Italian Elections and Politics 2018: Yellow Tide

[Sestak]

So what is this Rosatellum system?

https://www.reuters.com/article/us-italy-politics-election/italy-calls-confidence-votes-in-senate-on-new-electoral-law-idUSKBN1CT289

Is it just as the article says;

The proposed election law would distribute almost two-thirds of the seats in parliament on a proportional basis, while a third would be decided in a first-past-the-post vote on specific candidates.

Sounds like a version of the Japanese system except with less FPTP MPs?

Wait, is that just MMP? Or are the proportional represenation alloted independently of the FPTP seats?

[Sestak]

Wait, is M5S anti-vax?

[Sestak]

When do polls close?

[Sestak]

Anywhere good to track results as they come in?

[Sestak]

Wait who would become PM in a rightwing government if the current result stands?

[Sestak]

Who's less damaging, btw: Di Maio or Salvini?

[Sestak]

Question for non-fascists: If it came down to Di Maio vs. Salvini, who's less damaging?

[Sestak]

Top Lega (Northern League) official Giancarlo Giorgetti speaking from party HQ:
"These are historic results for the Lega. We're picking up votes from North to South. We had 4 percent in 2013, now projections say 16 to 17 percent, perhaps more. We'll discuss things with our allies but this is a historic moment for the Lega."


Five Star lawmaker Alessandro Di Battista takes the stage in a crowded and increasingly cheerful headquarters:
"A triumph, an apotheosis" for Five Star, he says, which shows that "everybody will have to come and talk to us from now on."

Just please don't make a coalition with Lega...

[Sestak]

Am I correct that M5S is anti capitalist? Isn't degrowth essentially anti-capitalist? If so, I don't know why they would form a government with Salvini and his band of dumbasses.

I mean, if the only other two-party option is with Renzi then it could happen...

[Sestak]

I mean yeah, but I would argue they have more in common with the Democrats than with League.

Policy-wise perhaps, but PD is so (to use an American term) "swampy" that they may prefer LN.

[Sestak]

I mean yeah, but I would argue they have more in common with the Democrats than with League.

Policy-wise perhaps, but PD is so (to use an American term) "swampy" that they may prefer LN.

Heard chat elsewhere about M5S + PD supply with PD kicking Renzi, probably the most likely M5S government right now. I say again, Lega and M5S agree on virtually nothing besides the migrants,, so very little change of a alliance there.

That could work. At this point I'm perfectly willing to jettison Renzi if it means stopping Salvini.

If current results hold, what do you guys think the post likely government is?

[Sestak]

Silvio i dunno.

Lega are fascists.

[Sestak]

Italian Lower Chamber Elections: LA7 Projection

Party   Votes %
Five Star Movement   32.1%
Democratic Party   19.0%
League   17.5%
Forza Italia   14.1%
Brothers of Italy   4.1%
Free and Equal   3.5%
+Europe Bonino   2.7%
Us With Italy - UDC   1.1%
Popular Civic Lorenzin   0.5%
Together Italy Europe   0.6

That's enough for M5S-PD and might not be enough for M5S-Lega, which would be amazing.

[Sestak]

Italian Lower Chamber Elections: LA7 Projection

Party   Votes %
Five Star Movement   32.1%
Democratic Party   19.0%
League   17.5%
Forza Italia   14.1%
Brothers of Italy   4.1%
Free and Equal   3.5%
+Europe Bonino   2.7%
Us With Italy - UDC   1.1%
Popular Civic Lorenzin   0.5%
Together Italy Europe   0.6

That's enough for M5S-PD and might not be enough for M5S-Lega, which would be amazing.

Well, I was thinking of M5S-LN-FDI

If M5S doesn't like coalitions, they'd prefer to go with just one party over two, no?

[Sestak]

Did you ever hear the tragedy of Matteo Renzi The Scrapper? I thought not. It’s not a story Merkel would tell you. It’s a centre-left legend. Matteo Renzi was a Florentine Lord of the Christian Democrats, so bombastic and so media-friendly he could use neoliberalism to influence the Communist factions to go away… He had such a knowledge of reform-driven results-oriented politics that he could even win the 2014 Euro elections. The dark side of neoliberalism is a pathway to many abilities some consider to be unnatural. He became so powerful… the only thing he was afraid of was losing his premiership, which eventually, of course, he did. Unfortunately, he taught his country a new electoral reform, then his country killed his political career in his sleep. Ironic. He could save others from death, but not himself.

*slow clap*

[Sestak]

I cannot believe that I'm rooting for the f**king Five Star Movement.

[Sestak]

I wonder, would PD actually reach a deal with Lega and Forza Italia? That way you could get a PD-LN-FI government and avoid M5S if they truly refuse to take part in any coalition.

Or is PD too far from LN?

Bleh.

[Sestak]

Can someone who knows something about Italian politics explain what is going on?

Quick guide to the parties (though I'm also not that well-versed in Italian politics:

Left bloc:
Led by the Democratic Party, boring neoliberal corrupt center-left party

Right bloc:
Forza Italia, led by Mr. Bunga Bunga, Silvio Berlusconi.
Lega, far right authoritarian party led by Matteo Salvini, staunchly nationalist and anti-immigrant and has called for ethnic cleansing

5 Star:
Populist protest movement founded by comedian Beppe Grillo. Anti-corruption, anti-migrant though extent is unclear, some anti-vaxxers in there, mostly unclear economic views.

[Sestak]

has called for ethnic cleansing

When?!

Okay, he's called for cleansing.

But we all know what he's talking about.

[Sestak]

has called for ethnic cleansing

When?!

Okay, he's called for cleansing.

But we all know what he's talking about.

I believe he was talking about illegal migrants, not a specific race.

Oh come on, the word choice is like a dog loudspeaker.

[Sestak]

10% in...

[Sestak]

Who do you think they're more likely to pick, jaichind?

[Sestak]

Why would the M5S agree to a PD politician when they're the bigger party? Wouldn't it be M5S-PD with Di Maio as PM?

[Sestak]

Does M5S advocate for a complete cutoff of migrants or just a reduction?

[Sestak]

From AP:
Italy's ex-Premier Matteo Renzi says his center-left party will not join any government led by the anti-immigrant League party or the populist 5-Star Movement, the two victorious forces in Italy's election.
Renzi said both those parties represent an anti-Europeanism that he would not support and said they had had used "verbal hatred" on his Democratic Party lawmakers. He said Matteo Salvini of the League and Luigi Di Maio of the 5-Stars had called his lawmakers mafiosi, labeled them corrupt and said they had blood on their hands.
Renzi says "if this is who we are, govern without us. Know that our place in this legislation is in the opposition."
Renzi acknowledged that his party suffered a "total defeat" in Sunday's general election and said he would resign as party leader after a new government has been sworn in.

Goddammit Renzi.