Once more, gun control opponents...

[Indy Texas]

Why do our deaths from gun violence outpace those of any other developed, stable country? If guns aren't the problem, what is the problem and how do you intend to fix that problem?

[WVdemocrat]

All opponents of gun control say the real issue is deranged individuals. They basically argue that it's something government can't solve, and therefore we should do nothing about it and rely on people's good will.

Yeah, no.

[Likely Voter]

Why do NRA types hate America and believe we are not exceptional? If the reason we have so much gun violence isn't guns but is a problem with the shooters, then aren't they saying that Americans are more violent and deranged than citizens of other western democracies

[pbrower2a]

We have, for one thing, a thoroughly-dreadful system of mental health.

[Indy Texas]

We have, for one thing, a thoroughly-dreadful system of mental health.

The overlap between Second Amendment absolutists and people who want to devote more public resources to mental health treatment is virtually nonexistent.

[MaxQue]

We have, for one thing, a thoroughly-dreadful system of mental health.

The overlap between Second Amendment absolutists and people who want to devote more public resources to mental health treatment is virtually nonexistent.

I would say there is an huge overlap between mental illness and 2nd Amendment absolutism. Being obsessed with guns, those instruments of pain and murder, is a mental illness in itself.

[All Along The Watchtower]

I don't get blaming the mentally ill for violence. There are plenty of people with mental illnesses who aren't violent. And there are plenty of perfectly "normal" (as in, wouldn't be diagnosed as mentally ill) people who commit violent crimes. A lot of evil is done by perfectly ordinary people.

As for the Charleston shooter...racism and sexism aren't mental illnesses. They are an endemic part of American society, whether you recognize it or not.

[Free Bird]

Why do our deaths from gun violence outpace those of any other developed, stable country? If guns aren't the problem, what is the problem and how do you intend to fix that problem?

Violent crime has steadily declined over the years. It is at an ALL TIME LOW. We too are developed and stable. The problem is really concentrated in urban areas, which we can solve by giving them more opportunities with job training programs and better schools. Criminal background check improvement, sure, but really we should focus on improving urban areas/states, which by the way, HAVE STRICTER GUN LAWS THAN PEACEFUL STATES WITH LESS CRIME!

[Free Bird]

Oh, by the way. How will more gun control punish criminals? They won't care, and I feel that gun crime will INCREASE as a result of civilians not having guns anymore.

[ag]

and I feel,,,

It is not the matter of feelings...

[WVdemocrat]

Oh, by the way. How will more gun control punish criminals? They won't care, and I feel that gun crime will INCREASE as a result of civilians not having guns anymore.

It will make it harder for them to acquire guns. That's the whole point. They don't call it gun control for nothing.

[Free Bird]

and I feel,,,

It is not the matter of feelings...

Bad choice of words. I KNOW it will. People without guns are easy targets to criminals WITH guns. Refer to urban areas with high crime rates yet strict gun control. And you liberals are NOT ones to call out people for thinking with feelings.

[Free Bird]

Oh, by the way. How will more gun control punish criminals? They won't care, and I feel that gun crime will INCREASE as a result of civilians not having guns anymore.

It will make it harder for them to acquire guns. That's the whole point. They don't call it gun control for nothing.

Background checks are fine I said. But an outright ban on anything to punish everyone is not only unconstitutional, but also ineffective. Refer to Columbine.

[ag]

and I feel,,,

It is not the matter of feelings...

Bad choice of words. I KNOW it will.

Well, you also KNOW it was Santa who brought you that gun.

[Free Bird]

Vermont, this forum's favorite state, has some of the laxest gun laws, but also some of the lowest crime, even when compared to the low national aggregate. Why? Because they have good social safety nets, good schools, and not any huge urban areas where people are packed in like sardines. I forgot to mention that the gun crime statistics, even now, are inflated because they include sucides and self defenses. Isn't that just the tiniest bit dishonest?

[WVdemocrat]

People without guns are easy targets to criminals WITH guns.

If everybody's armed, then that's not peace, that's stability (which is surprisingly unstable).

That creates a state of fear, not safe communities.

[ag]

Vermont, this forum's favorite state, has some of the laxest gun laws, but also some of the lowest crime,

And pretty middling gun ownership rates (despite the lax gun laws). One can have lax pork inspection rules in an ultra-Orthodox Jewish community, you know.

[Free Bird]

People without guns are easy targets to criminals WITH guns.

If everybody's armed, then that's not peace, that's stability (which is surprisingly unstable).

That creates a state of fear, not safe communities.

Yeah. A fear of doing bad stuff because you know you're going to be shot! So you suggest we violate the Second Amendment, confiscate all weapons, and make people completely defenseless from threats? With this issue, you can't really have a middle ground.

[ag]

As far as I am concerned, any person carrying a gun is a clear and present danger to my own life and that of my family. Firstly, because s/he has a gun. And, secondly, because wanting to have a gun is likely to be a sign of being a dangerous lunatic in the first place.

[ag]

People without guns are easy targets to criminals WITH guns.

If everybody's armed, then that's not peace, that's stability (which is surprisingly unstable).

That creates a state of fear, not safe communities.

Yeah. A fear of doing bad stuff because you know you're going to be shot!

No, more like a fear of going to Starbucks for a coffee, because you know, you are goint to be shot!

[bedstuy]

Oh, by the way. How will more gun control punish criminals? They won't care, and I feel that gun crime will INCREASE as a result of civilians not having guns anymore.

As if there are two groups of people:  Criminals and non-criminal.  Like the world is a children's cartoon with the bad guys and the good guys.

Every criminal was a non-criminal until they committed a crime.

Sure, we could cut down crime a lot if we totally eliminated poverty and social problems in poor communities.  It's not going to happen any time soon and people shouldn't die in the meantime.  And, the NRA and Republican don't want to do anything to help poor black communities anyway.  They want to screw them over more!

Here are a few evident facts:

Guns are a more effective weapon than knives.

Decreasing the access to guns among the general public would make it more difficult to kill/injure people with guns.  

Guns in the hands of the public cause way more crime than they prevent.

You could decrease access to guns with a number of measures.   Gun-buyback programs, registration and licensing programs, mandatory background checks.  Or, what about a 25% excise tax on guns?  If you increase the price of a good, it's going to affect sales.  

[ag]

. And you liberals are NOT ones to call out people for thinking with feelings.

I do not know, whether I am a "liberal" in the American sense of the word (I would need an evaluation from other here ), but at least I am thinking with something

[Free Bird]

As far as I am concerned, any person carrying a gun is a clear and present danger to my own life and that of my family. Firstly, because s/he has a gun. And, secondly, because wanting to have a gun is likely to be a sign of being a dangerous lunatic in the first place.

And yet you're probably fine with police having INKSing tanks and bazookas. People have a right to own guns, period. Calling everyone that likes them insane is despicable. Maybe they like hunting or target shooting! Who knows!?

[Free Bird]

Oh, by the way. How will more gun control punish criminals? They won't care, and I feel that gun crime will INCREASE as a result of civilians not having guns anymore.

As if there are two groups of people:  Criminals and non-criminal.  Like the world is a children's cartoon with the bad guys and the good guys.

Every criminal was a non-criminal until they committed a crime.

Sure, we could cut down crime a lot if we totally eliminated poverty and social problems in poor communities.  It's not going to happen any time soon and people shouldn't die in the meantime.  And, the NRA and Republican don't want to do anything to help poor black communities anyway.  They want to screw them over more!

Here are a few evident facts:

Guns are a more effective weapon than knives.

Decreasing the access to guns among the general public would make it more difficult to kill/injure people with guns.  

Guns in the hands of the public cause way more crime than they prevent.

You could decrease access to guns with a number of measures.   Gun-buyback programs, registration and licensing programs, mandatory background checks.  Or, what about a 25% excise tax on guns?  If you increase the price of a good, it's going to affect sales.  

Ummm, guns are a distant third in crime instruments behind blunt instruments and bare hands. I don't think people want to ban those.

[ag]

As far as I am concerned, any person carrying a gun is a clear and present danger to my own life and that of my family. Firstly, because s/he has a gun. And, secondly, because wanting to have a gun is likely to be a sign of being a dangerous lunatic in the first place.

And yet you're probably fine with police having INKSing tanks and bazookas.

And you are, probably, fine with New York being nuked, aren't you?