Do "nice guys finish last"?

[opebo]

This works all the time in real life, Opebo. Just not ever with the kind of girls you'd like it to work on.

I'm assuming you mean 'the kind of girls that one would like it to work on', rather than just referring to my preference.  So upon what kind of girls does it work?  The gullible only??

[Starbucks Union Thug HokeyPuck]

This works all the time in real life, Opebo. Just not ever with the kind of girls you'd like it to work on.

I'm assuming you mean 'the kind of girls that one would like it to work on', rather than just referring to my preference.  So upon what kind of girls does it work?  The gullible only??

Just the dumbs, which is a huge number of them in this day and age, unfortunately.  (or fortunately, depending on what you go for)

[Antonio the Sixth]

All women (notice I said "women", not "girls") like confidence.

There is no such a thing as "all women". There are only individuals.

Eh, I think confidence is pretty much universally considered an attractive trait. I'd be comfortable saying that all women find confidence attractive as a general, sweeping statement.

As our resident sexist Memphis has illustrated, it's a bit more complicated than that. The dominant norm is still assertive man/submissive woman, and those who defy this norm, guys and girls alike, are often disadvantaged.

Of course, extreme insecurity is a turnoff regardless of gender. So is extreme arrogance. But the point is that society doesn't hold men and women to the same standard regarding what the "proper" level of confidence is.

Here is what I was talking about, FTR. http://everydayfeminism.com/2012/12/but-why-do-some-women-go-for-aholes/

[Gustaf]

I read the title and I expect a trainwreck. I've only read the first page though.

On relationships, lots of women like confidence but it's far from as universal as some of you seem to think. There is generally a lot of conflating of different concepts here as well. Confidence, being nice, being shy, being yourself and so on are all different things. They're neither synonyms nor antonyms.

In life, it depends on society. Western society is not typically structured to punish niceness that much. Sure, if you want to be president of the US you may not be able to afford being too nice. But nice people generally do well for themselves in life. They get great partners, careers and so on.

[Gustaf]

I have an encouraging anecdote on this actually. I was with this girl and we came back late from a museum where there was only the two of us and some old lady left, so we traveled with her back to the city. I made polite conversation all the way with the old lady about her grandchildren and whatnot.

Once me and the girl got inside her door (I was staying at her place), she told me that she was impressed by how nice I had been to this old lady and that it turned her on a lot and she wanted to do me now.

(to be fair, this was not the first time or anything, but still. Being nice does not need be a turn-off. )

[Ban my account ffs!]

Opinion of the phrase "nice guys finish last"

http://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=nice%20guys

True or false?
Only true in certain spheres of life?
More true in the US than elsewhere?

Attractive nice guys finish first every time.

It's just that there is some correlation between assholeishness and attractiveness.  Many assholes are ridiculously good looking.

Predictably, ugly assholes tend to underperform or tend to gravitate towards women who were abused and tend to seek out abusive men.

But yeah... our economic system is set up so that sociopaths do well.. and both political parties (but especially the GOP) praise and laud sociopathy as a desirable trait to "get ahead".  It's very sad, really.

[Kitteh]

Opinion of the phrase "nice guys finish last"

http://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=nice%20guys

True or false?
Only true in certain spheres of life?
More true in the US than elsewhere?

Attractive nice guys finish first every time.

It's just that there is some correlation between assholeishness and attractiveness.  Many assholes are ridiculously good looking.

Predictably, ugly assholes tend to underperform or tend to gravitate towards women who were abused and tend to seek out abusive men.

But yeah... our economic system is set up so that sociopaths do well.. and both political parties (but especially the GOP) praise and laud sociopathy as a desirable trait to "get ahead".  It's very sad, really.

Only on atlas do people blame the GOP for "nice guys finishing last".

[MaxQue]

Opinion of the phrase "nice guys finish last"

http://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=nice%20guys

True or false?
Only true in certain spheres of life?
More true in the US than elsewhere?

Attractive nice guys finish first every time.

It's just that there is some correlation between assholeishness and attractiveness.  Many assholes are ridiculously good looking.

Predictably, ugly assholes tend to underperform or tend to gravitate towards women who were abused and tend to seek out abusive men.

But yeah... our economic system is set up so that sociopaths do well.. and both political parties (but especially the GOP) praise and laud sociopathy as a desirable trait to "get ahead".  It's very sad, really.

Only on atlas do people blame the GOP for "nice guys finishing last".

Well, no. If that thing happens (I have no opinion on the question of the title), that's because of the society. Society doesn't give gaive back if you're nice. Society and especially politics are favoring ruthless people ready to do all to reach their goals.

[Kitteh]

Opinion of the phrase "nice guys finish last"

http://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=nice%20guys

True or false?
Only true in certain spheres of life?
More true in the US than elsewhere?

Attractive nice guys finish first every time.

It's just that there is some correlation between assholeishness and attractiveness.  Many assholes are ridiculously good looking.

Predictably, ugly assholes tend to underperform or tend to gravitate towards women who were abused and tend to seek out abusive men.

But yeah... our economic system is set up so that sociopaths do well.. and both political parties (but especially the GOP) praise and laud sociopathy as a desirable trait to "get ahead".  It's very sad, really.

Only on atlas do people blame the GOP for "nice guys finishing last".

Well, no. If that thing happens (I have no opinion on the question of the title), that's because of the society. Society doesn't give gaive back if you're nice. Society and especially politics are favoring ruthless people ready to do all to reach their goals.

I know. It's just that bringing the Republican Party into a discussion of whether "nice guys finish last" is one of the most characteristically Atlas things imaginable.

[Kitteh]

Nice guys finish last because all too often, women think that the guy is either gay or asexual/bisexual. Be the dominant person in the relationship and women will treat you better.

Bisexual dudes totally have an easier time getting women than straight dudes.

(Not that that helped me when I was a bisexual guy, but I was a socially awkward 15 year old so yeah ) 

[Bacon King]

I always try my best to be a nice person and I think it's helped my love life a lot. In fact the only actions I ever really regret are those times when it turned out I was an asshole

[opebo]

But yeah... our economic system is set up so that sociopaths do well.. and both political parties (but especially the GOP) praise and laud sociopathy as a desirable trait to "get ahead".  It's very sad, really.

Only on atlas do people blame the GOP for "nice guys finishing last".

Well really he was blaming capitalism, which is of course fairly accurate.

[politicus]

Opinion of the phrase "nice guys finish last"

http://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=nice%20guys

True or false?
Only true in certain spheres of life?
More true in the US than elsewhere?

Attractive nice guys finish first every time.

It's just that there is some correlation between assholeishness and attractiveness.  Many assholes are ridiculously good looking.

Predictably, ugly assholes tend to underperform or tend to gravitate towards women who were abused and tend to seek out abusive men.

But yeah... our economic system is set up so that sociopaths do well.. and both political parties (but especially the GOP) praise and laud sociopathy as a desirable trait to "get ahead".  It's very sad, really.

Only on atlas do people blame the GOP for "nice guys finishing last".

Well, no. If that thing happens (I have no opinion on the question of the title), that's because of the society. Society doesn't give gaive back if you're nice. Society and especially politics are favoring ruthless people ready to do all to reach their goals.

I know. It's just that bringing the Republican Party into a discussion of whether "nice guys finish last" is one of the most characteristically Atlas things imaginable.

Actually there probably is a left/right divide in the perception of niceness.

A recent study of voters reaction to candidate pictures on Danish election campaign posters showed that left wing voters and right wing voters agreed on which candidates came off as friendly and nice, but while left wing voters perceived this as an attractive trait and was more willing to vote for "nice" people, right wing voters found it unattractive and were less willing to vote for "nice" candidates. Apparently right wingers associated "niceness" with being soft, ineffective and weak.

I think this basic pattern could probably be generalized to most western countries.   

[angus]

Apparently right wingers associated "niceness" with being soft, ineffective and weak.

I think this basic pattern could probably be generalized to most western countries.   

I think Churchill and his crocodiles would approve of your conclusions.

[FEMA Camp Administrator]

This thread is just lovely. Aside form the last page which seems to be nearly of substance, this thread is largely comprised of people calling each other sexist and so on. God Bless America (and all the other countries these posters hail from). I guess frustration with not getting a job makes you a communist, and being annoyed at one's priest from time to time is indicative of atheism.

[politicus]

This thread is just lovely. Aside form the last page which seems to be nearly of substance, this thread is largely comprised of people calling each other sexist and so on. God Bless America (and all the other countries these posters hail from). I guess frustration with not getting a job makes you a communist, and being annoyed at one's priest from time to time is indicative of atheism.

I agree and since I pretty much knew that certain posters would reveal certain less flattering sides of their personality in this thread you might say that my little experiment wasn't really all that nice to begin with.

[Gustaf]

This thread is just lovely. Aside form the last page which seems to be nearly of substance, this thread is largely comprised of people calling each other sexist and so on. God Bless America (and all the other countries these posters hail from). I guess frustration with not getting a job makes you a communist, and being annoyed at one's priest from time to time is indicative of atheism.

Well, any thread concerning women will bring out a lot of sexism, so...

http://femfreq.tumblr.com/post/52673540142/twitter-vs-female-protagonists-in-video-games

[Antonio the Sixth]

This thread is just lovely. Aside form the last page which seems to be nearly of substance, this thread is largely comprised of people calling each other sexist and so on. God Bless America (and all the other countries these posters hail from). I guess frustration with not getting a job makes you a communist, and being annoyed at one's priest from time to time is indicative of atheism.

I agree and since I pretty much knew that certain posters would reveal certain less flattering sides of their personality in this thread you might say that my little experiment wasn't really all that nice to begin with.

Honestly, I'm positively surprised. There hasn't been nearly as much sexism in this thread as one would expect considering the forum's past feats. Of course, there are still the usual generalizations...

[Ban my account ffs!]

This thread is just lovely. Aside form the last page which seems to be nearly of substance, this thread is largely comprised of people calling each other sexist and so on. God Bless America (and all the other countries these posters hail from). I guess frustration with not getting a job makes you a communist, and being annoyed at one's priest from time to time is indicative of atheism.

I agree and since I pretty much knew that certain posters would reveal certain less flattering sides of their personality in this thread you might say that my little experiment wasn't really all that nice to begin with.

I know a certain Santa Claus who'll be skipping over Politcus' house next Christmas

[angus]

Well, any thread concerning women will bring out a lot of sexism, so...

true, but this wasn't a thread about women.  it was either a thread about baseball or possibly a thread about politics.  

[Grumpier Than Uncle Joe]

Well, any thread concerning women will bring out a lot of sexism, so...

true, but this wasn't a thread about women.  it was either a thread about baseball or possibly a thread about politics.  

And about Gustaf getting laid.

[Lief 🗽]

Have any of you impecunious and humpbacked losers ever pulled off this pretense successfully?

If you ask Atlas any question in the form of "Have any of you ever [something related to girls]?" the answer is always going to be no. Especially if you add the qualifier "successfully" at the end.

Well you're quite right, there's no doubt I'm asking the wrong group, but I'm just curious in general if such subterfuges can work 'in life'.  I guess the obvious answer is - pretty damned rarely, if at all.

Isn't that what "pickup artists" or whatever they call themselves do?

[opebo]

Well you're quite right, there's no doubt I'm asking the wrong group, but I'm just curious in general if such subterfuges can work 'in life'.  I guess the obvious answer is - pretty damned rarely, if at all.

Isn't that what "pickup artists" or whatever they call themselves do?

I suppose so. 

[Bacon King]

Yeah, ^^^^^ to Lief.

Pickup Artistry, at its core, is basically "be a sociopath and manipulate women into sleeping with you by strategically using psychological abuse. Also, share your exploits on the Internet with fellow deranged chauvinists- but make sure you use a ton of acronym-filled jargon!"

[Napoleon]

Do nice guys finish at all?

Im also reminded of the scene from Season One of Game of Thrones.

"You dont fihht with honor" "No, but he did"