Bush/Cheney v Gore/Kerry
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  Presidential Elections - Analysis and Discussion
  Election What-ifs? (Moderator: Dereich)
  Bush/Cheney v Gore/Kerry
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Author Topic: Bush/Cheney v Gore/Kerry  (Read 6574 times)
California Dreamer
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« on: April 04, 2004, 12:58:53 AM »

Jonh Kerry was Gore's 2nd choice...in such a close election would it have made a difference

Lieberman was a comprimise choice, much of which was trying to provide cover for the Clinton indescesions. Lieberman was the 'moral authority'. Had Clinton not been caught playing hide the cigar Kerry would have been the VP nominee.

so...would Kerry have helped carry any other states? like New Hampshire?

would Nader have got less support with a less conservative VP?
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Michael Z
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« Reply #1 on: April 04, 2004, 07:14:53 AM »

I'm not sure if it would've made much of a difference. Kerry might have fared better in the debates against Cheney, but that's about it.
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Ben.
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« Reply #2 on: April 04, 2004, 09:13:21 AM »

 Florida would have been less close... however I think you can shave 1.5% off Nader in NH and more else where (WI, MN, IA, WA... new England generally) as many liberals would see it as a nod towards the liberal wing of the party and that would mean more of them would support Gore... so Gore wins NH and the election imho.... but it would be just as tough as in reality...
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Miamiu1027
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« Reply #3 on: April 04, 2004, 09:27:40 AM »

I thought Edwards would have been his second choice...but Lieberman, Kerry, Edwards, and Landrieu were all on the 'short list'.

Kerry would have done NOTHING to help the ticket.
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Ben.
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« Reply #4 on: April 04, 2004, 09:33:37 AM »

I thought Edwards would have been his second choice...but Lieberman, Kerry, Edwards, and Landrieu were all on the 'short list'.

Kerry would have done NOTHING to help the ticket.

Landrieu!... she would have been great!... or Edwards both before Kerry... but Kerry could have helped with some more moderate Nader voters who where in effect voting in protest at the rightward shift by Clinton after 1996...
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Miamiu1027
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« Reply #5 on: April 04, 2004, 09:38:38 AM »

Kerry would have done nothing but secure some of the more conservative towns in Massachusetts.

If he had picked Kerry, Gore would have lost Florida by a greater margin.  Lieberman really helped in Broward and Dade, I think.
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Miamiu1027
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« Reply #6 on: April 04, 2004, 09:56:45 AM »

Kerry wouldn't have swung NH, remember, NH hates MA.
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zachman
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« Reply #7 on: April 04, 2004, 07:11:54 PM »

NH doesn't hate Massachusetts anymore. Most of our newcomers move from there. I think Kerry would have hurt Gore a little bit. I know some fellow Jews who sitched there vote to Gore because of Lieberman. I guess it could have helped in the South, but just about anyone who would vote against a Jew would vote against a Catholic. I think it would have certainly hurt Kerry's shot in 20004 though, pending identical outcomes.
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Ben.
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« Reply #8 on: April 04, 2004, 08:36:19 PM »
« Edited: April 04, 2004, 08:36:47 PM by Ben »

NH doesn't hate Massachusetts anymore. Most of our newcomers move from there. I think Kerry would have hurt Gore a little bit. I know some fellow Jews who sitched there vote to Gore because of Lieberman. I guess it could have helped in the South, but just about anyone who would vote against a Jew would vote against a Catholic. I think it would have certainly hurt Kerry's shot in 20004 though, pending identical outcomes.

Yeah 20,004 would have been a bumber for Kerry Smiley


Sorry just couldnt let that one slip....
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A-Max
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« Reply #9 on: April 04, 2004, 08:47:54 PM »

I don't think that Kerry being Catholic will hurt his vote at all.  If Lieberman can help garner 48% of the vote while Jews represent only about 6%, I seriously doubt that a Catholic population representing about 26% can't do as well.   The difference is that Lieberman is a dedicated Jew, whereas Kerry is a wishy-washy Catholic.   I'm one Catholic  who will proudly vote for Bush.
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« Reply #10 on: April 04, 2004, 09:07:25 PM »
« Edited: April 04, 2004, 09:08:48 PM by setyourselfonfire »

huh? Jews are like 1-2% of the vote.

I doubt being Catholic will hurt him at all though. Being Jewish hurt Gore/Lieberman among Muslim voters though.

Of course lots of Jews probably voted for Gore/Lieberman partially for that reason. Kerry won't get any extra support for being Catholic, since ultra-Catholics hate his liberal social issues stances.
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A-Max
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« Reply #11 on: April 04, 2004, 09:11:03 PM »

True, but Kerry has revealed that his grandparents were Jews, so that may hurt him with Muslims again.  Bush got more than 80% of the Muslim vote in 2000, but he'll be lucky to get half that this time.
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dunn
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« Reply #12 on: April 05, 2004, 04:32:53 AM »

huh? Jews are like 1-2% of the vote.

I doubt being Catholic will hurt him at all though. Being Jewish hurt Gore/Lieberman among Muslim voters though.

Of course lots of Jews probably voted for Gore/Lieberman partially for that reason. Kerry won't get any extra support for being Catholic, since ultra-Catholics hate his liberal social issues stances.

Gore /Lieberman got the usual 70% or so the dems get from jewish voters
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Reaganfan
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« Reply #13 on: April 05, 2004, 07:01:14 AM »

Gore/Lieberman was a strong ticket for Bush/Cheney to beat. But they did. Gore/Kerry would have been less of a ticket to even beat.
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Miamiu1027
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« Reply #14 on: April 05, 2004, 08:29:48 AM »

You know something---

I was mad when Gore picked Lieberman, but in hindsight, it probably was the best possible choice.
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TeePee4Prez
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« Reply #15 on: April 11, 2004, 09:29:30 PM »

I don't think that Kerry being Catholic will hurt his vote at all.  If Lieberman can help garner 48% of the vote while Jews represent only about 6%, I seriously doubt that a Catholic population representing about 26% can't do as well.   The difference is that Lieberman is a dedicated Jew, whereas Kerry is a wishy-washy Catholic.   I'm one Catholic  who will proudly vote for Bush.

Me being a Catholic doesn't affect my vote AT ALL!!!  In fact I am itching to boot Santorum in 2006.  In fact I would also vote Specter over Toomey if it were between them two in a primary.  I'm starting to think there are NO moderate Catholics anymore!  You either have to be a Mass. extreme liberal or a nut-job pro-life  conservative.  
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JFK-II
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« Reply #16 on: April 12, 2004, 12:56:43 AM »

This is really interesting because in my prediction before the VP selection in 2000 i had Gore/Kerry vs Bush Cheney, I think Gore would have won the election....talk to Gore in private and he is still kicking himself for chosing lieberman. The reason why Flordia was so close in 2000 was not due to the jewish voters, but African-Americans....Lieberman had nothing to do with than.

What Kerry would have brought to the ticket would have been a strong voice to go against Bush. Remember Lieberman was absent from most of the campaign due to "religious reasons" and he even failed to show up for the debate (metaphorically) with Cheney. Picking Lieberman is why Gore is not president, he chose him to "send a message" which is the absolute wrong reason to chose a VP candidate.

Motto of the story kids, running scared is a good strategy for failure, throughout the entire 2000 campaign you could tell that the thing that Gore feared the most was losing and he ran the most uninspired campaign as a result, the net result of which is he lost, now how about that.

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California Dreamer
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« Reply #17 on: April 12, 2004, 01:13:55 AM »

excelent points JFK

one only needs to look at democratic primaries of this year to see that there is no such thing as 'joementum'...Kerry would have been a much better VP candidate and would have excelled in the traditional role of 'attack dog', allowing Gore to remain 'presidential'.

As it turned out Lieberman was waay to much of Mr Nice guy.  He is a good man, but a bad candidate.

I feel fairly certain Gore would have won with Kerry on the ticket.
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JohnFKennedy
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« Reply #18 on: April 12, 2004, 03:45:53 AM »

This is really interesting because in my prediction before the VP selection in 2000 i had Gore/Kerry vs Bush Cheney, I think Gore would have won the election....talk to Gore in private and he is still kicking himself for chosing lieberman. The reason why Flordia was so close in 2000 was not due to the jewish voters, but African-Americans....Lieberman had nothing to do with than.

What Kerry would have brought to the ticket would have been a strong voice to go against Bush. Remember Lieberman was absent from most of the campaign due to "religious reasons" and he even failed to show up for the debate (metaphorically) with Cheney. Picking Lieberman is why Gore is not president, he chose him to "send a message" which is the absolute wrong reason to chose a VP candidate.

Motto of the story kids, running scared is a good strategy for failure, throughout the entire 2000 campaign you could tell that the thing that Gore feared the most was losing and he ran the most uninspired campaign as a result, the net result of which is he lost, now how about that.



welcome to the forum, interesting, similar names, same state.....
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Michael Z
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« Reply #19 on: April 12, 2004, 05:19:05 AM »

This is really interesting because in my prediction before the VP selection in 2000 i had Gore/Kerry vs Bush Cheney, I think Gore would have won the election....talk to Gore in private and he is still kicking himself for chosing lieberman. The reason why Flordia was so close in 2000 was not due to the jewish voters, but African-Americans....Lieberman had nothing to do with than.

What Kerry would have brought to the ticket would have been a strong voice to go against Bush. Remember Lieberman was absent from most of the campaign due to "religious reasons" and he even failed to show up for the debate (metaphorically) with Cheney. Picking Lieberman is why Gore is not president, he chose him to "send a message" which is the absolute wrong reason to chose a VP candidate.

Motto of the story kids, running scared is a good strategy for failure, throughout the entire 2000 campaign you could tell that the thing that Gore feared the most was losing and he ran the most uninspired campaign as a result, the net result of which is he lost, now how about that.

Very good analysis. I never looked at it that way before, but it definitely makes sense.

Anyway, welcome to the forum! Smiley
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