looks like Tsipras has folded (user search)
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  looks like Tsipras has folded (search mode)
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Author Topic: looks like Tsipras has folded  (Read 7723 times)
Vosem
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Posts: 15,637
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« on: July 14, 2015, 12:17:45 PM »

Selling Parthenon hurts exactly nobody. It is an expensive heirloom, that could fetch a good load of cash. You are out of cash. Why not sell it?

You know, I think this is probably one of those 'if you don't get it, there's no way to explain it to you' sorts of things.

I'm pretty sure he grew up in the USSR, then made a career for himself in the West.  probably has a nice portfolio and everything.  such people hold "property rights" sacrosanct above all other rights.  the post-Castro Cuban emigres are horrible too.  I went to college with one -- she was really hot, but both of us saw fate pass us by as I apologized for Castro.

Way to characterize hundreds of thousands of people in five sentences.

National pride, though, is not a human right Smiley

Perhaps not, but it is a fact in most countries around the world, and you must agree that a blow to national pride as severe as selling symbols of the country (like the Parthenon for Greece) would cause would create a much more powerful, and possibly violent, backlash than raising the same amount of money from slightly higher taxes or spending slightly less money on public services, even if a robot might calculate that the people would be better off in the first case. Note that no European leaders have demanded Greece sell off national heirlooms.


There will not be a successful left-wing uprising in Greece in the immediate future. The best you can hope for is the next elections being won by a left-wing SYRIZA breakaway group, though I'm inclined to believe they would turn Tsipras themselves out of fear of the consequences of breaking off of the Eurozone.

I understand that. But there should have been some limit, some point beyond which people started to realize that debt forgiveness would help Greece vastly more than it would hurt Germany, some point at which the insistence on taking the harshest imaginable line gave way to, if nothing else, pity. The fact that this didn't even come close to happening puts one in mind more of the attitudes that people have towards enemy Others than towards European partners, and I'm honestly outright repulsed by the nature and tone of political discourse within Germany. Again, maybe I'm too softhearted.

In the history of interactions between creditors and debtors, even when forgiving debt would help the debtor far more than it would hurt the creditor (as you say), normally the creditor does not forgive the debt, and in fact normally no one even expects him to. Germany is behaving the same way people have behaved basically since the invention of money.
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