🇦🇹 Austria General Discussion (user search)
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  🇦🇹 Austria General Discussion (search mode)
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DC Al Fine
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« on: June 09, 2018, 06:12:35 PM »

Is it just in America where we hold freedoms of speech and religion as sacred? It sounds like many of the European posters in this thread agree with this, while I know of many Americans, from far-right to far-left, that would see this as violating freedoms of religion.


Yup. I'll say that in general Americans have a more "laissez faire" approach to freedom of religion and freedom of speech while most European countries have more restrictive approaches. Whether that's a good or a bad thing though I don't know.

I will say that for my country (Spain), freedom of speech is almost certainly too restricted (tons of people have been unfairly sent to jail). But I will say we are doing ok in freedom of religion.

If my country were say throwing journalists in prison, I would not say we are doing ok in freedom of the press... Why do you say Spain is doing ok in freedom of speech? Am I missing something?
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DC Al Fine
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Posts: 14,085
Canada


« Reply #1 on: June 11, 2018, 08:00:02 AM »

I will say that most of those radicalised by Isis have not done so in mosques. Which is not to say that the salafi mosques are not an issue, but I don't know how important they are in the specific context of violent jihadism.
Yeah, I think here they were mostly not welcome in mosques, and those who have gone that far down the rabbit hole are also likely to be paranoid enough to avoid going there, as intelligence services usually know damn well in which mosques they should have infiltrators and sources. Those who are at that stage of radicalization usually meet up in living rooms. Radicalization often does start in these mosques though.

Not completely convinced salafism was the issue here, even though Kurz and Strache did mention political Islam, because they also talked about far-right extremism and ties to the Grey Wolves. That's a whole different issue, I'd say. At least organizations tied to the Grey Wolves here are associated with different types of problematic behavior (violent crime, mafia stuff, intimidation of political opponents in other Turkish organizations), but not with salafism, which is more of a problem in Arab than in Turkish mosques in the first place.

Yeah, the Grey Wolves connection is a lot less sticky a reason to target these mosques and organisations; they're basically a criminal syndicate like the Mafia.

I don't think people or religions should be targeted because they are conservative though, as long as they are not preaching hate (calls to genocide etc). That said, I think the state should work with religions to make them less patriarchal and closed off.

I'm on board with this except for your last sentence which I don't understand. What do you mean by that?
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