barely aware of it.

[Keystone Phil]

I know you know I care far less about the game or the team than about seeing you get pissy. Am I a real fan? No. I casually watch the game and casually root for the Spanish national team, mostly because seeing people complain about them being good is fun to see.

So you're an admitted troll? Cool.

[Velasco]

Definitely it's envy, Phil. It's pretty clear when you mention "arrogance". Rivalry it's OK, but you go a step further.

No, he just takes it very seriously. Which is bound up with his overall character.

Seeing the Italian-Spanish rivalry in action is always hilarious because for some strange reason the rest of Europe is barely aware of it.

Yes, of course. I feel sometimes like Snowstalker regarding how amusing is to read people like Phil and Lief getting pissed off. On the other hand, the Evil Empire needs to be defended from time to time, though I usually restrain myself to intervene and bleeding them when we win and they lose. It's just a game that I like to watch when it's well played.

[Keystone Phil]

Again, don't confuse passion with simply being "pissed off." If you're one of the people that's amused by our passion and only "like to watch when it's well played" (and say you're like Snowstalker which is a whole different level of pathetic that we won't get into), then you're not an actual fan. I'm sorry if you can't handle the intensity.

[Velasco]

I like football, but it's not the main issue in my life.  What is amusing is when the excess of passion leads to disproportionate reactions. I felt sad when Barça was crushed by Bayern in the last Champions League, but I'm not the one who's whining because German clubs want to establish the III Reich in the European Football.

[Keystone Phil]

Ok. You're a casual observer. Whatever. Good for you. Please stop whining because some of us are fans. You sit down, watch a match, have some feelings then say, "Ok" when it's finished and turn off the TV. Cool. Some of us have deeper opinions and feelings. That doesn't make us "hooligans" though.

What's most annoying is the casual observer that wants to be a fair weather fan: only rearing your head when your team is doing well. Speaks to a whole bunch of other issues, too, but we won't get into that.  

[Franknburger]

Oh, Phil, you sound like you would be happy to watch football alone. Why aren't you glad about casual observers coming along and joining you in watching this fascinating game? Ignite them, don't scare them away ..

[Keystone Phil]

Oh, Phil, you sound like you would be happy to watch football alone. Why aren't you glad about casual observers coming along and joining you in watching this fascinating game? Ignite them, don't scare them away ..

Considering how animated I get, it's usually best if I watch alone.

I actually watch with casual observer friends of mine from time to time. Hell, I even watch with people that don't know a thing about the game nor care to learn. I watched the Italy-Japan game with some friends (all of them were rooting for Japan mainly to piss me off. One was genuinely rooting for Japan. She's Japanese). I'm cool with it until they start to troll heavily which is what is irritating about people like Snowstalker. I'll take jabs from actual fans and I'll passionately respond but that's part of the game and I can respect those types because they're actually fans.

At the end of the day, I'm a Soccer snob. I don't think anyone will fault me for preferring actual fans over casual observers. That said, the issue here isn't even about me disliking those that only watch from time to time; it's about me rolling my eyes at those types that also choose to poke at real fans. It's pathetic.

[Velasco]

That distinction between "fans" and "casual observers" is amusing too. See, there are different types of fans as well, some of them love and understand the game and others act as plain hooligans. Try to avoid the latter characterization and open yourself a bit. On the other hand, not all "casual observers" are ignorants or lack of passion, and watching sport games with a certain distance and perspective is as respectable as your approach.

[Keystone Phil]

That distinction between "fans" and "casual observers" is amusing too. See, there are different types of fans as well, some of them love and understand the game and others act as plain hooligans. Try to avoid the latter characterization and open yourself a bit.

Maybe you'll practice what you preach and recognize that it isn't one or the other as you made it out to be in your above comment.

I'll take lectures from people that have a clue (i.e., not you) as to what kind of fan I am. Your implication that there are two types of fans and I'm not the kind that loves or understands the game but instead acts like a hooligan is the definition of ignorance.

This thread is for discussing the tournament. We've had enough of your arrogant routine. Discuss the tournament as a fan or dismiss yourself. You've exhausted your other points.

[Iosif]

I don't think I've cared less about a tournament.

International football is dead. August can't come soon enough.

[Keystone Phil]

I don't think I've cared less about a tournament.

International football is dead. August can't come soon enough.

Oh, come on. This one has been more exciting at least compared to 2009.

[Velasco]

I'll take lectures from people that have a clue (i.e., not you) as to what kind of fan I am. Your implication that there are two types of fans and I'm not the kind that loves or understands the game but instead acts like a hooligan is the definition of ignorance.

This thread is for discussing the tournament. We've had enough of your arrogant routine. Discuss the tournament as a fan or dismiss yourself. You've exhausted your other points.

You are ridicoulous, bro. People who loves the game is ready to recognize the merits of rivals when they are superior, which is not the equivalent of licking their boots -as you seem to believe- and it's the opposite of arrogance. You are not really discussing the tournament, just exposing your philias and phobias. I'm so arrogant that I will quote something related with the moral winners of the tournament that I found funny:

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http://www.guardian.co.uk/football/2013/jun/20/spain-tahiti-confederations-cup-live

It's not only a correct analysis of the match, but a sample of something you're lacking: sense of humour. I'm sure you would feel outraged if someone wrote "ignominy" after an Italy's landslide victory against an amateur team.

[Lief 🗽]

I support Phil.

Every time a Spanish player makes a horizontal pass to the guy a few feet away from him, football dies a little bit more.

[Keystone Phil]

I'll take lectures from people that have a clue (i.e., not you) as to what kind of fan I am. Your implication that there are two types of fans and I'm not the kind that loves or understands the game but instead acts like a hooligan is the definition of ignorance.

This thread is for discussing the tournament. We've had enough of your arrogant routine. Discuss the tournament as a fan or dismiss yourself. You've exhausted your other points.

You are ridicoulous, bro. People who loves the game is ready to recognize the merits of rivals when they are superior,

Which I've already done, bro. Several times during this conversation, in my fact.

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No, the arrogance is your behavior, demanding people worship the team and cannot dare say that they despise them.

I think you're having a very hard time acknowledging a simple point: one can dislike a team, find then disgusting, etc. and still acknowledge that they've dominated and deserve credit. It's the never ending credit and dominance that gets irritating.

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Who the hell are you? This is what I'm talking about when I mention the arrogance especially of some fair weather fan: you come in here about five pages into the thread to brag about "your team," single out a comment I made about disliking "your team" then have the audacity to say that I am not discussing the tournament? Look, bro, I can take your other nonsense but don't tell me that I'm not discussing the tournament. Get over yourself. Get over "your team." Please don't think that my comments here are just about the Spanish side.  

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Uh, no. Again, please check yourself out of this conversation. We'll surely have to deal with you next time "your team" wins. Break out your plastic flag! Make sure you have your phone set to scoring updates! Gooooo España!

[Velasco]

No, the arrogance is your behavior, demanding people worship the team and cannot dare say that they despise them.

I'll restrain myself to reply except in this point. I don't pretend that you pay tribute. However, you are pretending that everybody hates "that despicable team". And it's childish despising a team or a style because you cannot stand that they win. I don't want to tell you how people felt when Italy was winning tournaments with that orthodox catennaccio philosophy. That was really a boring way to win, but at least most people conceded that Italy had a great defense and was an extremely competitive team, although some found catenaccio disgusting.

Apparently, you will never admit that it's possible to win with another set of values, despicable in your view. If you had a little notion of what means class or sportmanship, bro... but you tend to mix up your phobias with objectivity. You are acting here like an unthinking hooligan. That's all.

On the other hand, I think commenting a tournament has more to do with talking about aspects of the game. Something that I'd like to do in other circumstances. Don't worry, if Italy wins I will congratulate you.

[Tender Branson]

My predictions:

3-1 Brazil vs. Uruguay
4-1 Spain vs. Italy (sorry Phil, but I think they will re-destroy them ...)

[NewYorkExpress]

Uraguay 2 Brazil 1

Spain 3 Italy 0.. Balotelli's out otherwise the Azzuri might have had a fighting chance.

[Franknburger]

I don't think we will see many goals between Spain and Italy. Without wanting to get involved into discussing Spanish football philosophy, they tend to have a rather poor finish (possibly their biggest weakness, and the main reason why other teams can hope to compete with them). Italy, OTOH, excels both defensively and in their finish, with room for improvement in-between. So, it will at maximum be a 1:1 after full time, most likely a 1:0. I predict something like 65:35 ball possession in favour of Spain, 16:5 shots on goal (on target 3:3), and give Italy a 49% chance to score the winning goal (possibly around the 40th minute).

Oh, and by the way: You can be a fan of your team, an at the same time respect other teams, and admit it if  the other team was better.  Check out this
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4gkqL0I20sI

and this
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6ntOEkT6ggs

and this
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_mrmnlxqIqg
(also look at the comments!)