House passes farm bill, eliminating Food Stamps

[tpfkaw]

I will mention that I've worked in the supermarket industry and you would not believe how many people pay with an EBT card and then walk to their brand-new car.  Several people had Mercedes-Benzes, BMWs, Cadillacs etc.

You're right, I wouldn't believe it.

I've never been to a supermarket where the cashier was free to see what my car looks like.

Roche Bros, cashiers are frequently assigned to bagging duty.

[memphis]

Anybody who thinks that clothes, cars, and other assorted bric a brac are good measures of wealth has obviously never had any.

[tpfkaw]

Anybody who thinks that clothes, cars, and other assorted bric a brac are good measures of wealth has obviously never had any.

A brand-new $60,000 Mercedes-Benz is not a good measure of wealth?  Okay, Your Majesty.

[dead0man]

Well, if all the woman in question was doing was sitting around her rented rooms with her two kids, she'd have the time, but I doubt you or krazen want her to be doing just that.

I have no idea what you're trying to imply, but good job not being a dick about it!

You must be logged in to read this quote.

A sandwich, a bowl of soup and an apple.  BAM! A glass of juice on the side.  4 funking minutes.  Not everything has to be a 5 course meal with the exact right amount of vitamins and calories.  Especially if you don't have very much money.

or an egg, a bowl of cereal, a banana and a glass of milk.  8 minutes

or some rice, a corn dog, some green beans and some tea.  12 minutes

or...well, you get the idea.


(actually, you will no doubt have some huge problem that isn't really a problem with this too.  I have NO problem with the food stamp program, I actually think farm subsidies are MUCH worse for everybody.  I've been poor.  I could have been on food stamps, I was on WIC (well, I wasn't, but I've certainly used the checks and even went to a WIC "store" in Mississippi because it was cheaper for them than handing out checks).  Hell, I'm still poor.  Kids are expensive even when you're a cheap ass like me.  I just thinks it's ridiculous and unfair to assume everybody must spend hours preparing healthy meals every day when you clearly don't have to.  I'd question the sanity of anybody that would...unless they are into that kind of thing, then more power to 'em.)

[AkSaber]

I actually think farm subsidies are MUCH worse for everybody.

So do I. I've always felt welfare for the wealthy was far more expensive and detrimental for an economy than welfare for the poor.

[dead0man]

Anybody who thinks that clothes, cars, and other assorted bric a brac are good measures of wealth has obviously never had any.

I've certainly never had any, but I know if you're driving a car that costs more than $25k and you're using food stamps, you're probably an asshole.  And I think the same thing of all Christians.


edit-I didn't mean that all Christians are assholes, just that all Christians driving expensive cars are assholes.  Even more so preachers in Caddies.

[True Federalist (진정한 연방 주의자)]

And you try fixing something more nutritious than pasta and sauce from scratch in under 20 minutes, including prep time and cleanup.

A sandwich, a bowl of soup and an apple.  BAM! A glass of juice on the side.  4 funking minutes.
[/quote]

I wasn't aware that opening a can of soup counted as from scratch.  As for fruit juice, that's barely better than soda whether fresh squeezed or from a container.  It's still sugar water, just without the carbonation and a few vitamins.

OTOH, I will agree that without an excessive amount of time or effort, tho certainly more than merely 4 minutes, soups and stews could be made that would be far healthier than the sodium saturated canned variety, assuming she has access to a slow cooker and a place to let it sit without being a fire hazard.

[barfbag]

I will mention that I've worked in the supermarket industry and you would not believe how many people pay with an EBT card and then walk to their brand-new car.  Several people had Mercedes-Benzes, BMWs, Cadillacs etc.

Or have a $200 outfit on.

Tell us more about how you evaluate the clothing costs of SNAP recipients.

You aren't able to tell how much clothes cost by looking at them? I've been trained by my security job to read people based on the way they wear their hair, tie their shoes, hold their phones, walk, laugh, smile, stand, use arm gesture, and several other ways. You're saying you can't tell how much an article of clothing or outfit costs by looking at it? If you're able to see the color, you can tell how much it costs. I'm not being mean either, I'm referring to very basic knowledge. I doubt the job training I've had from security work is a hidden or special talent unique to me or my coworkers. Also, I read another response below and I feel I'm extremely generous when it comes to food stamps. People have the right not to starve and those who are poor tend to not have as many successful means to cook with. I'm not saying we should provide three Thanksgiving meals a day for everyone below a certain income, but $12 a day per person isn't a lot in every situation especially when kids are involved and other expenses need to be paid too. I'm pretty sure I mentioned though that there are abusers of food stamps. As a cashier I witnessed several food stamp users max out their EBT cards, then purchase a second order of junk food, soda, chips, ice cream, cookies, frozen dog treats, gum, candy, and cheap toys that will break before they get home. I've seen other food stamp users max out their EBT cards and then break a $100 bill to buy a case of beer. People shouldn't starve and I don't feel $12 a day is extreme in every case as I mentioned before. Food stamps also benefit the food industry which is very important.

[dead0man]

I wasn't aware that opening a can of soup counted as from scratch.  As for fruit juice, that's barely better than soda whether fresh squeezed or from a container.  It's still sugar water, just without the carbonation and a few vitamins.

OTOH, I will agree that without an excessive amount of time or effort, tho certainly more than merely 4 minutes, soups and stews could be made that would be far healthier than the sodium saturated canned variety, assuming she has access to a slow cooker and a place to let it sit without being a fire hazard.

Why must things be "made from scratch"?  Sure, I'd agree that everything else being equal, "made from scratch" is better, but most people, those on SNAP or not, don't have the time (or knowledge) for that.  You can eat healthy and cheaply making things that aren't made from scratch.

But nevermind all that, what do you want everybody to drink?  Does that need to be made from scratch too?  Does every meal need to be made from scratch to meet your approval?  Can lunch or breakfast be something fast and easy or should every meal in the day take 3 hours to prepare?  Do you have a "made from scratch" meal everyday?  3 a day?  Who makes them for you?  Do you expect everybody else to do it too?  Are you disappointed when you find out your friends and family don't live up to your, frankly, outrageous expectations?

[barfbag]

I wasn't aware that opening a can of soup counted as from scratch.  As for fruit juice, that's barely better than soda whether fresh squeezed or from a container.  It's still sugar water, just without the carbonation and a few vitamins.

OTOH, I will agree that without an excessive amount of time or effort, tho certainly more than merely 4 minutes, soups and stews could be made that would be far healthier than the sodium saturated canned variety, assuming she has access to a slow cooker and a place to let it sit without being a fire hazard.

Why must things be "made from scratch"?  Sure, I'd agree that everything else being equal, "made from scratch" is better, but most people, those on SNAP or not, don't have the time (or knowledge) for that.  You can eat healthy and cheaply making things that aren't made from scratch.

But nevermind all that, what do you want everybody to drink?  Does that need to be made from scratch too?  Does every meal need to be made from scratch to meet your approval?  Can lunch or breakfast be something fast and easy or should every meal in the day take 3 hours to prepare?  Do you have a "made from scratch" meal everyday?  3 a day?  Who makes them for you?  Do you expect everybody else to do it too?  Are you disappointed when you find out your friends and family don't live up to your, frankly, outrageous expectations?

My dad's family ate every meal from scratch when he was growing up and all clothes were made from scratch and handed down to the younger children. They had one car and all pulled together to do household chores. As a result, my father became a professional engineer and his brothers became an accountant, school principal, and a tax attorney. His sister married a doctor. Their family was an example of what could ideally be every household in America. Most people would be shocked to hear that my grandfather was the dean of science and engineering at a private college, a successful businessman who ran his own engineering company, was on the township board as their engineer, very active within his church, had his own woodshop in the basement, raced formula V cars, was the president of AAA in their country, and benefited from his timeshare in Florida. The reason I'm saying how he did so much with his life is not only to inspire people, but to point out that simply because a family has money doesn't mean that even they have to live cushy lifestyles. My grandfather was very smart with how he managed his money and raised his family. My father will be 49 next month and I'm now close with my grandmother who is 74. I'm stating their ages to demonstrate that what I've described took place in fairly modern times; 1960-1990.

[True Federalist (진정한 연방 주의자)]

I wasn't aware that opening a can of soup counted as from scratch.  As for fruit juice, that's barely better than soda whether fresh squeezed or from a container.  It's still sugar water, just without the carbonation and a few vitamins.

OTOH, I will agree that without an excessive amount of time or effort, tho certainly more than merely 4 minutes, soups and stews could be made that would be far healthier than the sodium saturated canned variety, assuming she has access to a slow cooker and a place to let it sit without being a fire hazard.

Why must things be "made from scratch"?  Sure, I'd agree that everything else being equal, "made from scratch" is better, but most people, those on SNAP or not, don't have the time (or knowledge) for that.  You can eat healthy and cheaply making things that aren't made from scratch.

But nevermind all that, what do you want everybody to drink?  Does that need to be made from scratch too?  Does every meal need to be made from scratch to meet your approval?  Can lunch or breakfast be something fast and easy or should every meal in the day take 3 hours to prepare?  Do you have a "made from scratch" meal everyday?  3 a day?  Who makes them for you?  Do you expect everybody else to do it too?  Are you disappointed when you find out your friends and family don't live up to your, frankly, outrageous expectations?

Well in a healthy diet, water is quite sufficient, especially if you have food you want to enjoy rather than wash down.  As for knowledge, it takes fairly little knowledge to make a basic soup or stew.  We're not talking souffles or other fancy dishes.  Living alone, I do all my own cooking, tho not always from total scratch, tho I'd be healthier if I did.  Still, I grew up in the era before the home microwave oven was commonplace, and we always had a sit-down family dinner every night.  I could actually survive and thrive if all microwave ovens were to suddenly disappear from the face of the earth.

My little diatribe about from scratch was probably a bit overenthusiastic not because of krazen's outrage that people on SNAP eat prepackaged foods.  Still, even the healthiest of prepacked food generally has too much sodium, and the cheaper versions are sorely lacking in vitamins and usually even worse about the sodium and have too much fat for the bulk they have.  I do usually have a fairly simple salad with my main meal of the day consisting of just  few leaves of romaine lettuce to give my diet the fiber it needs. (No dressing, I never saw the point in drenching a healthy food in oily goop and lettuce tastes good as it is, just as broccoli definitely does not need cheez sauce.)

Are my tastes typical?  No, but I don't get disappointed in the tastes of others.  Are there things I would do to improve my diet?  Of course there are.  However, for krazen to castigate the poor for not living up to a food standard I doubt he himself follows, since few do so of any economic station, set me on edge.  Especially when he castigates the woman in the article for not making more use of her friend's kitchen.  Given that their friend is letting her family stay in a couple of rooms for a decidedly below market rental rate even for this area of cheap rents (Tacoma may be as cheap as here, but I severely doubt it is cheaper), I find it quite understanding that she doesn't want to bother her friend more than she absolutely must lest she become homeless again because her friend finds her too bothersome.

[dead0man]

I too love water and grew up before the microwave.  The wife makes things from scratch all the time, though it's usually not particularly healthy stuff...fried chicken, cupcakes*, crab pizza and the like.  We often have salads as a side dish and try to eat at least a few meals a week at the dinner table.

I don't think we're that different really, I do like my salty foods though, and hell, I just like salt.  It's not as bad for you as most people think....unless you have problems with it of course.



*the best freakin' cupcakes in the world I might add.  I love 'em and I'm not really a "sweets" kind of guy.

[krazen1211]

Well, if all the woman in question was doing was sitting around her rented rooms with her two kids, she'd have the time, but I doubt you or krazen want her to be doing just that.

I have no idea what you're trying to imply, but good job not being a dick about it!

You must be logged in to read this quote.

A sandwich, a bowl of soup and an apple.  BAM! A glass of juice on the side.  4 funking minutes.  Not everything has to be a 5 course meal with the exact right amount of vitamins and calories.  Especially if you don't have very much money.

or an egg, a bowl of cereal, a banana and a glass of milk.  8 minutes

or some rice, a corn dog, some green beans and some tea.  12 minutes

or...well, you get the idea.


(actually, you will no doubt have some huge problem that isn't really a problem with this too.  I have NO problem with the food stamp program, I actually think farm subsidies are MUCH worse for everybody.  I've been poor.  I could have been on food stamps, I was on WIC (well, I wasn't, but I've certainly used the checks and even went to a WIC "store" in Mississippi because it was cheaper for them than handing out checks).  Hell, I'm still poor.  Kids are expensive even when you're a cheap ass like me.  I just thinks it's ridiculous and unfair to assume everybody must spend hours preparing healthy meals every day when you clearly don't have to.  I'd question the sanity of anybody that would...unless they are into that kind of thing, then more power to 'em.)

Carrots. $.49 a pound. Of course that requires the elbow grease of, well, washing and peeling, so lazies need not apply.

[krazen1211]

I wasn't aware that opening a can of soup counted as from scratch.  As for fruit juice, that's barely better than soda whether fresh squeezed or from a container.  It's still sugar water, just without the carbonation and a few vitamins.

OTOH, I will agree that without an excessive amount of time or effort, tho certainly more than merely 4 minutes, soups and stews could be made that would be far healthier than the sodium saturated canned variety, assuming she has access to a slow cooker and a place to let it sit without being a fire hazard.

Why must things be "made from scratch"?  Sure, I'd agree that everything else being equal, "made from scratch" is better, but most people, those on SNAP or not, don't have the time (or knowledge) for that.  You can eat healthy and cheaply making things that aren't made from scratch.

But nevermind all that, what do you want everybody to drink?  Does that need to be made from scratch too?  Does every meal need to be made from scratch to meet your approval?  Can lunch or breakfast be something fast and easy or should every meal in the day take 3 hours to prepare?  Do you have a "made from scratch" meal everyday?  3 a day?  Who makes them for you?  Do you expect everybody else to do it too?  Are you disappointed when you find out your friends and family don't live up to your, frankly, outrageous expectations?

Well in a healthy diet, water is quite sufficient, especially if you have food you want to enjoy rather than wash down.  As for knowledge, it takes fairly little knowledge to make a basic soup or stew.  We're not talking souffles or other fancy dishes.  Living alone, I do all my own cooking, tho not always from total scratch, tho I'd be healthier if I did.  Still, I grew up in the era before the home microwave oven was commonplace, and we always had a sit-down family dinner every night.  I could actually survive and thrive if all microwave ovens were to suddenly disappear from the face of the earth.

My little diatribe about from scratch was probably a bit overenthusiastic not because of krazen's outrage that people on SNAP eat prepackaged foods.  Still, even the healthiest of prepacked food generally has too much sodium, and the cheaper versions are sorely lacking in vitamins and usually even worse about the sodium and have too much fat for the bulk they have.  I do usually have a fairly simple salad with my main meal of the day consisting of just  few leaves of romaine lettuce to give my diet the fiber it needs. (No dressing, I never saw the point in drenching a healthy food in oily goop and lettuce tastes good as it is, just as broccoli definitely does not need cheez sauce.)

Are my tastes typical?  No, but I don't get disappointed in the tastes of others.  Are there things I would do to improve my diet?  Of course there are.  However, for krazen to castigate the poor for not living up to a food standard I doubt he himself follows, since few do so of any economic station, set me on edge.  Especially when he castigates the woman in the article for not making more use of her friend's kitchen.  Given that their friend is letting her family stay in a couple of rooms for a decidedly below market rental rate even for this area of cheap rents (Tacoma may be as cheap as here, but I severely doubt it is cheaper), I find it quite understanding that she doesn't want to bother her friend more than she absolutely must lest she become homeless again because her friend finds her too bothersome.

I assure you that I do. You see, I don't get a free $526 from the American people, and wasting my own money hinders the path to riches. For some reason bothering the american people doesn't matter to these types.


An iceberg head of lettuce is $.99. Quite expensive for someone who only receives a free $513 from the American people.

[True Federalist (진정한 연방 주의자)]

An iceberg head of lettuce is $.99.

Iceberg?  I thought you were upset about the poor buying junk food with taxpayer money.  Not only is iceberg bland thus needing a oily dressing to make it taste good, nutritionally it is far inferior to romaine.  One would almost be better off eating the paper bag, if one's grocery store still uses them.  Granted, iceberg lettuce is better than no lettuce at all, but romaine is not that much more expensive and in my experience it keeps better than iceberg does.

[barfbag]

If not for food stamps, the store I'm employed by wouldn't exist. In the area I work, almost all of our business comes on the 1st of the month when food stamps go into effect. We get our biggest truck orders on the 1st or 2nd of the month because the trucks come every other day. I don't like the government picking winners and losers, but if an industry or sector is doing poorly enough that it's effecting other sectors, then it doesn't hurt to hold a safety net to keep our economy from collapsing. A poor economy could lead to less tax revenue and result in further deficits. We'd then need to borrow more money just to have a strong military and make ends meet. The line is drawn when government picks winners and losers based on who donated to the party who won the white house. Both parties have gotten worse with this throughout their existence.

[pbrower2a]

Food stamps -- cheaper for us all than

(1) shoplifting
(2) malnutrition
(3) riots

[opebo]

This is, actually, a great opportunity. Without food stamps, agricultural subsidies do not have the constituency, so they can be cut. Dems should make it very clear, that that bill is dead and the new agricultural subsidy bill would have to be negotiated from scratch, taking as a primary objective a major reduction of farm spending: I would start the negotiation with an offer of maintaining it at, say, 10% of the current level, with severe means testing, to make sure none of it goes to major producers.

Dems can survive without Iowa.

Well, ag, I'm all for harming the non-poor as much as possible, but then again, clearly any reduction in government spending is a negative for the economy as a whole.

[opebo]

Why does the government hate its people?

Of course it isn't the government which 'hates', but rather a certain type of voter (Republican).  It would be odd if the rich hated their poors - sort of like a farming hating his cows.  That isn't really what we're talking about here.  The key to understanding America's pervasive class-hate and racism is that the people hating the poors are in fact (functionally/power-wise) poors themselves, and this is all part of the clever divide-and-conquer strategy of our ruling class.

[opebo]

$526 on food spent on 3 people in 2 weeks. $12 per person per day.

These food stampers must be eating like kings.

It's curious to think a $12 per person sloth can't afford a 3% cut in food stamp allocation.

What're you talking about?  People need high-quality food with lots of protein, good fats, and green leafy vegetables loaded with vitamins.  You'd have them living on pasta and empty calories. 

[memphis]

If not for food stamps, the store I'm employed by wouldn't exist. In the area I work, almost all of our business comes on the 1st of the month when food stamps go into effect. We get our biggest truck orders on the 1st or 2nd of the month because the trucks come every other day.

Obviously, without the government, no employment could exist. Those roads the trucks used didn't build themselves either, by the way. It's nice to see a self-described conservative acknowledge his dependence though. Doesn't happen very often.

[All Along The Watchtower]

Why does the government hate its people?

Of course it isn't the government which 'hates', but rather a certain type of voter (Republican).  It would be odd if the rich hated their poors - sort of like a farming hating his cows.  That isn't really what we're talking about here.  The key to understanding America's pervasive class-hate and racism is that the people hating the poors are in fact (functionally/power-wise) poors themselves, and this is all part of the clever divide-and-conquer strategy of our ruling class.

Some of those people are poors themselves, opebo, but I'd actually argue that many of the worst offenders in the Tea Party Right are middle to upper-middle class in status, either self-employed (or were at one point, many of them are retired) business owners, all levels of management, professionals whose livelihoods don't depend on the public sector (at least, not directly ), with the exception of the "national defense" parts of the State (military, criminal justice, etc.-military officers, law enforcement, etc. skew Republican).

[barfbag]

If not for food stamps, the store I'm employed by wouldn't exist. In the area I work, almost all of our business comes on the 1st of the month when food stamps go into effect. We get our biggest truck orders on the 1st or 2nd of the month because the trucks come every other day.

Obviously, without the government, no employment could exist. Those roads the trucks used didn't build themselves either, by the way. It's nice to see a self-described conservative acknowledge his dependence though. Doesn't happen very often.

Without government, we'd have anarchy, but there are private roads built by private contractors. I understand everyone has to go through government in terms of laws and taxes in order to start businesses. The private sector should still be preferred too. We're both right though, food stamps do help the economy and independently create jobs in the private sector. My last job was a security officer at college apartments which weren't part of campus. However, without the state university for students to attend, there wouldn't be any independent colleges. Granted I would've simply been assigned somewhere else like a park, school, or grocery store to do security, but I think everyone sees my point.

[opebo]

Some of those people are poors themselves, opebo, but I'd actually argue that many of the worst offenders in the Tea Party Right are middle to upper-middle class in status, either self-employed (or were at one point, many of them are retired) business owners, all levels of management, professionals whose livelihoods don't depend on the public sector (at least, not directly ), with the exception of the "national defense" parts of the State (military, criminal justice, etc.-military officers, law enforcement, etc. skew Republican).

Quite possible.  The jail-wardens and prison guards in other words.

[WalterMitty]

house gop leaders (read: eric cantor) still insisting on southerland amendment to the nutrition title.

hopefully that nonsense wont get out of conference (or pass the senate if it survives conference).  obama has issued veto threats, but i dont trust him.  he would likely sign it and then issue a press release talking about how bad the bill is.