Senate Protest and Analysis Thread

[CultureKing]

The Death with Dignity Act is probably unconstitutional unless someone can find me a constitutional power of the Senate that allows for that to be regulated by this body. Unless we are now just assuming that all laws like that are only to apply to DC and the federal territories.

hmmm... I will admit that I definately do not know all the ins and outs of the constitution as well as some others around here, but I'll try to make a connection (please feel free to say if my logic is flawed):

Article VI, clause 2 states:
No agency of government shall deprive any person of life, liberty, or property, without due process of law; nor deny to any person within its jurisdiction the equal protection of the laws.

I see disalowing phsician assisted suicide as an infringment on a person's liberty and as such Article 1, Section 5, Clause 30 gives the senate the right to make laws to carry out the rights guarenteed to the people.

[Colin]

The Death with Dignity Act is probably unconstitutional unless someone can find me a constitutional power of the Senate that allows for that to be regulated by this body. Unless we are now just assuming that all laws like that are only to apply to DC and the federal territories.

hmmm... I will admit that I definately do not know all the ins and outs of the constitution as well as some others around here, but I'll try to make a connection (please feel free to say if my logic is flawed):

Article VI, clause 2 states:
No agency of government shall deprive any person of life, liberty, or property, without due process of law; nor deny to any person within its jurisdiction the equal protection of the laws.

I see disalowing phsician assisted suicide as an infringment on a person's liberty and as such Article 1, Section 5, Clause 30 gives the senate the right to make laws to carry out the rights guarenteed to the people.

You're looking at the wrong section. What the Senate can do is stated here. If its not stated in there its a regional matter, end of story. I wish the Senate could do more but those are the rules you have to work with.

Take the advice of a former Chief Justice of the Supreme Court, I may know what I'm talking about.

[CultureKing]

The Death with Dignity Act is probably unconstitutional unless someone can find me a constitutional power of the Senate that allows for that to be regulated by this body. Unless we are now just assuming that all laws like that are only to apply to DC and the federal territories.

hmmm... I will admit that I definately do not know all the ins and outs of the constitution as well as some others around here, but I'll try to make a connection (please feel free to say if my logic is flawed):

Article VI, clause 2 states:
No agency of government shall deprive any person of life, liberty, or property, without due process of law; nor deny to any person within its jurisdiction the equal protection of the laws.

I see disalowing phsician assisted suicide as an infringment on a person's liberty and as such Article 1, Section 5, Clause 30 gives the senate the right to make laws to carry out the rights guarenteed to the people.

You're looking at the wrong section. What the Senate can do is stated here. If its not stated in there its a regional matter, end of story. I wish the Senate could do more but those are the rules you have to work with.

Take the advice of a former Chief Justice of the Supreme Court, I may know what I'm talking about.

Yes, I see that but it does say in the powers of the senate:
"30. And to make all laws which shall be necessary and proper for carrying into execution the powers enumerated in this section, and all other powers vested by this Constitution in the government of the Republic of Atlasia, or in any department or officer thereof."

[Colin]

The Death with Dignity Act is probably unconstitutional unless someone can find me a constitutional power of the Senate that allows for that to be regulated by this body. Unless we are now just assuming that all laws like that are only to apply to DC and the federal territories.

hmmm... I will admit that I definately do not know all the ins and outs of the constitution as well as some others around here, but I'll try to make a connection (please feel free to say if my logic is flawed):

Article VI, clause 2 states:
No agency of government shall deprive any person of life, liberty, or property, without due process of law; nor deny to any person within its jurisdiction the equal protection of the laws.

I see disalowing phsician assisted suicide as an infringment on a person's liberty and as such Article 1, Section 5, Clause 30 gives the senate the right to make laws to carry out the rights guarenteed to the people.

You're looking at the wrong section. What the Senate can do is stated here. If its not stated in there its a regional matter, end of story. I wish the Senate could do more but those are the rules you have to work with.

Take the advice of a former Chief Justice of the Supreme Court, I may know what I'm talking about.

Yes, I see that but it does say in the powers of the senate:
"30. And to make all laws which shall be necessary and proper for carrying into execution the powers enumerated in this section, and all other powers vested by this Constitution in the government of the Republic of Atlasia, or in any department or officer thereof."

Very weak case, incredibly weak. Issues such as euthanasia are regional issues, whether you want them to be or not. If this does get passed I'd bet Sam would probably take you to court. He likes doing that.

[CultureKing]

The Death with Dignity Act is probably unconstitutional unless someone can find me a constitutional power of the Senate that allows for that to be regulated by this body. Unless we are now just assuming that all laws like that are only to apply to DC and the federal territories.

hmmm... I will admit that I definately do not know all the ins and outs of the constitution as well as some others around here, but I'll try to make a connection (please feel free to say if my logic is flawed):

Article VI, clause 2 states:
No agency of government shall deprive any person of life, liberty, or property, without due process of law; nor deny to any person within its jurisdiction the equal protection of the laws.

I see disalowing phsician assisted suicide as an infringment on a person's liberty and as such Article 1, Section 5, Clause 30 gives the senate the right to make laws to carry out the rights guarenteed to the people.

You're looking at the wrong section. What the Senate can do is stated here. If its not stated in there its a regional matter, end of story. I wish the Senate could do more but those are the rules you have to work with.

Take the advice of a former Chief Justice of the Supreme Court, I may know what I'm talking about.

Yes, I see that but it does say in the powers of the senate:
"30. And to make all laws which shall be necessary and proper for carrying into execution the powers enumerated in this section, and all other powers vested by this Constitution in the government of the Republic of Atlasia, or in any department or officer thereof."

Very weak case, incredibly weak. Issues such as euthanasia are regional issues, whether you want them to be or not. If this does get passed I'd bet Sam would probably take you to court. He likes doing that.

hmmm...

[Small Business Owner of Any Repute]

I just want to say that I am very supportive of Peter as a pick for Attorney General, and would like to encourage my representatives to vote in favor of his nomination.

[Small Business Owner of Any Repute]

The sitting Secretary of Forum Affairs declines to endorse or oppose the bill introduced by Senator Trondheim requiring special elections for all Class B vacancies.

He will, however, note that the status quo is simpler. 

[Small Business Owner of Any Repute]

The sitting Secretary of Forum Affairs declines to endorse or oppose the bill introduced by Senator Trondheim requiring special elections for all Class B vacancies.

He will, however, note that the status quo is simpler. 

Let me clarify—I meant the status quo as in the original text of the PRA, assuming all was constitutional.  I still strongly support fixing the currently unconstitutional Sections 18 and 19 of the PRA.

[minionofmidas]

The sitting Secretary of Forum Affairs declines to endorse or oppose the bill introduced by Senator Trondheim requiring special elections for all Class B vacancies.

He will, however, note that the status quo is simpler. 

Let me clarify—I meant the status quo as in the original text of the PRA, assuming all was constitutional.  I still strongly support fixing the currently unconstitutional Sections 18 and 19 of the PRA.

Thought so, since the statement doesn't make any sense otherwise.

[Хahar 🤔]

Ukulele Musical Learning Standardization Act

Section 1: Each school district shall include in their musical curriculum the instruction of how to play a ukulele.
Section 2: Each school district may decide in which grade the ukulele instruction shall occur.
Section 3: School districts must provide a ukulele to each student for the duration of the unit.


This is vital legislation.

Is this constitutional?

[Хahar 🤔]

Someone propose this:

Legislation Tabling Bill

The following shall be added to Article 4 of the Official Senate Procedural Resolution:

Section 5: Rules on Motions to Table
1.   Any Senator can, during a period of debate, introduce a motion to table the legislation.
2.   The PPT shall open a vote on the motion to table. This vote shall last for a maximum of five (5) days during which time the Senators must vote. Voting may be declared final at any time if the motion to table has been approved or rejected.
3.   For the motion to table to pass, two thirds of the Senate must vote for the motion.
4.   Tabled legislation shall be taken off the Senate floor and moved to the back of a separate queue for tabled legislation.

[Small Business Owner of Any Repute]

Ukulele Musical Learning Standardization Act

Section 1: Each school district shall include in their musical curriculum the instruction of how to play a ukulele.
Section 2: Each school district may decide in which grade the ukulele instruction shall occur.
Section 3: School districts must provide a ukulele to each student for the duration of the unit.


This is vital legislation.

Is this constitutional?

Stupid yes, but it is constitutional if it's a requirement for obtaining federal education funding.

Though, um...generally it's the PPT who strikes down the frivolous legislation, and not the one who proposes it. 

[Хahar 🤔]

Ukulele Musical Learning Standardization Act

Section 1: Each school district shall include in their musical curriculum the instruction of how to play a ukulele.
Section 2: Each school district may decide in which grade the ukulele instruction shall occur.
Section 3: School districts must provide a ukulele to each student for the duration of the unit.


This is vital legislation.

Is this constitutional?

Stupid yes, but it is constitutional if it's a requirement for obtaining federal education funding.

Though, um...generally it's the PPT who strikes down the frivolous legislation, and not the one who proposes it. 

That's what I wa thinking as I looked through the OSPR. That rule should probably be...fixed.

[Meeker]

Hold up - there are actually very legitimate reasons for teaching kids how to learn the ukulele. I'll go into it when we get to the debate, but google it - you should find several articles. The UK recently adopted it as part of a national curriculum.

So in other words, it's not a joke bill.

[Sensei]

If I am elected Senator, I will vote in favor of this ukulele bill. If only because I want to hear 8 year olds playing the complete works of Tiny Tim.

[Хahar 🤔]

It shouldn't be required. Encouraged, yes, but not required.

[Speed of Sound]

It shouldn't be required. Encouraged, yes, but not required.

We've got nothing better to encourage? Honestly? If you guys are gonna pass this crackpot thing, you may as well go for broke.

[minionofmidas]

It shouldn't be required. Encouraged, yes, but not required.

It certainly should be required of anyone who applies for a license to breathe.

[DownWithTheLeft]

With five days passing on the amendment to allow for gun control, I asked that the vote be closed with an official tally of 0 in favor, 1 opposed, and 1 abstention.  Otherwise, a court case will be forthcoming

[Јas]

With five days passing on the amendment to allow for gun control, I asked that the vote be closed with an official tally of 0 in favor, 1 opposed, and 1 abstention.  Otherwise, a court case will be forthcoming

Your case would be immediately rejected, final votes can last for 7 days.

[Хahar 🤔]

Just noticed something. This:

Legislation Tabling Bill

The following shall be added to Article 5 of the Official Senate Procedural Resolution:

Section 5: Rules on Motions to Table
1.   Any Senator can, during a period of debate, introduce a motion to table the legislation.
2.   The PPT shall open a vote on the motion to table. This vote shall last for a maximum of two (2) days during which time the Senators must vote. Voting may be declared final at any time if the motion to table has been approved or rejected.
3.   For the motion to table to pass, two thirds of the Senate must vote for the motion.
4.   Tabled legislation shall be taken off the Senate floor.

Is different from this:

Someone propose this:

Legislation Tabling Bill

The following shall be added to Article 4 of the Official Senate Procedural Resolution:

Section 5: Rules on Motions to Table
1.   Any Senator can, during a period of debate, introduce a motion to table the legislation.
2.   The PPT shall open a vote on the motion to table. This vote shall last for a maximum of five (5) days during which time the Senators must vote. Voting may be declared final at any time if the motion to table has been approved or rejected.
3.   For the motion to table to pass, two thirds of the Senate must vote for the motion.
4.   Tabled legislation shall be taken off the Senate floor and moved to the back of a separate queue for tabled legislation.

While that's not necessarily a bad thing, I thought it's worth bringing up, since this'll reach the floor soon.

[CultureKing]

Just noticed something. This:

Legislation Tabling Bill

The following shall be added to Article 5 of the Official Senate Procedural Resolution:

Section 5: Rules on Motions to Table
1.   Any Senator can, during a period of debate, introduce a motion to table the legislation.
2.   The PPT shall open a vote on the motion to table. This vote shall last for a maximum of two (2) days during which time the Senators must vote. Voting may be declared final at any time if the motion to table has been approved or rejected.
3.   For the motion to table to pass, two thirds of the Senate must vote for the motion.
4.   Tabled legislation shall be taken off the Senate floor.

Is different from this:

Someone propose this:

Legislation Tabling Bill

The following shall be added to Article 4 of the Official Senate Procedural Resolution:

Section 5: Rules on Motions to Table
1.   Any Senator can, during a period of debate, introduce a motion to table the legislation.
2.   The PPT shall open a vote on the motion to table. This vote shall last for a maximum of five (5) days during which time the Senators must vote. Voting may be declared final at any time if the motion to table has been approved or rejected.
3.   For the motion to table to pass, two thirds of the Senate must vote for the motion.
4.   Tabled legislation shall be taken off the Senate floor and moved to the back of a separate queue for tabled legislation.

While that's not necessarily a bad thing, I thought it's worth bringing up, since this'll reach the floor soon.

I basically just lessened the number of days allowed for voting as I see tabling as a procedure that helps kill bills that have no chance anyways and changing it to two days makes the process simply go faster.

[Хahar 🤔]

Just noticed something. This:

Legislation Tabling Bill

The following shall be added to Article 5 of the Official Senate Procedural Resolution:

Section 5: Rules on Motions to Table
1.   Any Senator can, during a period of debate, introduce a motion to table the legislation.
2.   The PPT shall open a vote on the motion to table. This vote shall last for a maximum of two (2) days during which time the Senators must vote. Voting may be declared final at any time if the motion to table has been approved or rejected.
3.   For the motion to table to pass, two thirds of the Senate must vote for the motion.
4.   Tabled legislation shall be taken off the Senate floor.

Is different from this:

Someone propose this:

Legislation Tabling Bill

The following shall be added to Article 4 of the Official Senate Procedural Resolution:

Section 5: Rules on Motions to Table
1.   Any Senator can, during a period of debate, introduce a motion to table the legislation.
2.   The PPT shall open a vote on the motion to table. This vote shall last for a maximum of five (5) days during which time the Senators must vote. Voting may be declared final at any time if the motion to table has been approved or rejected.
3.   For the motion to table to pass, two thirds of the Senate must vote for the motion.
4.   Tabled legislation shall be taken off the Senate floor and moved to the back of a separate queue for tabled legislation.

While that's not necessarily a bad thing, I thought it's worth bringing up, since this'll reach the floor soon.

I basically just lessened the number of days allowed for voting as I see tabling as a procedure that helps kill bills that have no chance anyways and changing it to two days makes the process simply go faster.

That makes sense, but what about your other change? The point of tabling is to have it reach the Senate at some later date. If you want to kill it, get a vote for cloture.

[Small Business Owner of Any Repute]

That makes sense, but what about your other change? The point of tabling is to have it reach the Senate at some later date. If you want to kill it, get a vote for cloture.

As used in Atlasia, the point of tabling a bill is generally to kill it.

[Хahar 🤔]

That makes sense, but what about your other change? The point of tabling is to have it reach the Senate at some later date. If you want to kill it, get a vote for cloture.

As used in Atlasia, the point of tabling a bill is generally to kill it.

But that's not the correct use of tabling.