"Death to the Jews"... (user search)
       |           

Welcome, Guest. Please login or register.
Did you miss your activation email?
April 30, 2024, 09:21:19 AM
News: Election Simulator 2.0 Released. Senate/Gubernatorial maps, proportional electoral votes, and more - Read more

  Talk Elections
  General Politics
  International General Discussion (Moderators: afleitch, Hash)
  "Death to the Jews"... (search mode)
Pages: [1]
Poll
Question: Should the town be renamed?
#1
Yes
 
#2
No
 
Show Pie Chart
Partisan results

Total Voters: 54

Author Topic: "Death to the Jews"...  (Read 2516 times)
Zanas
Zanas46
Sr. Member
****
Posts: 2,947
France


WWW
« on: August 26, 2014, 09:00:24 AM »

OK, French amateur-linguist reporting.

First of all, this is a hamlet of a remote rural commune in Loiret, in the French diagonale du vide. The commune of Courtemaux has only 290 inhabitants, the hamlet has one farm and four. friggin. houses...

Its name, only written on the cadastre and seemingly on no roadsign, is "La Mort aux Juifs". Correctly translated, that's to say without hypocrisy, it means "The Death of the Jews", or "The Jews' Death", but not "Death to the Jews !!!!11!1!" by any mean.

Anyway, if you have ever heard about popular etymology, this is quite probably a case of it. Everywhere in France (and the rest of Europe) we have towns, hamlets or cities, not to mention family names, whose translations in modern language have awkward or insulting connotations. But since our proper nouns have had at least 1,500 years to evolve linguistically, that's since the end of strict latin and the progressive birth of a pre-French language, they have at times evolved very far from their original spelling, pronunciation, and therefore meaning.

It is the (hard) work of the etymologist to go back in time with rules that have many exceptions and documents often lacking and find where those names come from. Quite often, we can't tell. We have a few hypotheses, some more credible than the others, but nearly every time the simple "popular etymology" explanation is out of the way.

In this case, "la mort" is probably not la mort, and "aux Juifs" is probably not aux Juifs.
"La mort" has phonetically replaced "La mare" (the pond) in many occasions and it's quite possibly the original name.
"aux Juifs" could be what it is, therefore it could indeed be a pond where Jews were thrown in the disant past, thus easing the evolution into "la mort". Even then, commemorating it by a place name isn't advocating it to be done again.
It could also more probably be either "gallows" or "manure" both of which have been spelled, at one time or the other, "jui", "juis", or "juy". The f in "Juif", meaning "Jew", wasn't pronounced for centuries.

You have to all suck it up a little. You have to remember, and I speak mainly to the Muricans around here, that unlike you we didn't settle in a land with the near definitive form of our language. Therefore our place names sometimes have 2 or even 3 millenia behind them, and their spelling has only been fixed finally in the late 19th century. Imagine the numerous variations in a town's name that can have produced, and indeed if you look up any town name in wikipedia, you will probably find at least 4 or 5 different ways the name has been spelt throughout history.

So, no, there is absolutely nothing outrageous there, it's a severe case of DidNotDoTheResearch, and if we do it, we might as well unbaptize Grenoble to Grelibre again...
Logged
Pages: [1]  
Jump to:  


Login with username, password and session length

Terms of Service - DMCA Agent and Policy - Privacy Policy and Cookies

Powered by SMF 1.1.21 | SMF © 2015, Simple Machines

Page created in 0.027 seconds with 14 queries.